How the disabled are ripped off

On 24/09/2015 21:09, michael adams wrote:
"GB" wrote in message ...
On 24/09/2015 19:40, Bill Wright wrote:
110Ah deep discharge battery sold through some disability industry
outlets: £149.95. Exact same battery sold for golf buggy: £60

Flightsafe device: £30. This is a three pin XLR plug with pins 1 and 2
shorted, in red plastic. This inhibits the scooter operation. Cost of
manufacture will be about £1.

115mm rubber tyred jockey wheel, 20mm bo Disability shops: £18.
Various other places: about £10.

Various scooter keys:
Shoprider on/off switch £10. This is standard plastic body toggle
switch: £1 from CPC etc.
Some old types of scooter uses a standard 1/4" jack plug, shorted out
internally, as a key. These are sold for £5 to £12 in disability shops.
Some other keys are on standard blanks and my local cobbler with turn
them out at £5 each, but if you buy from a disability shop they are
likely to be £12 to £15.

Very annoying! To some extent, this is just the same as any spare parts operation - for
a car, for example.

But that doesn't explain why the same battery is available for a golf
buggy for 40% of the price. Or the toggle switch which is widely
available elsewhere at 1/10th of the price. Or the keys which cost
three times as much in a disabilty shop as in a key cutting
kiosk.


One possibility is that the disability shop orders the keys in from the
manufacturer. Clearly, that's not the same process as the key cutting
kiosk. For a start, you need to have the key to begin with to use the
kiosk. You'd be the first to complain if the manufacturers of the
scooter were unable to supply a key just from the ID number of the scooter.

In article , GB
wrote:
On 24/09/2015 21:09, michael adams wrote:
"GB" wrote in message
...
On 24/09/2015 19:40, Bill Wright wrote:
110Ah deep discharge battery sold through some disability industry
outlets: £149.95. Exact same battery sold for golf buggy: £60

Flightsafe device: £30. This is a three pin XLR plug with pins 1 and
2 shorted, in red plastic. This inhibits the scooter operation. Cost
of manufacture will be about £1.

115mm rubber tyred jockey wheel, 20mm bo Disability shops: £18.
Various other places: about £10.

Various scooter keys: Shoprider on/off switch £10. This is standard
plastic body toggle switch: £1 from CPC etc. Some old types of
scooter uses a standard 1/4" jack plug, shorted out internally, as a
key. These are sold for £5 to £12 in disability shops. Some other
keys are on standard blanks and my local cobbler with turn them out
at £5 each, but if you buy from a disability shop they are likely to
be £12 to £15.

Very annoying! To some extent, this is just the same as any spare
parts operation - for a car, for example.

But that doesn't explain why the same battery is available for a golf
buggy for 40% of the price. Or the toggle switch which is widely
available elsewhere at 1/10th of the price. Or the keys which cost
three times as much in a disabilty shop as in a key cutting kiosk.


One possibility is that the disability shop orders the keys in from the
manufacturer. Clearly, that's not the same process as the key cutting
kiosk. For a start, you need to have the key to begin with to use the
kiosk. You'd be the first to complain if the manufacturers of the scooter
were unable to supply a key just from the ID number of the scooter.

I can remember buying car keys from a proper locksmith by quoting the
number on another one.

--
Please note new email address:

wrote:
On Thursday, 24 September 2015 19:40:58 UTC+1, Bill Wright wrote:
110Ah deep discharge battery sold through some disability industry
outlets: £149.95. Exact same battery sold for golf buggy: £60

Not sure if it's *exactly* the same, but £235 from a boat supplier:

http://www.cactusnav.com/victron-ene...y-p-13285.html

Owain


No, it's different. Deep cycle batteries are a minefield, so to speak.
There are gel batteries and bog standard lead-acid for one thing. The
way the vendors and manufacturers arrive at the figure of 110Ah (or
whatever) seems to vary greatly. There are tremendous differences in
quality, and a massive price range, and very little correlation I
sometimes think between the two.

Hil's 'Big Bug' has two 110Ah batteries and I can only just lift one of
them. They are also very large. And incredibly expensive (I can't
remember the price but it is horrendous.) But they propel the behometh
and driver for 20 miles in hilly country and still keep going, and the
rough sums I've done suggest that they really do give 110Ah, as long as
the discharge is at a reasonable rate.

I've used quite expensive '110Ah' batteries in the motorhome and when
new I'd say that in truth they give mebbe 50Ah. I've used cheapys that
were about the same, cheapys that were much worse, and expensive ones
that were the same.

