Fancy Mains Cables

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "R. Mark Clayton"
saying something like:

On three of them you could actually identify the MK plugtop (OK they cost a
few pence more), but some Hi_fi buffs must be extremely gullible* to fall
for this kind of guff!

Some are, happily for Russ Andrews and other crooked ******s of his
type.

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "Norman Wells"
saying something like:

The James Randi Educational Foundation two or three years ago offered a
million dollar prize to anyone who could prove that expensive speaker leads
improved the sound quality. As far as I'm aware, it was never won.

Maybe a dowser should try for it.

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember Laurence Payne
saying something like:

What I do find sad is the assumption in Currys etc. that having bought
a cheap, competent e.g. DVD player you'll spend as much again on
"interconnects".

http://www.laurencepayne.co.uk/cables.html

What a fix.

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember Ian
saying something like:

He also says that his sound system sounds better at certain times of the
day, because the electricity is purer. LOL

If he lived next to a welding shop or a milking parlour on the end of a
rural line, it's certainly possible. I know that to be true.
Most of the time, in an urban environment, it's not that much of a
factor.

The sad part is that often these people become convinced they are right and
the rest of the world is wrong.

I'm sure you could make stuff sound really crap with badly made cables, but
with the state of the art at present its highly unlikely you could get them
bad enough.

Brian

--
Brian Gaff -
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
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"Grimly Curmudgeon" wrote in message
news
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "R. Mark Clayton"
saying something like:

On three of them you could actually identify the MK plugtop (OK they cost
a
few pence more), but some Hi_fi buffs must be extremely gullible* to fall
for this kind of guff!

Some are, happily for Russ Andrews and other crooked ******s of his
type.

"Brian Gaff" wrote in message
om...
The sad part is that often these people become convinced they are right
and the rest of the world is wrong.

I'm sure you could make stuff sound really crap with badly made cables,
but with the state of the art at present its highly unlikely you could get
them bad enough.


When I had ISDN, I could see that it managed full duplex 144kbps for months
at a time over miles of pitifully thin, partially submerged, often corroded
or alloy cable connected through several rubbish joints to the exchange and
without dropping a single bit...

Not quite so good at 8Mbps ADSL, maybe a frame or two a week need to be
retransmitted.

The equivalent analog connection was rubbish.

Turning to Hi-Fi

Aerial Aerial leads should be well screened and good quality (e.g.
CT100). Long runs should use thicker cable (e.g. CT125) to counter signal
loss. We are still talking pence per metre. Maplin sell cut lengths or
most electirical factors sell 100m reels cheap.

Analog Almost any screened cable will do except perhaps for a vinyl deck
where the signal levels are low and you could pick up external signals etc.
Pound shops sell them.

Scart Most cables OK for short runs, however for longer runs with RGB
they need to be fully screened to prevent cross coupling between the
colours. Cheap from Maplin etc.

Digital Just about anything will do - includes HDMI. Either the signal
gets there or it doesn't. It is fairly easy to tell the difference!

Optical Just about anything will do. My DAT player worked fine with the
plug of the optical "cable" held 2cm away from the socket. Some pounds
shops sell them.

Speaker There is a slight argument for thicker cables, but a 4 Ohm
speaker outputing 100W will only be drawing 5A. Multi stranded cables are
more flexible, but even 1mm mains cable perfectly adequate.


Things that don't matter: -

Silver wires Minute and utterly irrelavant reduction in resistance. OTOH
if anyone knows where I can buy some cheap silver gilt meat skewers please
let me know.

Gold connectors Irrelevant for fixed used, where the connection is made
once and left connected. Some utility for professional use where equipment
is plugged and unplugged all the time - e.g. my Sony microphone has a gold
plated jack or a guitar lead.

Posh digital connectors The whole point of digital is that the data and
timing are recovered from the digital signal at the other end. As long ago
as 1975 one could have a phone conversation with someone in Australia that
sounded better than a call next door. This was because for all but a few km
of the ~20Mm to the other side of the world the signal was digital. Any bit
of wire that can deliver a ~1V digital signal a few feet is going to manage
to pass data without loss.


Brian

On Mon, 11 May 2009 10:41:42 +0100, "R. Mark Clayton"
wrote:


"Brian Gaff" wrote in message
. com...
The sad part is that often these people become convinced they are right
and the rest of the world is wrong.

