In view of the cost of energy...

On Tue, 8 Jan 2013 07:05:27 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

Those living near high voltage electricity transmission lines might be able to abstract enough electricity by simply mounting fluorescent tubes vertically. I wonder if some sort of aerial, if erected near enough to the overhead cables, might pick up a decent supply. Possibly a very large induction coil, running around the perimeter of the garden, might work.

The tubes themselves will light quite happily just poked in the ground
underneath a pylon.
I wrote about that previously either on here or the other group.

In article , FredCarnot wrote:
I can't find any reference googling but i remember in the 1960's or 70's
someone was prosecuted for stealing electricity by putting up resonance
aerials in their loft next to Brookmans Park MW Transmitter

I remember a similar story told by the physics teacher at school
mumble years ago. This one is supposed to have happened at Borough
Hill Daventry, not a million miles away and still home to some large
aerial arrays at the time.

The local farmer supposedly noticed some of the lamps in his
outbuildings glowed when turned off. He experimented with the position
and length of the cables until he got some usable light. The engineers
noticed the power loss, went investigating and he was found out.

It would be interesting to know how it could be argued that he was doing
anything wrong by taking electrical energy from a radio transmission,
because surely that's exactly what a radio receiver is supposed to do, and
exactly what the transmissions are provided for?

Is there a specified power limit perhaps, or a limit to the permitted gain
of a receiving aerial? Or is there perhaps a requirement that the
electricity is extracted only to take information from it and not to power
anything, in which case where would that leave a passive crystal set?

I once thought a neat way to improve the performance of a passive radio
receiver for those fortunate enough to live near a strong transmitter would
be to design one that was actually two receivers, one tuned permanently to
the strong transmission, its output rectified to provide power for the other
one which is used to receive broadcasts from any station in the normal way.
Would that have been illegal I wonder, and if so, why?

Rod.
--

In article ,
Steve Terry wrote:
Mark Carver wrote:
Steve Terry wrote:
wrote:
As we all struggle with our energy bills, perhaps we should look at
ways of obtaining energy without paying for it. I would think that
various members of this group will have ideas about how this could
be done.

I can't find any reference googling but i remember in the 1960's or
70's someone was prosecuted for stealing electricity by putting up
resonance aerials in their loft next to Brookmans Park MW Transmitter

BBC discovered they had an unexpected hole in their coverage in the
direction of nearby houses

That sounds to me like ********, you might be able to extract a very
small amount of power, but how could something small enough to be
housed in a loft, measurably affect a signal that has a wavelength of
several hundred metres, transmitted at very high power from a large
array ?

Apparently he was using the RF to light fluorescent tubes, but as you
say otherwise to take any real power isn't plausible.

I think his mistake was he went on a light entertainment TV prog
like "Nationwide" and bragged about it

Seem to remember something like this being mentioned by a lecturer at BBC
ETD. But before Nationwide. And IIRC, it was a farmer.

--
*Why don't you ever see the headline "Psychic Wins Lottery"?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Tue, 08 Jan 2013 23:34:35 -0000, Roderick Stewart
wrote:

In article , FredCarnot wrote:
I can't find any reference googling but i remember in the 1960's or 70's
someone was prosecuted for stealing electricity by putting up resonance
aerials in their loft next to Brookmans Park MW Transmitter

I remember a similar story told by the physics teacher at school
mumble years ago. This one is supposed to have happened at Borough
Hill Daventry, not a million miles away and still home to some large
aerial arrays at the time.

The local farmer supposedly noticed some of the lamps in his
outbuildings glowed when turned off. He experimented with the position
and length of the cables until he got some usable light. The engineers
noticed the power loss, went investigating and he was found out.

It would be interesting to know how it could be argued that he was doing
anything wrong by taking electrical energy from a radio transmission,
because surely that's exactly what a radio receiver is supposed to do, and
exactly what the transmissions are provided for?

Is there a specified power limit perhaps, or a limit to the permitted gain
of a receiving aerial? Or is there perhaps a requirement that the
electricity is extracted only to take information from it and not to power
anything, in which case where would that leave a passive crystal set?

I once thought a neat way to improve the performance of a passive radio
receiver for those fortunate enough to live near a strong transmitter would
be to design one that was actually two receivers, one tuned permanently to
the strong transmission, its output rectified to provide power for the other
one which is used to receive broadcasts from any station in the normal way.
Would that have been illegal I wonder, and if so, why?

Rod.

I built a set that used exactly that principle when I first got
interested in electronics in the mid '60s
It was probably from my collection of Bernard Babani / Clive Sinclair
books.

The legal position about stealing electricity is an interesting one.
It cannot be stolen

The definitive case law is Low v Blease [1975]
Somewhere along the line Bill probably knew that, because he correctly
used the word abstract rather than steal.

Nevertheless, a clever lawyer might get you off on the basis that all
radio reception uses energy from the transmitter.