Bill

Jonno wrote:
Bill Wright scribbled

110Ah deep discharge battery sold through some disability industry
outlets: £149.95. Exact same battery sold for golf buggy: £60

Flightsafe device: £30. This is a three pin XLR plug with pins 1 and 2
shorted, in red plastic. This inhibits the scooter operation. Cost of
manufacture will be about £1.

115mm rubber tyred jockey wheel, 20mm bo Disability shops: £18.
Various other places: about £10.

Various scooter keys:
Shoprider on/off switch £10. This is standard plastic body toggle
switch: £1 from CPC etc.
Some old types of scooter uses a standard 1/4" jack plug, shorted out
internally, as a key. These are sold for £5 to £12 in disability shops.
Some other keys are on standard blanks and my local cobbler with turn
them out at £5 each, but if you buy from a disability shop they are
likely to be £12 to £15.


The rip off starts with the cost of the scooters.


In a shop near here Hil's 'Baby Bug is £1,850. We bought if off the
internet for £780. The after sales service was fine.


In a shop near here Hil's 'Big Bug is £4,999. We bought if off the
internet for £2,100. The after sales service was fine.

Bill

David Woolley wrote:
On 25/09/15 09:17, brightside S9 wrote:
You realise that the rip off is worse than you percieve. Products
from the 'disabled shop' are VAT free, not from the 'golf shop'.

They shouldn't be selling a battery VAT free. The exemption is only
supposed to apply to equipment that has no significant non-disabled use,
and is being sold to an individual end user.

I'm well aware of the VAT situation. You are wrong. The exemption
applies to batteries for scooters.

Bill

Fredxxx wrote:
On 25/09/2015 09:51, David Woolley wrote:
On 25/09/15 09:17, brightside S9 wrote:
You realise that the rip off is worse than you percieve. Products
from the 'disabled shop' are VAT free, not from the 'golf shop'.

They shouldn't be selling a battery VAT free. The exemption is only
supposed to apply to equipment that has no significant non-disabled use,
and is being sold to an individual end user.

http://webarchive.nationalarchives.g...HMCE_CL_000184


Says, "If the batteries were solely designed to operate within the
eligible item however, they would be eligible for relief."

It's the design that matters. One wonders if putting a label on the
battery "Designed for Mobility use only" would be sufficient? Especially
if there is another label saying "May damage battery or non-mobility
equipment where fitted" which is quite true.

The batteries are generally traction/deep discharge rated, so are
designed for this type of use.

The reality is that if you buy from a retailer selling mostly disability
kit and if you sign the declaration you don't pay the VAT. Done it loads
of times.

Bill

On 25/09/2015 12:25, Jethro_uk wrote:
IIRC there were 3 possible heights, across 6 wards for the ignition. 5
wards for the doors. This was up to 1983/4.

Ah, in the days when you had a different key for the ignition, each door
and the boot (and the petrol cap!)

On 24/09/2015 21:07, Bill Wright wrote:

Better call at the Grand Ol Opry if ever you're in the USA. You might
get to like other C& W tracks like I Flushed You From The Toilets Of My
Heart, Get Your Tongue Outta My Mouth 'Cause I'm Kissing You Goodbye, My
John Deere Was Breaking Your Field While Your Dear John Was Breaking My
Heart, You Can't Have Your Kate And Edith Too, If You Don't Believe I
Love You Just Ask My Wife, and so on . . .

There are some quite outrageous songs on youtube too
This one from Donovan is about space travel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCpnwJQhoYY

This one by David Downing is about contentment
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a972Xk3rAxU

Enjoy!

Jim

On 25/09/2015 13:36, Richard Conway wrote:

Ah, in the days when you had a different key for the ignition, each door
and the boot (and the petrol cap!)

I have nearly got that, except that the same key fits the boot and
ignition.

It wasn't like that when I bought it, there was a different key for the
boot, but it wasn't a good fit, I had to wiggle it a bit to unlock it.
I dismantled the boot lock and found that stamped on the barrel was a
number which when I checked was the number on the ignition key.

Why the person who sold me the car had a different key for the boot, I
have no idea.

Jim

In message , Indy Jess John
writes
On 25/09/2015 13:36, Richard Conway wrote:

Ah, in the days when you had a different key for the ignition, each door
and the boot (and the petrol cap!)

I have nearly got that, except that the same key fits the boot and
ignition.

It wasn't like that when I bought it, there was a different key for the
boot, but it wasn't a good fit, I had to wiggle it a bit to unlock it.
I dismantled the boot lock and found that stamped on the barrel was a
number which when I checked was the number on the ignition key.

Why the person who sold me the car had a different key for the boot, I
have no idea.

In the days of the 'FT' series of manual keys, my Cortina's (memorable)
FT208 key would open and start about 50% of cars that also used FT keys
- and quite a few that didn't!
--
Ian