Jericcccco

"Norman Rowing" wrote in message
...
On 06/01/2016 23:07, Brian-Gaff wrote:
I understand this is a new series on the itv. I do hope its not supposed
to
be in biblical times as the voice I heard on the trailer sounded pretty
north of England to me, I was waiting for ee by gum.
Brian


Could be worse. Could have been 'Mercan

Any degree of the "wrong" UK accent is infinitely preferable to American
accents - unless there really *were* American navvies, of course.

All I ask is that people have accents which are reasonably authentic for the
character that they are playing - if an actor can only do a Brummie accent,
for example. that's fine as long as their character is a Brummie.

What irritated me was the accents in the BBC All Creatures Great and Small
series which were vaguely Northern, but gave most of the farmers (who would
have remained very much in rural Yorkshire, not venturing into the towns)
West Riding or even (heaven forbid) Lancashire accents. The authentic Dales
accent (think of Hannah Hauxwell) is quite different, rather musical and
with a slight hint of Geordie thrown in, and there probably aren't that many
actors who come from that area for whom it is their native accent.

At least with Jericho there is good reason for characters to come from a
variety of locations and therefore have a variety of accents. If any local
characters describe their health as "moderate", I'll know that the series
has a good dialect expert, because this word is (bizarrely) used in the
Dales to mean "very poorly, may not even last the night".

In message , NY
writes



Any degree of the "wrong" UK accent is infinitely preferable to
American accents - unless there really *were* American navvies, of
course.

But, in the 1870s, how 'American' were many American accents?



--
Ian

On Thu, 07 Jan 2016 18:53:59 +0000
Peter Duncanson wrote:
On Thu, 7 Jan 2016 17:02:38 +0000 (UTC), d wrote:

On Thu, 07 Jan 2016 16:05:50 +0000
Peter Duncanson wrote:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multic...London_English

Unbelievable that someone has actually tried to codify this dumbed down
idiots
patois as a genuine dialect. Perhaps we'll have a Tourettes English page
next.

Experts who study languages and dialects just study and describe what
people use.

After all, all languages are human inventions which are subject to
change.

Yes, but its generally taken as given that teenage slang is not a dialect
since it vanishes almost as soon as it appears. When its spoken by the
majority of the population in an area for years on end *then* it can be
described as a dialect.

--
Spud

"Martin" wrote in message
...
The author of ACG&S's & James Herriott worked in Thirsk and on the N York
Moors,
not in the Dales.

Very true. However the purist in me would say that, having chosen to move
the location from Thirsk area to Wensleydale/Swaledale (to give more
photogenic * scenery?), the makers of the TV series should have chosen
accents to match - a subtlety which would probably be lost on 99.9% of the
audience :-) Even so, the various rural North Yorkshire accents (whether
Dales, Moors or whatever) are fairly different from the "industrial" West
Riding and Sheffield area accents: Barnsley is a long way from Bolton Abbey,
both in miles and in accent!

We'll leave aside the fact that both the actresses who played Helen Herriot
were far too posh, given that the real Helen was a local farmer's daughter,
and the real James Herriot's accent was a mixture of Glasgow and
Sunderland - Christopher Timothy could at least have *tried* to sound
vaguely Scottish :-)


(*) Claim to fame: one of the episodes of ACGAS features a lot of filming of
ewes giving birth to lambs on a snowy hillside, and collapsing due to some
mineral deficiency. Those scenes were filmed on the hill just behind my
parents' holiday cottage in Wensleydale and you can see our cottage in a lot
of the shots looking downhill from the "maternity ward". The local farmer
was asked to supply all the in-lamb ewes that they needed; she described how
there were all sorts of production, lighting and catering trucks cluttering
up the village green for a week, and she kept one of the tractors available
in case any of them needed help getting off the green after a week in one
spot in the drifting snow. The local paper made quite a splash about the
filming, possibly because the farmer was unusual: a woman with 8 children
who had to run the farm after the death of her husband.

"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 8 Jan 2016 12:07:14 -0000, "NY" wrote:

"Martin" wrote in message
. ..
The author of ACG&S's & James Herriott worked in Thirsk and on the N
York
Moors,
not in the Dales.

Very true. However the purist in me would say that, having chosen to move
the location from Thirsk area to Wensleydale/Swaledale (to give more
photogenic * scenery?

Heartbeat had no trouble finding photogenic scenery in the NYM National
Park,
even if bits were made in Leeds :-)

I'm not sure what area Alf Wight (James Herriot) and Donald Sinclair
(Siegfried Farnon) covered. Was it mainly in the flat York Plain or did they
also extend up Sutton Bank ridge onto the western edge of the North York
Moors? When I asked at the James Herriot Museum (housed in the actual
"Skeldale House" premises in Kirkgate, Thirsk where Wight and Sinclair
practised) the staff weren't sure. I wonder how good the WWII and early
post-WWII cars would have been at getting up the 1:4 Sutton Bank; my mum has
memories of her dad having to reverse up it sometimes (because reverse was
often a lower gear than first) when they were going on holiday from Leeds to
Whitby in the 1940s. In the snow, Wight and Sinclair must have had big
problems getting up onto the Moors if Sutton Bank and the other hilly minor
roads round there were snowed up; they'd probably have had to take a big
detour via the modern-day caravan route via Coxwold and Ampleforth. Maybe
the ridge was enough of a barrier that the Moors were covered by other vets
in Helmsley and Pickering in the winter. Some of those roads would require a
4x4 and winter tyres nowadays; it doesn't bear thinking about how they
managed decades ago in ordinary 2WD cars with road tyres and no differential
lock.

