Soundbars - what, you want sound with your TV?

In article ,
the dog from that film you saw wrote:
I just
don't understand why they do not sell speakers that plug in on top end
models.

because anyone who would want to buy them, would buy a proper amp and
speakers instead.

I have indeed bought an amplifier, but only because the TV didn't
provide one. Building an adequate amplifier into a TV wouldn't cost
much. In fact, as TVs display more and more from external sources,
their primary function becomes the display, and it would make perfect
sense for the amplifier to be bundled into that.

-- Richard

On Tue, 23 Apr 2013 17:44:04 +0100, the dog from that film you saw
wrote:

On 23/04/2013 13:38, Brian Gaff wrote:
Oh I see well, if you think about it, most laptops have crap sound as the
case is so small I suspect this is the issue with tvs. When I wasy ounger
some tvs did have good sound but it was generally the top end models. I just
don't understand why they do not sell speakers that plug in on top end
models.

Brian



because anyone who would want to buy them, would buy a proper amp and
speakers instead.

The makers seem to noticed a gap in the market between those people who
are not concerned about the poor quality of the sound from the built-in
speakers in TV, and those people who use a decent external amp and
speakers (possibly an existing Hi Fi system).

Some of us fill that gap with PC speaker systems (a pair of speakers and
a sub-woofer). A soundbar designed specifically for the job might or
might not give better results. Whether the performance would justify the
expense is another matter.

--
Peter Duncanson
(in uk.tech.digital-tv)

On 23/04/2013 18:30, Richard Tobin wrote:
In article ,
the dog from that film you saw wrote:
I just
don't understand why they do not sell speakers that plug in on top end
models.

because anyone who would want to buy them, would buy a proper amp and
speakers instead.

I have indeed bought an amplifier, but only because the TV didn't
provide one. Building an adequate amplifier into a TV wouldn't cost
much. In fact, as TVs display more and more from external sources,
their primary function becomes the display, and it would make perfect
sense for the amplifier to be bundled into that.

-- Richard




you can get quite a few blu ray players with integrated amp and plug in
5.1 speakers if you don't want to go the full blown amp route.


--
Gareth.
That fly.... Is your magic wand.

On 23/04/2013 14:35, Paul D Smith wrote:

Playing devil's advocate, how soon before they offer to sell me a decent
video monitor to go with my TV? For me, decent sound and vision go
together and if that means that, say, their "TV" has to contain no
speakers and come with external speakers (lightbulb - that's probably
what Brian Gaff was suggesting) then so be it.

But producing something which is so crap that they then try to sell me
the speakers that should have come with the TV in the first place is
really taking the mickey.

Our old CRT set came with better speakers than any flat panel (well -
they had the space ) AND a sub-woofer in the factory supplied stand.
Not to mention read speakers.

Andy

On 23/04/2013 20:27, Andy Champ wrote:
Our old CRT set came with better speakers than any flat panel (well -
they had the space ) AND a sub-woofer in the factory supplied stand.
Not to mention read speakers.

It had rear speaker too...

In article , Peter Duncanson
wrote:
On Tue, 23 Apr 2013 17:44:04 +0100, the dog from that film you saw
wrote:


The makers seem to noticed a gap in the market between those people who
are not concerned about the poor quality of the sound from the built-in
speakers in TV, and those people who use a decent external amp and
speakers (possibly an existing Hi Fi system).

That seems plausible to me. The assumption will probably be that it is
sufficient to provide a way for someone to use the TV with a 'home theatre'
audio system.

Some of us fill that gap with PC speaker systems (a pair of speakers and
a sub-woofer). A soundbar designed specifically for the job might or
might not give better results. Whether the performance would justify the
expense is another matter.

Depends on what you listen to and what you prefer.

Some events like Proms can have superb sound and would benefit from a
serious set of audio kit. But other programmes may have level compressed
and/or poor sound that may not justify much beyond what you get in the TV.

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article , Richard Tobin
wrote:
In article , the dog from that film
you saw wrote:
I just don't understand why they do not sell speakers that plug in on
top end models.

because anyone who would want to buy them, would buy a proper amp and
speakers instead.

I have indeed bought an amplifier, but only because the TV didn't
provide one. Building an adequate amplifier into a TV wouldn't cost
much. In fact, as TVs display more and more from external sources,
their primary function becomes the display, and it would make perfect
sense for the amplifier to be bundled into that.

The problem for set-makers is that decent stereo (and even more so,
surround) tends to mean well placed speakers of a decent size and spec.

This means that some customers will compare an 'all in one' TV with those
that might offer a soundbar or seperate speakers... and go for "that one
doesn't need the extra clutter".

So they save money. In that context the advantage of providing a 'digital'
audio output rather than analogue is that it cuts cost and avoids
degradation by cheap analogue circuits.

Those who have an interest in audio simple come to take for granted that
for the best quality results you'll need a seperate audio system with a TV
or DVD/BD player, etc. May already have that before they get the TV, so
won't want a cheap duplication of it bundled.

Given all that the 'soundbar' seems to me a relatively convenient
half-way-house for those who want "better than the TV" sound but wish to
avoid the "clutter" of a decent set of audio seperates.

So once a TV can provide a digital output and has some internal 'backup'
speakers for those who don't care about audio quality I guess the makers
have judged their markets well enough.

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

Paul D Smith wrote:
Feeling very "grumpy old man" as I look at possible new TVs and things like...

Save £50 when bought with Panasonic Soundbar

...on websites. Apparently manufacturers are now completely happy to admit that the sound from their TVs is so crap that you need to buy a separate speaker system.

I'd be quite happy if my TV had come with NO built in speakers.

BugBear

In article ,
bugbear wrote:
Paul D Smith wrote:
Feeling very "grumpy old man" as I look at possible new TVs and things
like...

Save £50 when bought with Panasonic Soundbar

...on websites. Apparently manufacturers are now completely happy to
admit that the sound from their TVs is so crap that you need to buy a
separate speaker system.

I'd be quite happy if my TV had come with NO built in speakers.

I would too, since I've not used built in speakers since colour TV started.
But decent power amps to allow the use of external speakers without
additional remote controls and mains wiring that a soundbar needs would be
a decent way of doing it.

--
*'ome is where you 'ang your @ *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
bugbear wrote:
Paul D Smith wrote:
Feeling very "grumpy old man" as I look at possible new TVs and things
like...

Save £50 when bought with Panasonic Soundbar

...on websites. Apparently manufacturers are now completely happy to
admit that the sound from their TVs is so crap that you need to buy a
separate speaker system.

I'd be quite happy if my TV had come with NO built in speakers.

I would too, since I've not used built in speakers since colour TV
started.
But decent power amps to allow the use of external speakers without
additional remote controls and mains wiring that a soundbar needs would be
a decent way of doing it.

I suppose in the early days, the quality of FM analogue sound was the
limiting factor. Once NICAM and later DVB-T/DVD-S broadcasts began, the
difference in clarity, noise and frequency response between cheap TVs and
expensive external amplifiers/speakers started to become noticeable.

When I first got a VCR that was capable of decoding NICAM sound, I compared
off-air analogue FM sound and NICAM through the same amplifier and speakers,
and was surprised at the difference. Even more noticeable was the difference
between the linear and hi-fi soundtrack on a VHS recording - that was quite
staggering!