New aerials/cables advice please

The setup that we inherited from the privious owners consists of 3 x aerials
attachet to the (same) chimney and poll with separate cables running to each
TV point. The aerials look very old and rusty, and so are the external
cables. We now can just about get a signal strong enough for freeview from
one of them. The other two appear to be dead (cables? connections? aerials?
all?).

A diagram of the current setup can be found he
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2lmuv86&s=3

With the painters coming over soon to paint the outside of the house
providing easy access to the chimney , we are looking to replace everything
with new aerial(s) and cables. TV point 3 is connected to Sky, but we would
like to have Freeview there as well as a back up. TV points 1 + 2 need to be
connected to Freeview only.

Before I go ahead and do it there are a few considerations that I would
appreciate if those in the know could comment on:

- Should I go for 1 or 3 aerials? If at all possible then I would rather
avoid having to use a distribution and/or amplifier box. This will probably
need to be housed in the attic space which will mean having to come in and
then out of the house again (only way to route the cables downstairs) +
having to work out a new power source there.
- Cable length. TV point 3 is at least 25 metres from the aerial. Would such
a run be ok without amplifying the signal along the way?
- Which cable should I use?
- Connector along the way. The wall socket of TV point 3 is connected to a
cable that runs under the house, and the new cable from the aerial will have
to be joined to it. What is the best way to do this (the connection will be
under the house)?

Many thanks in advance for any advice/suggestion/comments.

J.

- Should I go for 1 or 3 aerials?

1.

There was a long thread I started here about the problems that I had with
my parents 2 aerial setup.

1 aerial and a DA will save you much grief - I've now reached the point
with my parents setup that I've got a 4-way DA installed and just need to
persuade them to let me run a cable to the single TV on the other aerial
and disconnect it.

Al.

"Al" wrote in message
. 4...
- Should I go for 1 or 3 aerials?

1.

There was a long thread I started here about the problems that I had with
my parents 2 aerial setup.

1 aerial and a DA will save you much grief - I've now reached the point
with my parents setup that I've got a 4-way DA installed and just need to
persuade them to let me run a cable to the single TV on the other aerial
and disconnect it.

Al.

Sorry... What's a DA?

"JoeJoe" wrote in message
...

"Al" wrote in message
. 4...
- Should I go for 1 or 3 aerials?

1.

There was a long thread I started here about the problems that I had with
my parents 2 aerial setup.

1 aerial and a DA will save you much grief - I've now reached the point
with my parents setup that I've got a 4-way DA installed and just need to
persuade them to let me run a cable to the single TV on the other aerial
and disconnect it.

Al.

Sorry... What's a DA?

Distribution amplifier. Takes the signal from the aerial and amplifies the
signal then distributes it to several outputs.

Peter Crosland

There are aerial rigger pros here who hopefully will give you better
advice than myself - I am just an interested amateur whose field of
expertise really lies elswhere - but there are one or two things
that spring to mind ...

On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 12:01:42 +0100, "JoeJoe" wrote:

A diagram of the current setup can be found he
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2lmuv86&s=3

- Should I go for 1 or 3 aerials?

I'd say one ...

If at all possible then I would rather
avoid having to use a distribution and/or amplifier box. This will probably
need to be housed in the attic space which will mean having to come in and
then out of the house again (only way to route the cables downstairs) +
having to work out a new power source there.

AIUI, it's preferred to have cable indoors, so that aging under UV
light from the sun does not occur. Naturally, the part from the
aerial to the distribution amplifier must at least start outside, but
it's probably a good idea to keep the rest indoors if possible.

What sort of walls have you? Stone? Brick outer layer, block inner?
What's on the inside of them? Plaster? Plasterboarding? The answers
to these questions can make it easier (all things are relative he-)
to pull cables through inside the house or not. My house is a modern
brick outer, blockwork inner, with plasterboard on slats about 20mm
off the wall. This means that, albeit with a lot of fishing about and
cursing, I was able to drop new aerial cables down behind the
plasterboarding.