I wonder how long Goathland will be able to continue trading on its
reputation as Aidenfield in Heartbeat. They've done well out of it and the
local garage still has signs "Aidensfield Garage" and black Ford Anglia
police cars and Greengrass's truck parked outside, and the village stores
and pub still have "Aidensfield" signs.They've done well out of it, but when
ITV3 stop repeating Heartbeat (which may occur just after hell freezes
over!) that market may stat to dry up.

Living near York and Castle Howard, it's quite common to see "Loc" and
"Base" signs on the lamp-posts directing cast and crew to whatever is being
filmed this week :-) If my wife hadn't been occupied most weekends moving
house to the area, she might have been seen as an extra in the remake of
Brideshead Revisited.

I hoped that I might have been seen in the background of a
walking-and-talking scene outside the Sheldonian Theatre in Oxford in an
episode of Lewis - I was taking some photos and the director roped me in as
a tourist taking photos, but they must have used another take; my friend was
luckier at the very end of the pilot episode of Lewis at the Trout pub when
Lewis and Hathaway have a drink overlooking the river and she's sitting at
the table in the background (my damn car wouldn't start that morning or I'd
have been there as well).

"Martin" wrote in message
...
You can get up it starting at Wass. It is still steep but the road up
lacks
tight bends.

I know that road. It's the one marked "do not use in winter conditions" :-)
I think even in the absence of bends, it might defeat a 2WD car, especially
on the steepest section. Sadly it only takes one wheel to spin and you lose
all traction (don't you love the way a differential works).

Maybe
the ridge was enough of a barrier that the Moors were covered by other
vets
in Helmsley and Pickering in the winter. Some of those roads would require
a
4x4 and winter tyres nowadays; it doesn't bear thinking about how they
managed decades ago in ordinary 2WD cars with road tyres and no
differential
lock.

They used chains?

Gosh. I haven't heard of snow chains for years. I wonder if that's because
nowadays the fabric sleeves that you can put round tyres give similar
results without giving a knobbly ride as soon as you hit a patch of bare
tarmac - or any snow that is less deep that the size of the chain links.

I wonder how long Goathland will be able to continue trading on its
reputation as Aidenfield in Heartbeat. They've done well out of it and the
local garage still has signs "Aidensfield Garage" and black Ford Anglia
police cars and Greengrass's truck parked outside, and the village stores
and pub still have "Aidensfield" signs.They've done well out of it, but
when
ITV3 stop repeating Heartbeat (which may occur just after hell freezes
over!

We have still not seen the final episodes, despite recording and then
discarding
every repeat for about three years.

Somewhere I'm sure I've got the very last episode on VHS, but goodness knows
where the tape is.


) that market may start to dry up.

The shop was sold for £500,000 a few months ago. The pub is a dead loss. I
think
the owner lived on Heartbeat money for decades. It was a good pub with a
restaurant that had good food before Heartbeat. The last time we were
there, in
summer 2014, there was no food available. The atmosphere was grim.
Customers had
one drink and left.
The pub has very mixed reviews.
http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Hotel_R...e_England.html

The NYM Railway brings in floods of tourists everyday in summer. Very few
walk
as far as the Malyan Spout Hotel, even fewer walk down the path to see the
Spout.. The hotel does reasonable food at normal pub prices. The garden at
the
back is fabulous and has a fantastic view across the valley. There was a
row
about the village car park in 2014. The Duchy of Lancaster, AKA The Queen,
owns
the grass verges in Goathland. It bills occupants for access rights. In
the case
of the car park they retroactively asked for all the takings. Outrageous!

It has always struck me as slightly wrong that it is the Duchy of
*Lancaster* which owns Goathland in *Yorkshire* :-) I usually park at the
foot of the steep hill from the Blue Bank road, on the opposite side of the
railway bridge from the station. There are a few spaces there. Or else up
the other end beyond the three-way junction (now a mini-roundabout) near the
Mallyan Spout hotel. I have a pathological loathing for paying to park
anywhere, ever.

The Mallyan Spout waterfall is a bit of a climb (on the way back) but it's
well worth doing it, isn't it. I bet it's been impressive with all the rain
that there's been recently.

