Fancy Mains Cables

In message , Ian Jackson
writes

Despite the bogosity of their claims, I have always found Russ Andrews
shops to be very helpful, even advising against expensive products in
favour of cheaper ones. Maybe the shop staff have more integrity than
their employer.

In any high-class establishment selling top-of-the-range products to
discerning clientele, I would expect the staff to be more attentive
than (say) a Pound Shop. [In earlier times, I would have said
Woolworths.]
Mmm, if I thought I was in line for a juicy wodge of commission for
selling some muppet six grand's worth of kit, then yes, I'd be bloody
attentive, I might even persuade them that they would be better off with
something costing a little less if I was certain they'd mistake it for
honesty and integrity.
--
Clint Sharp

Ian Jackson wrote:
In message ,
Kellerman "kellerman writes
charles wrote:
In article ,
R. Mark Clayton wrote:
I was thinking of getting some new gear, as the current cycle of TV
improvements has just about stabilised, so in April I bought a copy
of What Hi-Fi Sound & Vision magazine.

It might have been April the first as it contained an article about
mains leads costing scores if not hundreds of pounds: -


http://www.whathifi.com/Reviews/Acce...s-products-Rev
iews/Price/

for example "Levels of detail, dynamics and clarity of sound are
improved upon tenfold." [by one particular lead at £232].

On three of them you could actually identify the MK plugtop (OK they
cost a few pence more), but some Hi_fi buffs must be extremely
gullible* to fall for this kind of guff!
I've just cancelled my subscription to BBC Music Magazine (after 17
yeas)
when it ssid you should spend at least 25% of your hi-fi budget on
leads.

Oh Yes!
There is more twaddle uttered about cables than ANY other hi-fi item.
If you think this is bad get the so called reviewers or experts going
on speaker cables.
Many years ago I did some crude tests on cable and ended up using
orange mains cable, the 10A 2-core type used for garden equipment.
I could not tell the difference between fancy cables and the orange
mains cable.
What I could tell was that if I used thin, low current bell wire
(rated at about 1A or so) the speakers sounded "odd". With the 10A
rated orange cable they sounded OK.
I had a big row with an ex-colleague over speaker cable, he was
convinced that the silver ptfe insulated stuff at some horrendous
price was better than orange mains cable. Wouldn't agree to a blind
test though.
Dave

Was this just because the higher resistance of the wire meant that the
speakers weren't as well-damped by the low output impedance of the
amplifiers?
It was more likely that the extra impedance of the speaker leads had an
effect on the crossover in the speakers or the impedance of the leads
made up a high pass filter with the output DC blocking capacitor in the
not very sophisticated amplifier I had at the time. It was many, many
years ago. The system was considered "good" at the time.
I'm afraid that I can't remember exactly which amp this was, a Nikkai of
some sort I think, when they made decent amps.
It was years before I could afford a proper DC coupled amplifier and
proper speakers. [1] [2] [3]
Now the amp needed decent speaker cable, again the orange garden cable
was used. It sounded fine so I didn't bother with any tests.

[1] kef Chorale 3's - still got them but I've not used them for a while.

[2] The record deck started out as a Garrard SP25 Mk? and then became a
Pioneer PL12D. Can't remember exactly which cartridge that had. It was
sold via the classified ads years and years and years ago.

[3] This was a second hand Cambridge Audio P60, long since since sold to
a friend.
Dave
--
Blow my nose to email me

In article ,
Kellerman kellerman snot wrote:
Was this just because the higher resistance of the wire meant that the
speakers weren't as well-damped by the low output impedance of the
amplifiers?
It was more likely that the extra impedance of the speaker leads had an
effect on the crossover in the speakers or the impedance of the leads
made up a high pass filter with the output DC blocking capacitor in the
not very sophisticated amplifier I had at the time. It was many, many
years ago. The system was considered "good" at the time.

The handbook for the Quad valve amps of the '50s suggested that the loop
resistance of speaker cable used shouldn't exceed 5% of the nominal
speaker impedance, IIRC.

