SKYBUY - do they break EU law?

Joseph Szadai wrote:

They do not discriminate the sale based on geography.

I think that you will find that they do. Sky will not sell anything
outside of the UK and ROI.


They discriminate the bonus they connect to the sale geographically
that is illegal.

They do indeed discriminate by geographical location in applying the
discount but this is not illegal under EU or UK law. It should be but
it isn't.

--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/tez5
How to get UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
Fed up with logos / red buttons? : http://logofreetv.org/
BBC gone? : http://www.astra2d.co.uk/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-)

Joseph Szadai wrote:

The Terms and conditions on www.sky.com/skybuy do NOT say that
they do not sell plasma TV outside UK.

Indeed. But there is no requirement under UK law for them to say so.
UK law gives businesses the right to sell what they want to whoever
they want, or not, as the case may be. They cannot refuse to sell to
someone because they are black. They can however refuse to sell to
someone because they live in Cardiff or in Moscow, or even because
they just think the person is a prat. They can even charge people
extra just for being a prat or for living in Cardiff. But they can't
charge people extra for being foreign or black or gay or old or a
woman, or indeed all of the above.


If the Terms and Conditions they declared themselves do not say dat
(which is the case) refusing outside UK requests is againts the law.

On the contrary, UK businesses in general have no obligation to sell
anything to anyone at all, either inside or outside Britain. This is
wrong and should be changed but it is the law as it stands.

--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/tez5
How to get UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
Fed up with logos / red buttons? : http://logofreetv.org/
BBC gone? : http://www.astra2d.co.uk/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-)

"Jomtien" wrote in message
...

If the Terms and Conditions they declared themselves do not say dat
(which is the case) refusing outside UK requests is againts the law.

On the contrary, UK businesses in general have no obligation to sell
anything to anyone at all, either inside or outside Britain. This is
wrong and should be changed but it is the law as it stands.

As a matter of interest why do you think it is wrong?
Why should a UK (or any other) business have an obligation to sell something?
Is it purely because they can be accused of discrimination?

Loz

"loz" ) writes:
"Joseph Szadai" wrote in message
...
They do not discriminate the sale based on geography.
They discriminate the bonus they connect to the sale geographically
that is illegal.
end debate.

OK, so your are convinced.
What you going to do about it?
Moan in newsgroups?

Loz




Since SKY subscription is also agains the EU directive of free movement
of services, no ona can do anything. Just noted.

"Rob" ) writes:
Joseph Szadai wrote:
Do not tell me it is completely legal. At least if they do not say
in terms and conditions that they do not sell outside UK, they can
refuse requests outside UK.
Joe

Just because it is advertised don't mean that they HAVE to sell it to you.
Some on-line store made a mess of its prices a couple of years back and
offered TVs or PC for virtually nothing - they didn't HAVE to sell them at
those prices - they were able to just refuse to sell them.




Hey, we are talking about different things. If I am a TV seller
and sell TV in the UK, I can not say: Hey, you are UK resident
so you get 20 % discount from me. Oh, you are not UK resident?
You have to pay the full price...
Interesting isn't it?

loz wrote:

On the contrary, UK businesses in general have no obligation to sell
anything to anyone at all, either inside or outside Britain. This is
wrong and should be changed but it is the law as it stands.

As a matter of interest why do you think it is wrong?
Why should a UK (or any other) business have an obligation to sell something?
Is it purely because they can be accused of discrimination?

Some EU countries take the attitude that an advert (poster, TV, price
sticker in shop) is a open contract with the purchaser. I agree. I
also fail to see why any business should be allowed to be picky about
where or to whom they sell. An offer of sale is an offer of sale.
Anyone with the list price in his pocket should be able to buy.

It's up to the company to get its list prices right, and to arrange
and charge a fair price for suitable delivery as needed, except when
delivery is not possible for physical reasons, of course, or when they
don't deliver at all. EU residents live in a single market now and
companies must be obliged to treat the entire EU as one area, unless
they don't trade at a distance at all and only do counter sales.

--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/tez5
How to get UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
Fed up with logos / red buttons? : http://logofreetv.org/
BBC gone? : http://www.astra2d.co.uk/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-)

In article ,
(Joseph Szadai) wrote:

Since SKY subscription is also agains the EU directive of free movement
of services

No it isn't - as the Commission has made clear on a number of occasions in
writing..

"Jomtien" wrote in message
...

As a matter of interest why do you think it is wrong?
Why should a UK (or any other) business have an obligation to sell something?
Is it purely because they can be accused of discrimination?

Some EU countries take the attitude that an advert (poster, TV, price
sticker in shop) is a open contract with the purchaser. I agree. I
also fail to see why any business should be allowed to be picky about
where or to whom they sell. An offer of sale is an offer of sale.
Anyone with the list price in his pocket should be able to buy.

Obviously they lay themselves open to acusations of discrimination, but I still
don't see why a business shouldn't be allowed to be picky on any other grounds.
Having said that, I am not sure what those other grounds are

It's up to the company to get its list prices right, and to arrange
and charge a fair price for suitable delivery as needed, except when
delivery is not possible for physical reasons, of course, or when they
don't deliver at all. EU residents live in a single market now and
companies must be obliged to treat the entire EU as one area, unless
they don't trade at a distance at all and only do counter sales.

However, don't other laws or treaties override this - as in Sky's broadcasting
business?

Loz

Do not tell me it is completely legal. At least if they do not say
in terms and conditions that they do not sell outside UK, they can
refuse requests outside UK.

Just because it is advertised don't mean that they HAVE to sell it
to you. Some on-line store made a mess of its prices a couple of
years back and offered TVs or PC for virtually nothing - they didn't
HAVE to sell them at those prices - they were able to just refuse to
sell them.

Hey, we are talking about different things. If I am a TV seller
and sell TV in the UK, I can not say: Hey, you are UK resident
so you get 20 % discount from me. Oh, you are not UK resident?
You have to pay the full price...
Interesting isn't it?

I went back to the Sky web site to see what the fuss was all about.
I assume we are talking about "Sky's Ultimate Home Entertainment System"

I read through the pages and I cannot find ANYWHERE that it says the you get
a discount on the TV for living in the UK.

If you buy a SKY+ box and subscription to go with your TV then you get a
"discount" (cash back) on that as part of a deal for having bought the TV.

Are you saying they won't SELL you the TV for being outside the UK. (Note
that it says that they have to install it - and maybe only have a contract
with a UK firm), this is covered by what I said before.

Or are you saying that they won't give you a DISCOUNT on the TV for being
outside the UK. In which case I must be looking at completely the wrong
offer.

Again, if they are really treating you illegally - take 'em to court.

rnet[dot]co[dot]uk (Simon Gardner) wrote:

Since SKY subscription is also agains the EU directive of free movement
of services

No it isn't - as the Commission has made clear on a number of occasions in
writing..

It certainly is contrary to both the spirit and the letter of the
principle of freedom of movement of goods and services. The EU haven't
said that it isn't, they have just said that they won't do anything
about it. Presumably because they are well lobbied (greased) to do so.

--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/tez5
How to get UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
Fed up with logos / red buttons? : http://logofreetv.org/
BBC gone? : http://www.astra2d.co.uk/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-)