It's interesting that in one of the early episodes of Heartbeat they talked
about the Aidensfield Arms having had a perpetual fire in the grate for
several hundred years, because that's the story at the Legendary Saltergate
Inn at the foot of the Hole of Horcum hill a few miles to the south of
Goathland. Sadly that pub is now derelict. The owners apparently started
renovation work on it, which involved removing the roof, and then ran out of
money. They evidently didn't even have money to pay for plastic sheeting to
put over the roof to keep the rain out, so it's now a mess inside and it's
for sale, not as a building but as a plot of land: the pub would have to be
demolished by any new owner before he could build anything else on the land.
So sad to see this legendary pub wither and die.

"Martin" wrote in message
...
It's interesting that in one of the early episodes of Heartbeat they
talked
about the Aidensfield Arms having had a perpetual fire in the grate for
several hundred years, because that's the story at the Legendary
Saltergate
Inn at the foot of the Hole of Horcum hill a few miles to the south of
Goathland.

Somebody set the chimney on fire. The fire brigade put out the fire. From
that
point onwards they were doomed. The fire was supposed to have been kept
going
because there was a murder victim buried under the fire place.

Yes that's the reason I've heard for the perpetual fire. The version that
I've heard is that he was a local excise officer, which maybe comes under
the category of justifiable homicide :-)

Sadly that pub is now derelict. The owners apparently started
renovation work on it, which involved removing the roof, and then ran out
of
money.

The intention was to convert it into holiday apartments. We thought the
YHA
should have bought it, It is the ideal location for a youth hostel.
At the end of the 1970s it was owned and run by four catering college
graduates.
It had a really good restaurant. They sold it and moved on. After that it
was
downhill all the way. It changed hands several times. the last time we
were in
there we chatted with the owners, who had lived in Spain running a
business,
whilst employing managers to run the Saltersgate. They had returned to UK
to
sort out the problems. I think they sold it to a developer, who went bust.

I had friends who had worked at Fylingdales. They had stories of being
snowed
into the Fox and Rabbit for days in the cold winter of 1963.

I can think of worst places to be snowed-in, as long as they had plenty of
food and beer!

I bet it was bleak up there and by the Lion at Blakey Ridge during the
notorious winter of 63. I don't remember as I was still in my mummy's tummy
:-)

They evidently didn't even have money to pay for plastic sheeting to
put over the roof to keep the rain out, so it's now a mess inside and it's
for sale, not as a building but as a plot of land: the pub would have to
be
demolished by any new owner before he could build anything else on the
land.
So sad to see this legendary pub wither and die.

Since then somebody has put the roof back on. Last year the local council
were
planning to take the to court if the owners didn't finish the renovation!

Have they? I hadn't noticed that there was a roof again now. We may go past
it tomorrow the weather is nice and we go over to the coast, so I'll see
what the current state of it is.

Thinking of the Hole of Horcum, I saw a travel programme a few years ago in
which Richard Wilson (of Victor Meldrew fame) drove round the area in an old
Morris Minor. And they left in the take when he referred to it as the Hole
of Scrotum and then quickly corrected himself :-)

On 08/01/2016 13:08, NY wrote:

I wonder how good the WWII and early
post-WWII cars would have been at getting up the 1:4 Sutton Bank

Siegfried Farnon's Rover would have had no trouble. I had one similar
but a different model number, and it could get me up a 1 in 3 to work
every morning. With Town and Country tyres on the back, and a very
careful use of clutch and accelerator it was reasonable in the snow
uphill (though not the 1 in 3!). Coming downhill was an entirely more
hazardous affair though because the acceleration due to gravity and the
car's weight sometimes exceeded the grip on the tyres.

I also had a 1952 Triumph and that was very good in snow, though the
1200cc sidevalve engine would only just get up a 1 in 4 in first gear.

Generally speaking the older cars had much more torque at low revs and
lower first gear gearing than modern cars, so they coped, just more slowly.

Jim

On Sat, 09 Jan 2016 15:45:13 +0000, Indy Jess John wrote:

On 08/01/2016 13:08, NY wrote:

I wonder how good the WWII and early post-WWII cars would have been at
getting up the 1:4 Sutton Bank

Siegfried Farnon's Rover would have had no trouble. I had one similar
but a different model number, and it could get me up a 1 in 3 to work
every morning. With Town and Country tyres on the back, and a very
careful use of clutch and accelerator it was reasonable in the snow
uphill (though not the 1 in 3!). Coming downhill was an entirely more
hazardous affair though because the acceleration due to gravity and the
car's weight sometimes exceeded the grip on the tyres.

I also had a 1952 Triumph and that was very good in snow, though the
1200cc sidevalve engine would only just get up a 1 in 4 in first gear.

Generally speaking the older cars had much more torque at low revs and
lower first gear gearing than modern cars, so they coped, just more
slowly.

The narrower tyres probably helped too as they would cut through the snow.

I recall a former colleague had a 2CV that would go up Matlock hill when
other cars had no traction in the snow.

Dick

On 09/01/2016 15:52, Dick wrote:

The narrower tyres probably helped too as they would cut through the snow.

Still the case today. My car with its big fat low profile tyres is
hopeless, I can't even get it off our sloping drive in some snow.
SWIMO's with its skinny tyres has never (yet) had a problem.



--
Mark
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