In practice, a 2.5mm² flat twin speaker cable will be fine for most
domestic applications without being too large to conceal, fit the
terminals or break the budget.

--
*Rehab is for quitters

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Tue, 12 May 2009 16:23:00 +0100, Kellerman "kellerman snot
wrote:

tony sayer wrote:

snip

Skinflint!..

What you need is a balanced mains tranny, around 2 and a half grand to
you guv;!..


Might have to copy 'n paste these..


http://www.russandrews.com/product.a...currency=GBP&p
f_id=1190&customer_id=PAA0959052309572THFCSOVZTKUS COFZ


Then a couple of power leads the two meter long ones a snip at £6000 yes
over Six grand each;!!!!


http://www.russandrews.com/product.a...currency=GBP&p
f_id=1549&customer_id=PAA0959052309572THFCSOVZTKUS COFZ

What the fffffffffffffffffffffu!
Who the hell is he trying to kid! Lower noise floor my ar**!
The only way that unit would lower any floor is by being so heavy it
bends the whole floor down.
Has anyone had a little chat with Trading Standards over these claims?
To be valid they would need to be properly peer reviewed, published in a
reputable magazine and be able to stand up to proper scientific,
repeatable experiments.
Dave

They don't seem to be claims - they are stated as opinions - I don't
think trading standards police opinions
--
Cheers

Peter

Some are, happily for Russ Andrews and other crooked ******s of his
type.

Despite the bogosity of their claims, I have always found Russ Andrews
shops to be very helpful, even advising against expensive products in
favour of cheaper ones. Maybe the shop staff have more integrity than
their employer.

-- Richard
--
Please remember to mention me / in tapes you leave behind.

I didn't know he still had any shops. I'm reluctant to admit I had even
visited his website :-)
However, according to his biography
http://www.russandrews.com/article-A...RA_history.htm

"Russ had a serious car accident that left him with shoulder and head
injuries."
[and the very next paragraph reads]
"A misunderstanding during a conversation with Michael Lewin (of Grahams
Hi-Fi)
led to Russ's discovery of cable directionality.
His curiosity also led him to discover that improving the contacts on
standard mains
blocks brought clearly audible improvements in sound quality."

Mmm.


--
Graham.

%Profound_observation%

On Wed, 13 May 2009 00:24:15 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:


The handbook for the Quad valve amps of the '50s suggested that the loop
resistance of speaker cable used shouldn't exceed 5% of the nominal
speaker impedance, IIRC.

From: Instruction Book, Quad 22 Control Unit and Quad II Power
Amplifier:

When the loudspeaker leads are reasonably short, thin flex may be
used, but if longer runs are employed then the cable should be
sufficient thick for its resistance not to exceed 10% of the
loudspeaker impedance.

I am currently listening to the Eurovision Song Contest using speakers
driven by a pair of Quad II amps.

Peter Duncanson wrote:

I am currently listening to the Eurovision Song Contest using speakers
driven by a pair of Quad II amps.

I do sympathise, but what can I do?

Can't you reach the off switch?

In message , Peter Duncanson
wrote


I am currently listening to the Eurovision Song Contest using speakers
driven by a pair of Quad II amps.


Don't you then require high resistance cable in order to get a near 100
percent attenuation?

--
Alan
news2006 {at} amac {dot} f2s {dot} com

On Sat, 16 May 2009 20:49:02 +0100, "Norman Wells"
wrote:

Peter Duncanson wrote:

I am currently listening to the Eurovision Song Contest using speakers
driven by a pair of Quad II amps.

I do sympathise, but what can I do?

Can't you reach the off switch?

Yes, but how can I criticise it properly if I haven't watched it?

On Sat, 16 May 2009 20:54:43 +0100, Alan
wrote:

In message , Peter Duncanson
wrote


I am currently listening to the Eurovision Song Contest using speakers
driven by a pair of Quad II amps.


Don't you then require high resistance cable in order to get a near 100
percent attenuation?

I'm in a different room watching the "mechanics" working on the Hubble
Space Telescope. (Soon to finish for the day.)
http://www.nasa.gov/55644main_NASATV_Windows.asx