General sound problems

In article , J G Miller
wrote:
On Tuesday, May 8th, 2012, at 09:00:26h +0100, Jim Lesurf complained:

e.g. On my current shuttle box, it keeps sending output to the
headphone socket and ignores my external dac, regardless of my using
various methods to tell it (and gstreamer) what I want.

If your configuration is correct and PulseAudio really is not routing
sound the way the configuration states, you really, really should file a
bug report.

Did you ever use set-default-sink in the last section of
/etc/pulse/default.pa

Yes. In fact I tried that again a few days ago. I've also routinely over
the years tried many other methods reported on the web, etc, to try and
'fix' this. Spent an hour or two on it again on a more than one day
recently. (inc. yesterday). For both pulse and gstreamer. No joy.

In contrast a few lines in an .asounrc file fix alsa and give perfect
behaviour.

Hence with some apps like Audacity, VLC, and Audacious, I can tell them to
use alsa, and they promptly work fine. But any apps that use pulse (and
usually gstreamer) and those that give no 'use alsa' choice, fail. Despite
showing they are set to use alsasink, or a specific definition of the
output device as specified in what I have read.

Pulseaudio does have some significant bugs which do need to be fixed,
and in order to get them fixed, they do need to be brought to the
attention of the developers.

Can you tell me the specific way to report a bug?

TBH my impression this isn't a bug as such. I suspect the root problem is
that those developing pulse have zero awareness of users who choose to plug
in a modern high-spec USB DAC after install. Yes, they appear listed in the
options if you use the pulse GUI to set the sink. (Ditto for the various
gconf editors, etc.) So you can select them, or write them into the the
default files, etc. But still doesn't work. FWIW This has been true with
every *buntu distro I've tried since 8.XX.

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
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Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article , J G Miller
wrote:
On Tuesday, May 8th, 2012, at 09:14:20h +0000, J G Miller wrote:

Did you ever use set-default-sink in the last section of
/etc/pulse/default.pa

And the way to configure pulse audio to set up a sync with ALSA for a
particular device in /etc/pulse/default.pa is to change

load-module module-alsa-sink

to

load-module module-alsa-sink
device=hw:{card_number},{device_number}

Further discussion at

http://superuser.com/questions/293131/changing-default-audio-device-in-pulseaudio

I tried that (again) a few days ago. Didn't work. However I'll read the
page you indicate as maybe that will show a wrinkle I've been missing. If
so, I'll give it a try. It would be nice to fix this.

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

On 09 May, wrote:
In article , J G Miller
wrote:


And the way to configure pulse audio to set up a sync with ALSA for a
particular device in /etc/pulse/default.pa is to change

load-module module-alsa-sink

to

load-module module-alsa-sink
device=hw:{card_number},{device_number}

To add to what I just wrote. Here are the last few lines of the current
version of my default.pa file


### Make some devices default
set-default-sink output device=hw:1,0
#set-default-source input

I hand-edited it to that a couple of days ago. (I've also tried putting the
info in different formats.) No success. I've also tried altering the
settings for gstreamer, by hand edit, and using config editors, to point
audio to the USD DAC (hw:1,0 as listed by the alsa commands). No success.
This problem is one I've encountered with every distro I've tried. For one
reason or another, using pulse (or gstreamer) is the kiss of death for
being able to access one of the good USB DACs. I've now tried six different
models of USB DAC. They all work superbly with alsa. None work when pulse
is involved.

I have wondered if pulse is actually incapable of sendind the required
format (24 bit LE packed into 32bit words). But the upshot is that whatever
I do, the apps that use pulse (or gstreamer) stubbornly send output to one
sink of their own choice, not mine.

I have, however, noticed that default.pa isn't explicitly loading module
module-alsa-sink, which you specify, so I'll edit the file and try that.
Maybe the cause is that pulse keeps 'automatically' deciding the module
isn't needed, so banjaxes being able to send to alsa - or even the device
which also uses.

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

On Wed, 09 May 2012 09:50:13 +0100
Jim Lesurf wrote:
settings for gstreamer, by hand edit, and using config editors, to point
audio to the USD DAC (hw:1,0 as listed by the alsa commands). No success.
This problem is one I've encountered with every distro I've tried. For one
reason or another, using pulse (or gstreamer) is the kiss of death for
being able to access one of the good USB DACs. I've now tried six different
models of USB DAC. They all work superbly with alsa. None work when pulse
is involved.