Although you can have a fused spur off a lighting circuit to power a
low current distribution amplifier, it would be vulnerable to spikes
caused by old light switches, etc. I used to have that arrangement,
but I've now run a spur from a bedroom power socket up to a power
socket in the attic, which means that I can protect the amp with a
plug-in spike protector - a better arrangement.

- Cable length. TV point 3 is at least 25 metres from the aerial. Would such
a run be ok without amplifying the signal along the way?

Rigger/trade pros should really answer this point.

- Which cable should I use?

The consensus here seems to be CAI Benchmarked xx100 cable, as that is
double insulated and better for keeping out interference ...
http://www.cai.org.uk/information/do...tegory&catid=4
You'll need double-insulated sockets to match.

http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/referen...100-dlead.html

- Connector along the way. The wall socket of TV point 3 is connected to a
cable that runs under the house, and the new cable from the aerial will have
to be joined to it. What is the best way to do this (the connection will be
under the house)?

Again, there seems to be a consensus on avoiding joins if possible, as
they are always cause some loss and are a weak point, particularly out
of doors. Can you not use the existing cable to pull through the
replacement in stages all the way to the wall socket?

======================================

Please always reply to news group as the email address in
this post's header does not exist. Alternatively, use one of the
contact addresses at:
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/JavaJive.html
http://www.macfh.co.uk/Macfarlane/Macfarlane.html

Well, you do not say if you have strong signals in your area, but i'd always
suggest one aerial and experiment fo the best place, then make it bomb
proof, ..

As for your power problems, well, I'd say this is probably not as much a
problem as you think.

Brian

--
Brian Gaff -
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"JoeJoe" wrote in message
o.uk...
The setup that we inherited from the privious owners consists of 3 x
aerials attachet to the (same) chimney and poll with separate cables
running to each TV point. The aerials look very old and rusty, and so are
the external cables. We now can just about get a signal strong enough for
freeview from one of them. The other two appear to be dead (cables?
connections? aerials? all?).

A diagram of the current setup can be found he
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2lmuv86&s=3

With the painters coming over soon to paint the outside of the house
providing easy access to the chimney , we are looking to replace
everything with new aerial(s) and cables. TV point 3 is connected to Sky,
but we would like to have Freeview there as well as a back up. TV points 1
+ 2 need to be connected to Freeview only.

Before I go ahead and do it there are a few considerations that I would
appreciate if those in the know could comment on:

- Should I go for 1 or 3 aerials? If at all possible then I would rather
avoid having to use a distribution and/or amplifier box. This will
probably need to be housed in the attic space which will mean having to
come in and then out of the house again (only way to route the cables
downstairs) + having to work out a new power source there.
- Cable length. TV point 3 is at least 25 metres from the aerial. Would
such a run be ok without amplifying the signal along the way?
- Which cable should I use?
- Connector along the way. The wall socket of TV point 3 is connected to a
cable that runs under the house, and the new cable from the aerial will
have to be joined to it. What is the best way to do this (the connection
will be under the house)?

Many thanks in advance for any advice/suggestion/comments.

J.

Distribution amplifier..
I have avoided the clever arese reply here..
Brian

--
Brian Gaff -
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"JoeJoe" wrote in message
...

"Al" wrote in message
. 4...
- Should I go for 1 or 3 aerials?

1.

There was a long thread I started here about the problems that I had with
my parents 2 aerial setup.

1 aerial and a DA will save you much grief - I've now reached the point
with my parents setup that I've got a 4-way DA installed and just need to
persuade them to let me run a cable to the single TV on the other aerial
and disconnect it.

Al.

Sorry... What's a DA?

"Java Jive" wrote in message
...
There are aerial rigger pros here who hopefully will give you better
advice than myself - I am just an interested amateur whose field of
expertise really lies elswhere - but there are one or two things
that spring to mind ...

On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 12:01:42 +0100, "JoeJoe" wrote:

A diagram of the current setup can be found he
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2lmuv86&s=3

- Should I go for 1 or 3 aerials?

