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local TV and the EPG



 
 
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  #1  
Old January 2nd 19, 03:55 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Bill Wright[_3_]
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Posts: 3,343
Default local TV and the EPG

I was wondering how this works. Actually, as a preliminary question, how
is the EPG and the LCN list transmitted? It is on one mux, duplicated in
its entirety on several muxes, shared between muxes, or what? How is it
regionalised?

To the particular matter of the EPG and the local TV stations, some main
txs send out different local stations in different directions. How does
the EPG handle that? I notice that a retune here sometimes puts Made in
Leeds in the 800s, but there is no possibility of receiving the ch56 mux
here at a strength that would produce even a badly pixellated picture.

Bill
  #2  
Old January 2nd 19, 04:17 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
NY
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Posts: 1,656
Default local TV and the EPG

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
I was wondering how this works. Actually, as a preliminary question, how
is the EPG and the LCN list transmitted? It is on one mux, duplicated in
its entirety on several muxes, shared between muxes, or what? How is it
regionalised?

To the particular matter of the EPG and the local TV stations, some main
txs send out different local stations in different directions. How does
the EPG handle that? I notice that a retune here sometimes puts Made in
Leeds in the 800s, but there is no possibility of receiving the ch56 mux
here at a strength that would produce even a badly pixellated picture.


I've just quickly disconnected my DVB adaptor from my Raspberry Pi and
connected it to this Windows PC to look at the contents (VLC Player can
extract the EPG).

It seems that each mux contains the EPG only for its own channels. Funny, I
thought there was duplication for reduncancy.

Ah, looking at the output of TSReaderLite for each mux shows that PSB1 (BBC)
also contains listings for ITV (PSB2) and Talking PicturesTV (COM6), and
PSB2 (ITV/CH4) has listings for the same, as has COM4, COM5 and COM6.

So it looks as if probably every mux has listings for all the muxes - total
redundancy. Evidently VLC is being selective and only showing the ones for
the mux's own channels.


TSReader also shows that the LCNs are transmitted in each mux - maybe only
the ones that are relevant to that mux - certainly TSReader doesn't list any
others.

  #3  
Old January 2nd 19, 04:22 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Andy Burns[_12_]
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Posts: 817
Default local TV and the EPG

NY wrote:

It seems that each mux contains the EPG only for its own channels.
Funny, I thought there was duplication for reduncancy.


I though all muxes contained EPG for all channels, maybe that changed
with the SFN for COM7&8 ?

I would assume each localTV had a different service id, so if one
transmitter sent various localTV versions in different directions, it
would cope?
  #4  
Old January 2nd 19, 04:36 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
NY
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,656
Default local TV and the EPG

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
NY wrote:

It seems that each mux contains the EPG only for its own channels. Funny,
I thought there was duplication for reduncancy.


I though all muxes contained EPG for all channels, maybe that changed with
the SFN for COM7&8 ?

I would assume each localTV had a different service id, so if one
transmitter sent various localTV versions in different directions, it
would cope?


Yes, the output of TSReader confirms that (on a quick spot-check) each mux
contains EPG for all muxes' channels. It lists local BBC One variants for
that part for the country (eg BBC ONE NE&C, BBC ONE Yorks etc) with
different SIDs, with the receiver presumably the listings for the variant
that is actually broadcast from that transmitter.

By the way, the EPG for DVB-T2 muxes (PSB3, COM7/8) is encrypted and some
packages (eg VLC) can't decrypt it. PVR software (NextPVR, TVHeadend) and
dedicated PVR hardware presumably has the relevant key to decrypt it.

  #5  
Old January 2nd 19, 05:29 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mark Carver[_2_]
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Posts: 610
Default local TV and the EPG

On 02/01/2019 14:55, Bill Wright wrote:
I was wondering how this works. Actually, as a preliminary question, how
is the EPG and the LCN list transmitted? It is on one mux, duplicated in
its entirety on several muxes, shared between muxes, or what? How is it
regionalised?

To the particular matter of the EPG and the local TV stations, some main
txs send out different local stations in different directions. How does
the EPG handle that? I notice that a retune here sometimes puts Made in
Leeds in the 800s, but there is no possibility of receiving the ch56 mux
here at a strength that would produce even a badly pixellated picture.


The SI tables are transmitted on every mux a transmitter carries, and
all refer to all services from that site.

There are I think about 30 to 35 different SI tables for the regions and
sub regions. They used to carry the name of the primary transmitter,
but that led to confusion, because for instance in Wales all
transmitters were labelled as 'Wenvoe'.

Now they carry a geographical name. Hannington's is called 'Berks and N
Hants'. I suspect Emley's is something like 'South and West Yorkshire' ?

The more modern receivers will give you a choice during the scan if more
than one region is available. For instance 'London' or 'Berks and North
Hants'.

As for multiple local services from the same Tx, then the same feature
gives you a choice if more than one is receivable.

For instance here, I get asked whether I'm,

'Berks and N Hants: Reading'
or 'Berks and N Hants: Basingstoke'

The region(s) and/or town(s) you don't select are dumped in the 800s


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
  #6  
Old January 2nd 19, 06:30 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Woody[_4_]
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Posts: 2,028
Default local TV and the EPG

On Wed 02/01/2019 16:29, Mark Carver wrote:
On 02/01/2019 14:55, Bill Wright wrote:
I was wondering how this works. Actually, as a preliminary question,
how is the EPG and the LCN list transmitted? It is on one mux,
duplicated in its entirety on several muxes, shared between muxes, or
what? How is it regionalised?

