Could well be off topic: better tea

In article o.uk,
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Tue, 04 Aug 2009 15:10:31 +0100, Jim Lesurf wrote:

Although I found instant coffee also has its snags at 14,000ft asl. If
you try to open a 'vacuum packed' jar, when you pierce the paper cover
you get a fountain of coffee granules. :-) What counts for such packs
as 'vacuum' at sea level seems more like a distinct overpressure at the
top of a volcano.

If I take an empty water bottle to work if I've put the lid on tight it
will be a partly squished bottle at sea level, conversly coming up there
will be a little hiss when opened.

I also discovered that it was entertaining to take the top of a new tube of
toothpaste at 14,000ft. Water may be 'incompressible', but I'd forgotten
that tubes of toothpaste usually contain at least one internal air bubble.
When you remove the cap the toothpaste comes squidging out.

We are only at 1400' as well about 50mB lower pressure than sea
level. At 14,000' you have about half normal atmospheric pressure.

IIRC the pressure was around 2/3rd that at sea level. I did have a photo
somewhere of one of the UKIRT[1] technicians holding a 'vacuum gauge' open
to air and showing this. Not sure where it is now. I'll see if I can find
it. But I'm talking about around 25 years ago, so no idea if it is still
around!

I also recall that when the telescope officially opened we had piper from
the Black Watch come and play the bagpipes. This is quite a feat at such
air pressures. Something of an 'iron man' to do it without fainting.

Now I'm rambling about this I can recall that in one period of a week there
we had a number of earhquakes big enough to break the shear pin for the
telescope mounts. When this happens you jack up the telescope, move it back
and put in a new pin. However at one point the same technician was
frantically making up new pins as we'd run out! :-)

Slainte,

Jim

[1] UKIRT = United Kingdom Infra-Red Telescope.

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In article o.uk,
says...

On Tue, 04 Aug 2009 15:10:31 +0100, Jim Lesurf wrote:

Although I found instant coffee also has its snags at 14,000ft asl. If
you try to open a 'vacuum packed' jar, when you pierce the paper cover
you get a fountain of coffee granules. :-) What counts for such packs
as 'vacuum' at sea level seems more like a distinct overpressure at the
top of a volcano.

Jars are generally not vacum packed just sealed. The seal does tend
to bulge out up here compared to normally being inward at lower
altitudes.

Most jars are filled with hot contents - jam, for example - which
creates a partial vacuum when it cools and contracts. This is what pulls
the anti-tamper part of the lid in.

This doesn't, of course, apply to products like instant coffee which are
packed cold but, because of the (relatively) large amount of air in the
jar, the 'vacuum packing' method was probably developed a precaution
against expansion with increasing temperature, rather than a advertising
device.

I would suggest that anybody who wants to take one up to 14,000ft should
break the seal at ground level ...

--

Terry

In article , Terry
Casey
wrote:


I would suggest that anybody who wants to take one up to 14,000ft should
break the seal at ground level ...

I can testify that experimental results support your hypothesis here. :-)

....unless of course you *like* having your face covered with coffee
granules. :-)

Slainte,

Jim

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"The Old Man" wrote in message
...


She had the biggest bush this side of Epping Forest and goosgogs the size
of apples,

Bill!

Another thing I could have mentioned, is:
Milk in first, or not?
I'd say with both tea and coffee, milk in first. This has the
disadvantage that you have to guess the amount of milk correctly,
which of course takes practice, but it tastes better.

Does it really make any difference? After all if you mix two liquids
at differing temperatures, they will end up at the same intermediate
temperature in whichever order they are added, so it's tempting just
to say: "It makes no difference!", and leave it at that.

In fact, that's exactly what I used to say, and always used to put the
milk in second, because then it's easier to get the amount right. Then
one day, after a scolding from my mother, I tried putting the milk in
first, and was surprised to find I could taste the difference.

So how can it make any difference? The answer is that, though it is
certainly true that the final intermediate temperature is the same,
you have to look at what happens before it is reached. The crucial
point being that if milk is held at a high temperature, it cooks, and
therefore tastes different.