--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%

On Wed, 09 Jan 2013 00:34:23 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Steve Terry wrote:
Mark Carver wrote:
Steve Terry wrote:
wrote:
As we all struggle with our energy bills, perhaps we should look at
ways of obtaining energy without paying for it. I would think that
various members of this group will have ideas about how this could
be done.

I can't find any reference googling but i remember in the 1960's or
70's someone was prosecuted for stealing electricity by putting up
resonance aerials in their loft next to Brookmans Park MW Transmitter

BBC discovered they had an unexpected hole in their coverage in the
direction of nearby houses

That sounds to me like ********, you might be able to extract a very
small amount of power, but how could something small enough to be
housed in a loft, measurably affect a signal that has a wavelength of
several hundred metres, transmitted at very high power from a large
array ?

Apparently he was using the RF to light fluorescent tubes, but as you
say otherwise to take any real power isn't plausible.

I think his mistake was he went on a light entertainment TV prog
like "Nationwide" and bragged about it

Seem to remember something like this being mentioned by a lecturer at BBC
ETD. But before Nationwide. And IIRC, it was a farmer.

There have defiantly been publicised "art installations" in fields
under power lines using florescent tubes.
I can't see any difference in law between doing it at xMhz or 50Hz

--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%

On Wed, 09 Jan 2013 00:59:20 +0000, wrote:

On Wed, 09 Jan 2013 00:46:10 +0000, Graham.
wrote:


Apparently he was using the RF to light fluorescent tubes, but as you
say otherwise to take any real power isn't plausible.

There have defiantly been publicised "art installations" in fields
under power lines using florescent tubes.

Were they publicised despite a D notice ?

G.Harman

Oh look, it's even got its own domain name
http://www.d-e-f-i-n-i-t-e-l-y.com/

I don't get the connection with D-notices though

--
Graham.
%Profound_observation%

On Tuesday, January 8, 2013 3:09:11 PM UTC, Richard Tobin wrote:
In article ,

How about some kind of turbine powered by the movement of air?

I wondered about that, but when I investigated it I found a whole lot of evidence showing that it is completely impractical. Also, surely you would need a licence from the Met Office to abstract energy from the weather...

Bill

wrote in message
...
As we all struggle with our energy bills, perhaps we should look at ways
of obtaining energy without paying for it. I would think that various
members of this group will have ideas about how this could be done.
Those living near high voltage electricity transmission lines might be
able to abstract enough electricity by simply mounting fluorescent tubes
vertically. I wonder if some sort of aerial, if erected near enough to the
overhead cables, might pick up a decent supply. Possibly a very large
induction coil, running around the perimeter of the garden, might work.
And what about the telephone? There must be some electricity to tap there,
surely?
I can think of lots of other ways of getting electrity without paying for
it, but some of them carry significant risk.
What does the team think?

If you aren't on a water meter then perhaps a small turbine attached to your
bathroom tap might work....

--
Alex

There is a limit to the current you can use from the phone line, a few years
ago I believe someone was done for theft of electricity by BT due to them
using it to run a recharder for batteries. Some phones with low consumption
seem to work onit, but bigger ones need a psu.

Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"Dr Zoidberg" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
As we all struggle with our energy bills, perhaps we should look at ways
of obtaining energy without paying for it. I would think that various
members of this group will have ideas about how this could be done.
Those living near high voltage electricity transmission lines might be
able to abstract enough electricity by simply mounting fluorescent tubes
vertically. I wonder if some sort of aerial, if erected near enough to
the overhead cables, might pick up a decent supply. Possibly a very large
induction coil, running around the perimeter of the garden, might work.
And what about the telephone? There must be some electricity to tap
there, surely?
I can think of lots of other ways of getting electrity without paying for
it, but some of them carry significant risk.
What does the team think?

If you aren't on a water meter then perhaps a small turbine attached to
your bathroom tap might work....

--
Alex

In article ,
says...

As we all struggle with our energy bills, perhaps we should look at ways of obtaining energy without paying for it. I would think that various members of this group will have ideas about how this could be done.
Those living near high voltage electricity transmission lines might be able to abstract enough electricity by simply mounting fluorescent tubes vertically. I wonder if some sort of aerial, if erected near enough to the overhead cables, might pick up a decent supply. Possibly a very large induction coil, running around the perimeter of the garden, might work.
And what about the telephone? There must be some electricity to tap there, surely?
I can think of lots of other ways of getting electrity without paying for it, but some of them carry significant risk.
What does the team think?


This won't work these days in places that have earth leakage breakers
installed but we didn't have such obstructions to experimentation 50
years ago when we first tried this ...

What we did was to connect a step-up transformer between neutral and
earth in our workshop to derive a 9V supply which powered a transistor
radio 'for free' ...

What we never established for certain though, is if we really were
getting this power for free by effectively reducing the voltage drop on
the neutral, albeit by a very small ammount ...

--

Terry