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Green screen again (Humax PVR)



 
 
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  #21  
Old October 31st 18, 10:41 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
alan_m
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Posts: 203
Default Best PVR?

On 31/10/2018 09:33, PeterC wrote:

The description might be better than the timing, as times are changed. Often
the schedule will adjust for these, although the Beeb suddenly changing from
BBC 1 to BBC 2, for examlpe, isn't linked - I've missed something that I've
wanted and ended up with a few hours of talking heads waffling on about
nothing happening!


Series linking using the CRID data may also fail when programs change
channel at the last moment, It depends on how often the particular box
checks the EPG to see if a program matches the search criteria.


--
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  #22  
Old October 31st 18, 11:14 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
NY
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Default Best PVR?

"alan_m" wrote in message
...
On 31/10/2018 09:33, PeterC wrote:

The description might be better than the timing, as times are changed.
Often
the schedule will adjust for these, although the Beeb suddenly changing
from
BBC 1 to BBC 2, for examlpe, isn't linked - I've missed something that
I've
wanted and ended up with a few hours of talking heads waffling on about
nothing happening!


Series linking using the CRID data may also fail when programs change
channel at the last moment, It depends on how often the particular box
checks the EPG to see if a program matches the search criteria.


It also depends how often the EPG is updated by the broadcaster. Out of
interest, I looked at the over-the-air EPG (using VLC and a USB DVB decoder)
when BBC were playing pass-the-parcel with programmes during Wimbledon, and
almost always even after a programme had been bounced from one channel to
another or replaced with another programme, the EPG on the BBCA (*)
multiplex was still listing what was originally planned.

Software PVRs such as NextPVR and TVHeadend tend to update the EPG only once
a day (though the time and frequency of upgrades is configurable) at a time
when turning on a decoder for an EPG update won't clash with a scheduled
recording.


(*) I presume a mux operated by BBC is more likely to be up-to-date than any
other mux which has to be supplied with changes by the relevant broadcasters
of channels on a different mux.

  #23  
Old November 2nd 18, 09:21 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
alan_m
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Posts: 203
Default Best PVR?

On 30/10/2018 21:19, PeterC wrote:

I looked at some boxes on WoS and couldn't see any that upscaled - possibly
not stocked now.


As far as I'm aware they all have the ability to upscale, if required.
Many user options including just output in the broadcast format and let
the TV do the scaling.


--
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  #24  
Old November 2nd 18, 09:30 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
alan_m
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Posts: 203
Default Best PVR?

On 30/10/2018 21:19, PeterC wrote:

Can't remember where I saw it, but it was a forum: apparently the upscaling
from SD to 4k is worse on a HD TV than just having SD.


But why would anyone upscale a SD image to 4K if if feeding a TV only
capable of HD, assuming a HD TV actually recognises a 4K UHD format? The
TV would have to downscale a 4K image hence there are 2 scaling changes
from a SD source to viewing output. Any sensible person would only
upscale to the native capability of their TV. Just because a box has the
capability to upscale to 4k it doesn't mean that you have to use this
facility.

--
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  #25  
Old November 2nd 18, 09:38 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
PeterC
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Posts: 835
Default Best PVR?

On Fri, 2 Nov 2018 08:30:24 +0000, alan_m wrote:

On 30/10/2018 21:19, PeterC wrote:

Can't remember where I saw it, but it was a forum: apparently the upscaling
from SD to 4k is worse on a HD TV than just having SD.


But why would anyone upscale a SD image to 4K if if feeding a TV only
capable of HD, assuming a HD TV actually recognises a 4K UHD format? The
TV would have to downscale a 4K image hence there are 2 scaling changes
from a SD source to viewing output. Any sensible person would only
upscale to the native capability of their TV. Just because a box has the
capability to upscale to 4k it doesn't mean that you have to use this
facility.


Agreed. It's just that when I read it (might have been on AV Forums(?))
there was no mention of being able to choose.
The sensible options would be:
no change
upscale to HD
upscale to 4k
with the last being an option for HD as well.

Looking at some mid- to higher-end TVs, there's no mention of upscaling; I
have seen some reference in AVF.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway
  #26  
Old November 2nd 18, 11:06 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
alan_m
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Posts: 203
Default Best PVR?

On 02/11/2018 08:38, PeterC wrote:
On Fri, 2 Nov 2018 08:30:24 +0000, alan_m wrote:

On 30/10/2018 21:19, PeterC wrote:

Can't remember where I saw it, but it was a forum: apparently the upscaling
from SD to 4k is worse on a HD TV than just having SD.


But why would anyone upscale a SD image to 4K if if feeding a TV only
capable of HD, assuming a HD TV actually recognises a 4K UHD format? The
TV would have to downscale a 4K image hence there are 2 scaling changes
from a SD source to viewing output. Any sensible person would only
upscale to the native capability of their TV. Just because a box has the
capability to upscale to 4k it doesn't mean that you have to use this
facility.


Agreed. It's just that when I read it (might have been on AV Forums(?))
there was no mention of being able to choose.
The sensible options would be:
no change
upscale to HD
upscale to 4k
with the last being an option for HD as well.