Sending data, audio or otherwise to a USB device isn't the job of the sound
system. Its job is to decode the sound into audio. It sounds like you need a
special USB driver and route to that. (Sorry , no idea what it is).

B2003

On Wednesday, May 9th, 2012, at 09:13:41h +0100, Jim Lesurf wrote:

For both pulse and gstreamer. No joy.

gstreamer is downstream of pulseaudio.


application -- gstreamer -- PulseAudio
-- ALSA
-- esd
-- jack
-- artsd


Always remember to check that your ALSA configuration,
even buried in /usr/share/alsa is not being rerouted
via the configuration file pulse-alsa.conf to PulseAudio
in which case the sound processing is effectively

software -- ALSA library interface -- PulseAudio -- ALSA kernel modules -- hardware

Can you tell me the specific way to report a bug?

There are several routes to do this and it probably helps
to use as many as possible.

Which GNU/Linux distribution are you using?

Report the problem via their bug reporting system.

Debian has a reportbug program which then mails the report
and it gets incorporated into Debians bug tracking system.

Ubuntu uses the Launchpad web interface for all bug reports.

Fedora uses a web interface as well.

And submit a bug report directly to the "product" its-self
which uses Free Desktop's Bugzilla (as used by most GNOME
Desktop applications).

https://bugs.freedesktop.ORG/enter_bug.cgi?product=PulseAudio

So you can select them, or write them into the the
default files, etc. But still doesn't work.

Then you really do need to submit a bug report.

In article ,
wrote:
On Wed, 09 May 2012 09:50:13 +0100 Jim Lesurf
wrote:
settings for gstreamer, by hand edit, and using config editors, to
point audio to the USD DAC (hw:1,0 as listed by the alsa commands). No
success. This problem is one I've encountered with every distro I've
tried. For one reason or another, using pulse (or gstreamer) is the
kiss of death for being able to access one of the good USB DACs. I've
now tried six different models of USB DAC. They all work superbly with
alsa. None work when pulse is involved.

Sending data, audio or otherwise to a USB device isn't the job of the
sound system. Its job is to decode the sound into audio. It sounds like
you need a special USB driver and route to that. (Sorry , no idea what
it is).

Sorry, you are misunderstanding the situation. The DACs in question work
perfectly well with no specific driver and the same OS on the hardware
*provided* I use ALSA for the transfer. They use the standard 'class' of
transfer openly defined for such DACs.

If you don't know anything about Linux systems you may not be aware of the
distinctions between ALSA, PulseAudio, etc. The problem here seems to be
getting Pulse (and GStreamer) to behave as I require.

You may also not realise that the USB DACs in this situation do rather more
than convert digital sample series in analogue. They also take control over
the timing of the data transfers. Again, that works fine using ALSA, but -
so far - not with Pulse or GStreamer.

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

On 09 May, wrote:
In article , J G Miller
wrote:
On Tuesday, May 8th, 2012, at 09:14:20h +0000, J G Miller wrote:

Did you ever use set-default-sink in the last section of
/etc/pulse/default.pa

And the way to configure pulse audio to set up a sync with ALSA for a
particular device in /etc/pulse/default.pa is to change

load-module module-alsa-sink

to

load-module module-alsa-sink
device=hw:{card_number},{device_number}

Further discussion at

http://superuser.com/questions/293131/changing-default-audio-device-in-pulseaudio

I tried that (again) a few days ago. Didn't work. However I'll read the
page you indicate as maybe that will show a wrinkle I've been missing.
If so, I'll give it a try. It would be nice to fix this.

Mix of good and bad news to update/correct that.

I looked at the page and realised that I'd not read the above carefully
enough and made a mistake.

IIRC The above should mean *uncommenting* the

#load-module

line and adding the explicit device details (hw:1.0 in this case). Whereas
I'd been trying to specify this on the line I quoted earlier at the end of
the configuration file. Thar looked good as it meant I could try this and
maybe I'd been using the wrong approach.

However I've now tried uncommenting and specifying the device - which I
presume means the module is now loaded and told where the sink should be.

Bad news is that it still doesn't work. Parole still insists on sending
audio to the headphone socket. As before, VLC, Audacious, and Audacity all
happily send output to the specified alsa default - i.e. to the USB DAC.
But do so because each lets you tell the *application* to send to ALSA,
bypassing pulse and/or gstreamer.