Therefore, if you put the tea in first and then add the milk, the
intermediate temperature is approached from above, and this cooks a
high proportion of the milk, whereas if you add the tea to the milk,
the intermediate temperature is approached from below, and a much
smaller proportion of the milk is cooked. Hence, the latter method
tastes better.

One of the reasons why teabags tend to produce less good tea is that
you have to add the milk to the tea.

On Tue, 04 Aug 2009 14:42:55 +0100, Java Jive
wrote:

Tea bags tend to produce the least drinkable tea, I have no doubt
about that. Their only advantage is convenience. It's a similar
question between real and instant coffee, only there the difference is
more pronounced, and the price differential is the other way.

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Java Jive said the following on 05/08/2009 22:08:
Another thing I could have mentioned, is:
Milk in first, or not?
I'd say with both tea and coffee, milk in first. This has the
disadvantage that you have to guess the amount of milk correctly,
which of course takes practice, but it tastes better.

Does it really make any difference? After all if you mix two liquids
at differing temperatures, they will end up at the same intermediate
temperature in whichever order they are added, so it's tempting just
to say: "It makes no difference!", and leave it at that.

Osmosis anyone?

Studying for A-Levels at what we'd now call a 6th Form College in SE
London, I was lucky enough to be taught by some very gifted teachers,
one of whom was a dour, sarcastic Glaswegian who specialised in
humorously elaborate deadpan insults. One day he stopped in the
middle of his discourse and said:

"I cannae understand this class, at all. Ye take nae notes
whatsae-ever! Ye just sit there like ventriloquists dummies gawping
at what I'm writing on the board, as though ye expect that, by some
magical osmotic process, information will filter its way through from
ma brain intae yer thick skulls!"

After a minute or so's laughter, pens and paper were suddenly very
much in evidence.

On Wed, 05 Aug 2009 22:20:56 +0100, Richard Brooks
wrote:

Osmosis anyone?

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"Richard Brooks" wrote in message
...
Java Jive said the following on 05/08/2009 22:08:
Another thing I could have mentioned, is:
Milk in first, or not?
I'd say with both tea and coffee, milk in first. This has the
disadvantage that you have to guess the amount of milk correctly,
which of course takes practice, but it tastes better.

Does it really make any difference? After all if you mix two liquids
at differing temperatures, they will end up at the same intermediate
temperature in whichever order they are added, so it's tempting just
to say: "It makes no difference!", and leave it at that.

Osmosis anyone?

Where's the semi-permeable membrane?

--
Max Demian

Max Demian said the following on 05/08/2009 23:01:
"Richard Brooks" wrote in message
...
Java Jive said the following on 05/08/2009 22:08:
Does it really make any difference? After all if you mix two liquids
at differing temperatures, they will end up at the same intermediate
temperature in whichever order they are added, so it's tempting just
to say: "It makes no difference!", and leave it at that.
Osmosis anyone?

Where's the semi-permeable membrane?

If you've only got hot water in a cup you could have a problem.

Richard Brooks wrote:
Bill Wright said the following on 02/08/2009 03:55:

If you have to make two cups or mugs of tea, get one 'one cup' teabag
and hold it in a spoon. Make a small hole in the middle of the top
surface of the bag. Pour the boiling water slowly onto the teabag
(which is still on the spoon) putting about half a cupful into each
cup, then do it again so you have gone cup 1, cup 2, cup 1, cup 2. You
have to pour slowly so the water goes into the bag and doesn't just
flow over its surface. The hole helps air escape from the bag. The
results are wonderful. The tea tastes much fresher than normal,
without being weak, and there is a doubling of economy.

Bill


Don't forget, they make special cupboards for drying them out too! I
saw one once on Morcambe and Wise.

Our Mechanical Workshop Technician in Broadcasting House used to have a
"tea swindle"
He dried out the used teabags on the radiators before re-use!!

Mike