I'd say one ...

If at all possible then I would rather
avoid having to use a distribution and/or amplifier box. This will
probably
need to be housed in the attic space which will mean having to come in
and
then out of the house again (only way to route the cables downstairs) +
having to work out a new power source there.

AIUI, it's preferred to have cable indoors, so that aging under UV
light from the sun does not occur. Naturally, the part from the
aerial to the distribution amplifier must at least start outside, but
it's probably a good idea to keep the rest indoors if possible.

What sort of walls have you? Stone? Brick outer layer, block inner?
What's on the inside of them? Plaster? Plasterboarding? The answers
to these questions can make it easier (all things are relative he-)
to pull cables through inside the house or not. My house is a modern
brick outer, blockwork inner, with plasterboard on slats about 20mm
off the wall. This means that, albeit with a lot of fishing about and
cursing, I was able to drop new aerial cables down behind the
plasterboarding.

Brick in and out with cavity. No chance of fishing anything... Tried that
before..


Although you can have a fused spur off a lighting circuit to power a
low current distribution amplifier, it would be vulnerable to spikes
caused by old light switches, etc. I used to have that arrangement,
but I've now run a spur from a bedroom power socket up to a power
socket in the attic, which means that I can protect the amp with a
plug-in spike protector - a better arrangement.


Would be tricky, as I cannot be botherred having to decorate again...

Would running ~10m or so cable from aerial to 1st point, putting amplifier
there, and distributing elsewhere be ok?


- Cable length. TV point 3 is at least 25 metres from the aerial. Would
such
a run be ok without amplifying the signal along the way?

Rigger/trade pros should really answer this point.

- Which cable should I use?

The consensus here seems to be CAI Benchmarked xx100 cable, as that is
double insulated and better for keeping out interference ...
http://www.cai.org.uk/information/do...tegory&catid=4
You'll need double-insulated sockets to match.

http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/referen...100-dlead.html

- Connector along the way. The wall socket of TV point 3 is connected to
a
cable that runs under the house, and the new cable from the aerial will
have
to be joined to it. What is the best way to do this (the connection will
be
under the house)?

Again, there seems to be a consensus on avoiding joins if possible, as
they are always cause some loss and are a weak point, particularly out
of doors. Can you not use the existing cable to pull through the
replacement in stages all the way to the wall socket?

Not really an option for me I am affraid... Cable connected to socket in
wall (number 3) is not long enough to reach even other TV points.

"Brian Gaff" wrote in message
news
Distribution amplifier..
I have avoided the clever arese reply here..
Brian

Would running ~10m or so cable from aerial to 1st point, putting amplifier
there, and distributing elsewhere be ok?

I'd rather leave answering your specific question to the pros.

Generally, it's usually best to put an amplifier as close as possible
to the aerial, hence Owain's suggestion of a masthead amplifier.
These, as their name suggests, are clamped 1-2m down the mast from the
aerial. As Owain has indicated, they are powered by DC superimposed
on the AC of the aerial signal itself. The DC often comes from a
suitable distribution amp - you'd either have to buy them as a
paired kit or check that the distribution amp can supply DC - or a
standalone PSU through which the aerial signal passes on the way to
the TV Wall Socket.

But it rather depends on your signal level. You may not actually need
a masthead amplifier if the rest of your system is up to scratch, in
which case putting one in would be a waste of money and I believe can
even be counter-productive.

It might be an idea to tell us what signal levels you get on a
Freeview box, then those here in the know will be able to give more
specific advice.

On Sat, 8 Aug 2009 13:44:25 +0100, "JoeJoe" wrote:

Would running ~10m or so cable from aerial to 1st point, putting amplifier
there, and distributing elsewhere be ok?

======================================

Please always reply to news group as the email address in
this post's header does not exist. Alternatively, use one of the
contact addresses at:
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/JavaJive.html
http://www.macfh.co.uk/Macfarlane/Macfarlane.html