So, as ever, apps that send direct to alsa work fine and alsa then sends
out to the DAC. But pulse/gstreamer don't take any notice of any settings I
try and specify. They behave as if the only possible outlet is the
headphone socket.

Having done the above I have the recollection that I've tried this in past
years, with no success from apps that refuse to let you have them send
direct. Can't recall anything that worked in a controlled way I can define
that involves Pulse.

However it may be that the above *is* correct so far as Pulse is concerned,
and the problem is GStreamer. More about that in another posting.

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article , J G Miller
wrote:
On Wednesday, May 9th, 2012, at 09:13:41h +0100, Jim Lesurf wrote:

For both pulse and gstreamer. No joy.

gstreamer is downstream of pulseaudio.


application -- gstreamer -- PulseAudio -- ALSA

Isn't that gstreamer being *upstream* of pulse?

Always remember to check that your ALSA configuration, even buried in
/usr/share/alsa is not being rerouted via the configuration file
pulse-alsa.conf to PulseAudio in which case the sound processing is
effectively

FWIW I always now use a .asoundrc file in my user directory to define the
default settings and clear or override others. This always seem to work
fine when I play using any command or app that can send to the alsa
default. When measured it gives sample-by-sample bit perfect results.


software -- ALSA library interface -- PulseAudio -- ALSA kernel
modules -- hardware

Can you tell me the specific way to report a bug?

There are several routes to do this and it probably helps to use as many
as possible.

Which GNU/Linux distribution are you using?

For this machine Xubuntu 11.10. Other machines use either an eariler
Xubuntu or Crunchbang.

One of the reasons I've hesitated to bug report is that I'm far from clear
what is wrong, or where any bug resides. Maybe it is in GStreamer. Or that
I've never *symultaneously* had the correct settings for both GStreamer
*and* Pulse.

FWIW I've been experimenting with using both the gconf editor and
hand-editing files to fiddle with GStreamer. Tried various settings. But as
reported, not success. Results always the same. Parole won't do as I want,
but Audacious, etc, are happy to work as I specify using alsa. Parole gives
no indication of being able to be told 'use alsa'. (had much the same
problem with Totem in the past.)

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

On Wed, 09 May 2012 13:59:50 +0100
Jim Lesurf wrote:
If you don't know anything about Linux systems you may not be aware of the
distinctions between ALSA, PulseAudio, etc. The problem here seems to be
getting Pulse (and GStreamer) to behave as I require.

Fair enough. I know OSS which was very easy to use - just write direct to
/dev/audio or /dev/dsp which is the unix way of doing it but it seems linux
has got through more sound architectures than hot dinners and none seem to work
100% correctly.

B2003

In article ,
wrote:
On Wed, 09 May 2012 13:59:50 +0100 Jim Lesurf
wrote:
If you don't know anything about Linux systems you may not be aware of
the distinctions between ALSA, PulseAudio, etc. The problem here seems
to be getting Pulse (and GStreamer) to behave as I require.

Fair enough. I know OSS which was very easy to use - just write direct
to /dev/audio or /dev/dsp which is the unix way of doing it but it
seems linux has got through more sound architectures than hot dinners
and none seem to work 100% correctly.

In fairness, I guess we should accept that people have different
requirements and various hardware, etc. So it seems unlikely that one
method will suit everyone.

I can only report what I find. This is that I found it easy enough to get
alsa working when using programs/commands that play out via alsa. But that
ones which depend on Pulse or GStreamer I've found refuse to do what I want
- as distinct from what the install *assumed* I'd want. This has been the
case for three different machines, using a variety of distros.

My guess is that this is because Pulse wants to try and be 'helpful' and
automate things without the user having to worry about hand editing config
files. As such, a worth aim. And it may work OK for all I know in most
cases where people just use the soundcard in their machine at install time.

But it doesn't work for me as soon as I try to use a USB DAC. And I've
found no way over more than three years to get it to work. Whereas with
alsa I just add a short .asoundrc file to my home directory, and it works.
Every time.

BTW I've now tried what JGM suggested and in accord with the webpage he
referenced. No success. I also then tried altering the GStreamer settings.
No success. So I'll do as in the past. Give up on Pulse and remain happy
with alsa.

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html