Looking at some mid- to higher-end TVs, there's no mention of upscaling; I
have seen some reference in AVF.



--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk
  #27  
Old November 2nd 18, 11:06 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
alan_m
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Posts: 203
Default Best PVR?

On 02/11/2018 08:38, PeterC wrote:
On Fri, 2 Nov 2018 08:30:24 +0000, alan_m wrote:

On 30/10/2018 21:19, PeterC wrote:

Can't remember where I saw it, but it was a forum: apparently the upscaling
from SD to 4k is worse on a HD TV than just having SD.


But why would anyone upscale a SD image to 4K if if feeding a TV only
capable of HD, assuming a HD TV actually recognises a 4K UHD format? The
TV would have to downscale a 4K image hence there are 2 scaling changes
from a SD source to viewing output. Any sensible person would only
upscale to the native capability of their TV. Just because a box has the
capability to upscale to 4k it doesn't mean that you have to use this
facility.


Agreed. It's just that when I read it (might have been on AV Forums(?))
there was no mention of being able to choose.
The sensible options would be:
no change
upscale to HD
upscale to 4k
with the last being an option for HD as well.

Looking at some mid- to higher-end TVs, there's no mention of upscaling; I
have seen some reference in AVF.



--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk
  #28  
Old November 2nd 18, 11:30 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
alan_m
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Posts: 203
Default Best PVR?

On 02/11/2018 08:38, PeterC wrote:

Agreed. It's just that when I read it (might have been on AV Forums(?))
there was no mention of being able to choose.
The sensible options would be:
no change
upscale to HD
upscale to 4k
with the last being an option for HD as well.


On my Enigma 2 box (Not 4K UHD capable) I can disable the automatic
resolution setting and always output in either:
480i
480p
576i
576p
720p
1080i
1080p
@ 50Hz, 60Hz or multi.
with options how to display 4:3 content, such as just scale, pan and
scan, pillarbox or letterbox

If I enable automatic resolution the box tries to output in the
broadcast format for
All resolutions
Only HD
with further user configured options on how to display
480p @ 24Hz
576p @ 24Hz
720p @ 24Hz
1080p @ 24Hz
1080p @ 25Hz
1080p @ 30Hz

With automatic resolution set to "only HD" i get a further option on how
to output SD broadcasts.

This type of functionality allows any input format to be scaled to a TV
resolution or alternatively just to output the broadcast format and to
let the TV do the scaling


Looking at some mid- to higher-end TVs, there's no mention of upscaling; I
have seen some reference in AVF.


All TVs upscale a lower resolution to the resolution of the screen.
You wouldn't buy a TV if a SD broadcast only occupied a 1/16th of the
screen on a 4K capable TV.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk
  #29  
Old November 2nd 18, 02:36 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
PeterC
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Posts: 835
Default Best PVR?

On Fri, 2 Nov 2018 10:30:01 +0000, alan_m wrote:

On 02/11/2018 08:38, PeterC wrote:

Agreed. It's just that when I read it (might have been on AV Forums(?))
there was no mention of being able to choose.
The sensible options would be:
no change
upscale to HD
upscale to 4k
with the last being an option for HD as well.


On my Enigma 2 box (Not 4K UHD capable) I can disable the automatic
resolution setting and always output in either:
480i
480p
576i
576p
720p
1080i
1080p
@ 50Hz, 60Hz or multi.
with options how to display 4:3 content, such as just scale, pan and
scan, pillarbox or letterbox

If I enable automatic resolution the box tries to output in the
broadcast format for
All resolutions
Only HD
with further user configured options on how to display
480p @ 24Hz
576p @ 24Hz
720p @ 24Hz
1080p @ 24Hz
1080p @ 25Hz
1080p @ 30Hz

With automatic resolution set to "only HD" i get a further option on how
to output SD broadcasts.

This type of functionality allows any input format to be scaled to a TV
resolution or alternatively just to output the broadcast format and to
let the TV do the scaling

Ah, good - so long as it's selectable it's no problem.

Looking at some mid- to higher-end TVs, there's no mention of upscaling; I
have seen some reference in AVF.


All TVs upscale a lower resolution to the resolution of the screen.
You wouldn't buy a TV if a SD broadcast only occupied a 1/16th of the
screen on a 4K capable TV.


My HD Panny should be able to, but even on DTTV that option's greyed out. I
use Freesat all the time and the Foxsat HDR's output is 1080i and it won't
upscale at all.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway
  #30  
Old November 2nd 18, 03:29 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
alan_m
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Posts: 203
Default Best PVR?

On 02/11/2018 13:36, PeterC wrote:

My HD Panny should be able to, but even on DTTV that option's greyed out. I
use Freesat all the time and the Foxsat HDR's output is 1080i and it won't
upscale at all.


If the Foxsat set top box is outputting 1080i it has upscaled SD and
sends this to the TV. If your TV is HD then it cannot upscale anymore
because the input is already the maximum resolution of the TV. hence
greyed out options.

If you set your Foxsat to output 576i then you TV will upscale that
image to fill its screen and probably give you the additional options on
how to display 4:3 content on a 16:9 screen.

Up-scaling to 4K UHD will only be possible on more modern boxes/TVs
designed for 4K.

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