To the particular matter of the EPG and the local TV stations, some
main txs send out different local stations in different directions.
How does the EPG handle that? I notice that a retune here sometimes
puts Made in Leeds in the 800s, but there is no possibility of
receiving the ch56 mux here at a strength that would produce even a
badly pixellated picture.


The SI tables are transmitted on every mux a transmitter carries, and
all refer to all services from that site.

There are I think about 30 to 35 different SI tables for the regions and
sub regions.¬* They used to carry the name of the primary transmitter,
but that led to confusion, because for instance in Wales all
transmitters were labelled as 'Wenvoe'.

Now they carry a geographical name. Hannington's is called 'Berks and N
Hants'. I suspect Emley's is something like 'South and West Yorkshire' ?

The more modern receivers will give you a choice during the scan if more
than one region is available. For instance 'London' or 'Berks and North
Hants'.

As for multiple local services from the same Tx, then the same feature
gives you a choice if more than one is receivable.

For instance here, I get asked whether I'm,

'Berks and N Hants: Reading'
or 'Berks and N Hants: Basingstoke'

The region(s) and/or town(s) you don't select are dumped in the 800s


I think Mark that you will find Emley is just named as Yorkshire as it
covers most of all four 'states' of the county to some extent. Indeed it
has one of the largest (if not the largest) geographical coverages in
the country although not population-wise as the density is relatively
low outside the cities and bigger towns.

--
Woody

harrogate three at ntlworld dot com
  #7  
Old January 2nd 19, 09:17 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mark Carver[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 610
Default local TV and the EPG

On 02/01/2019 17:30, Woody wrote:

I think Mark that you will find Emley is just named as Yorkshire as it
covers most of all four 'states' of the county to some extent.


I think you're right, I've found this list someone I know sent me in
2017, (that may not be 100% gospel )

Caldbeck West Borders
Selkirk East Borders
Caldbeck Scotland East Borders
Craigkelly Central Scotland
Darvel Central Scotland
Angus Highlands & Island
Durris Highlands & Island
Bilsdale North East
Crosspool South Yorkshire
Bluebell Hill South East
Dover South East
Heathfield South East
Midhurst South
Sandy Heath Cambs & Beds
Sudbury East Anglia
Tacolneston East Anglia
Oxford Oxon & Bucks
Sutton C West Midlands
The Wrekin West Midlands
Chatton North East
Pontop Pike North East
Winter Hill North West
Emley Moor Yorkshire
Hannington Berks & North Hants
Crystal Palace London
Rowridge South
Ridge Hill Gloucestershire
Fremont Point Channel Islands
Blaenplwyf Wales
Carmel Wales
Llanddona Wales
Moel y Parc Wales
Preseli Wales
Brougher M Northern Ireland
Divis Northern Ireland
Limavady Northern Ireland
Waltham East Midlands
Belmont East Yorks & Lincs
Beacon Hill South West
Caradon Hill South West
Huntshaw Cross South West
Redruth South West
Stockland Hill South West
Mendip West
Wenvoe Wales


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
  #8  
Old January 2nd 19, 09:32 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Andy Burns[_12_]
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Posts: 817
Default local TV and the EPG

Mark Carver wrote:

I've found this list

Sutton C¬*¬*¬* West Midlands
Waltham¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬* East Midlands


Yep

Belmont¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬* East Yorks & Lincs


Belmont county names aren't abbreviated
  #9  
Old January 2nd 19, 09:35 PM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Bill Wright[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,343
Default local TV and the EPG

On 02/01/2019 16:29, Mark Carver wrote:
On 02/01/2019 14:55, Bill Wright wrote:
I was wondering how this works. Actually, as a preliminary question,
how is the EPG and the LCN list transmitted? It is on one mux,
duplicated in its entirety on several muxes, shared between muxes, or
what? How is it regionalised?

To the particular matter of the EPG and the local TV stations, some
main txs send out different local stations in different directions.
How does the EPG handle that? I notice that a retune here sometimes
puts Made in Leeds in the 800s, but there is no possibility of
receiving the ch56 mux here at a strength that would produce even a
badly pixellated picture.


The SI tables are transmitted on every mux a transmitter carries, and
all refer to all services from that site.

There are I think about 30 to 35 different SI tables for the regions and
sub regions.¬* They used to carry the name of the primary transmitter,
but that led to confusion, because for instance in Wales all
transmitters were labelled as 'Wenvoe'.

Now they carry a geographical name. Hannington's is called 'Berks and N
Hants'. I suspect Emley's is something like 'South and West Yorkshire' ?

The more modern receivers will give you a choice during the scan if more
than one region is available. For instance 'London' or 'Berks and North
Hants'.

As for multiple local services from the same Tx, then the same feature
gives you a choice if more than one is receivable.

For instance here, I get asked whether I'm,

'Berks and N Hants: Reading'
or 'Berks and N Hants: Basingstoke'

The region(s) and/or town(s) you don't select are dumped in the 800s



Thank you Mark.

Bill
  #10  
Old January 3rd 19, 09:20 AM posted to uk.tech.digital-tv
Mark Carver[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 610
Default local TV and the EPG

On 02/01/2019 20:32, Andy Burns wrote:
Mark Carver wrote:

I've found this list
Sutton C¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬* West Midlands
Waltham¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬* East Midlands


Yep

Belmont¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬*¬* East Yorks & Lincs


Belmont county names aren't abbreviated


Ta !

Here's a thought I had in the shower this morning ooh err. As COM7/8
is now a national SFN, all COM 7/8 transmitters must have the same SI
tables, and therefore must refer to all services, in all the areas
COM7/8 are available ? Amazing there's any bandwidth left for the
actual services ! :-)

--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.
 




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