I'm sure you could make stuff sound really crap with badly made cables,
but with the state of the art at present its highly unlikely you could get
them bad enough.


When I had ISDN, I could see that it managed full duplex 144kbps for months
at a time over miles of pitifully thin, partially submerged, often corroded
or alloy cable connected through several rubbish joints to the exchange and
without dropping a single bit...

Not quite so good at 8Mbps ADSL, maybe a frame or two a week need to be
retransmitted.

The equivalent analog connection was rubbish.

Turning to Hi-Fi

Aerial Aerial leads should be well screened and good quality (e.g.
CT100). Long runs should use thicker cable (e.g. CT125) to counter signal
loss. We are still talking pence per metre. Maplin sell cut lengths or
most electirical factors sell 100m reels cheap.

Analog Almost any screened cable will do except perhaps for a vinyl deck
where the signal levels are low and you could pick up external signals etc.
Pound shops sell them.

Scart Most cables OK for short runs, however for longer runs with RGB
they need to be fully screened to prevent cross coupling between the
colours. Cheap from Maplin etc.

Digital Just about anything will do - includes HDMI. Either the signal
gets there or it doesn't. It is fairly easy to tell the difference!

Optical Just about anything will do. My DAT player worked fine with the
plug of the optical "cable" held 2cm away from the socket. Some pounds
shops sell them.

Speaker There is a slight argument for thicker cables, but a 4 Ohm
speaker outputing 100W will only be drawing 5A. Multi stranded cables are
more flexible, but even 1mm mains cable perfectly adequate.


Things that don't matter: -

Silver wires Minute and utterly irrelavant reduction in resistance. OTOH
if anyone knows where I can buy some cheap silver gilt meat skewers please
let me know.

Gold connectors Irrelevant for fixed used, where the connection is made
once and left connected. Some utility for professional use where equipment
is plugged and unplugged all the time - e.g. my Sony microphone has a gold
plated jack or a guitar lead.

Posh digital connectors The whole point of digital is that the data and
timing are recovered from the digital signal at the other end. As long ago
as 1975 one could have a phone conversation with someone in Australia that
sounded better than a call next door. This was because for all but a few km
of the ~20Mm to the other side of the world the signal was digital. Any bit
of wire that can deliver a ~1V digital signal a few feet is going to manage
to pass data without loss.


Brian



Excellent summary, however i doubt you would manage to get it printed
in a hi-fi magazine :-)
--
Cheers

Peter

"Norman Wells" wrote in message ...
charles wrote:
In article ,
R. Mark Clayton wrote:
I was thinking of getting some new gear, as the current cycle of TV
improvements has just about stabilised, so in April I bought a copy
of What Hi-Fi Sound & Vision magazine.

It might have been April the first as it contained an article about
mains leads costing scores if not hundreds of pounds: -

http://www.whathifi.com/Reviews/Acce...Reviews/Price/

for example "Levels of detail, dynamics and clarity of sound are
improved upon tenfold." [by one particular lead at £232].

On three of them you could actually identify the MK plugtop (OK they
cost a few pence more), but some Hi_fi buffs must be extremely
gullible* to fall for this kind of guff!

I've just cancelled my subscription to BBC Music Magazine (after 17
yeas) when it ssid you should spend at least 25% of your hi-fi budget
on leads.

The James Randi Educational Foundation two or three years ago offered a
million dollar prize to anyone who could prove that expensive speaker leads
improved the sound quality. As far as I'm aware, it was never won.


What price levels did they have in mind?
I can clearly hear the difference between 20p a metre cable and £3 a metre cable but when you go much above this I'm not convinced at all - especially by the wild claims of vast differences that are so often made

--
Alex

"I laugh in the face of danger , then I hide until it goes away"

In article , R. Mark Clayton
wrote:

Gold connectors Irrelevant for fixed used, where the connection is
made once and left connected.

but I remember reading in a HiFi magazine that Gold Plated mains connectors
improved the stereo image. You must be wrong ;-)

--
From KT24 - in "Leafy Surrey"

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.11

In article , R. Mark Clayton
wrote:
Almost any screened cable will do except perhaps for a vinyl deck
where the signal levels are low and you could pick up external signals
etc. Pound shops sell them.

With most pickups - apart from low impedance moving coil - you also need
the correct capacitance to load the cartridge properly. It's one of the
few cases where you will hear a difference with unsuitable cable.

--
*A 'jiffy' is an actual unit of time for 1/100th of a second.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.