Cant Get BBC4 on fringes of Rowridge

I live on the outer margins of Rowridge at BA12 6DG and theoretically
should not get any signal at all. However since the March 2009 frequency
changes on Rowridge things have improved so I can get most digital
terrestial channels including BBC 1,2 & 3.
However, BBC4, the one I really want, I just can't get.
A manual tune of Mux1 gives me 75% power and 100% quality (Humax 9200)
but does not find BBC4. An automatic tune gets it on an 800 range but it
is unwatchable.

Can anybody offer an explanation?

I know other transmitters are more local but they are behind hills.

DAvy

Davy wrote:
I live on the outer margins of Rowridge at BA12 6DG and theoretically
should not get any signal at all. However since the March 2009 frequency
changes on Rowridge things have improved so I can get most digital
terrestial channels including BBC 1,2 & 3.
However, BBC4, the one I really want, I just can't get.
A manual tune of Mux1 gives me 75% power and 100% quality (Humax 9200)
but does not find BBC4. An automatic tune gets it on an 800 range but it
is unwatchable.

Can anybody offer an explanation?

Yes, BBC 4 is on Mux B, UHF Ch 28 from Rowridge since March 2009.

Mux 1 carries the other BBC channels you refer to, on UHF Ch 34,

You're a very long way out to get DTT from Rowridge, some viewers a lot closer
have difficulty, but it's a long wait until March 2012 :-(

--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

www.paras.org.uk

I'm surprised that you can receive Rowridge at all, TBH - click
this, wait for your postcode to appear in the form and activity to
cease, then click 'Signal Path':
http://tinyurl.com/kn5c45
.... standing in for ...
http://www.macfh.co.uk/Test/UKTerres...w=M&iGridHow=C

What does the postcode checker suggest?
http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/

"You have already switched
Your most likely transmitter is Stockland Hill

Stockland Hill is in the West Country TV region and has already
switched."

Alternative Transmitters from the PC Checker ...

"Most likely transmitter - Stockland Hill West Country already
switched
* Variable
Up to 24 channels available

Alternative transmitter 1 - Mendip West
* Stage 1: 24 Mar 2010 - Stage 1
* Stage 2: 07 Apr 2010 - Stage 2
* Good
Up to 59 channels available

Alternative transmitter 2 - Rowridge VP Meridian 2012
* Good
Up to 18 channels available

Alternative transmitter 3 - Rowridge Meridian 2012
* Good
Up to 18 channels available"

How in a hundred FFs can the 'most likely' transmitter Stockland Hill
be 'variable' and the 'alternatives' all be 'good'???

In the version of the Calculator on my own PC, I have a test "Find
your best local TXs" routine getting somewhere near functional (though
I'll have to change it because it's hammering the terrain server too
much in its current mode of operation). It gives the right answer for
me at home and for my parents' old house in Cambridge, and a
reasonably sensible looking one that I can't check for an old address
of mine, but let's see how accurate it is in a blind test like this.
If it is to be believed, your best bets in probable order of signal
strength a

Analogue:
Winterborne Stickland
Cerne Abbas
Rampisham

DTT Pre DSO:
Mendip
Hannington
Rowridge

DTT Post DSO:
Stockland Hill
Cerne Abbas
Rampisham

Of these, looking at the profiles alone without looking at signal
strength, I'd've guessed Cerne Abbas for Analog now and DTT Post DSO,
and Mendip DTT Pre DSO. None of the DTT Pre DSO ones are line of
sight, but Mendip looks comfortably the best of the three. So, at
least my test routine seems to be in the right ball park.

Taking a majority decision, have a go at Stockland Hill first, then
Mendip if that's no go. You'll need a new aerial for Mendip though,
and while you're up the ladder doing that, make sure that you have
x100 CAI approved cable throughout.

Here's the info I have for ...

Stockland Hill (correct aerial group):
/* Stockland Hill */
var ST222014 =
[
{
type:"DTTPost",
itv:"West Country",
aergrp:"A",
aerpol:"H",
channels:[{name:"BBC
A",number:26,erp:50},{name:"D3&4",number:23,erp:50 },{name:"BBC
B",number:29,erp:50},{name:"SDN",number:25,erp:25} ,{name:"Arq
A",number:22,erp:25},{name:"Arq B",number:28,erp:25}]
}
]

Cerne Abbas (correct aerial group, wrong polarisation):
/* Cerne Abbas */
var ST645013 =
[
{
type:"Analog",
bbc:"West",
itv:"West",
aergrp:"A",
aerpol:"V",
aerht:282,
erp:0.1,

channels:[{name:"BBC1",number:22},{name:"BBC2",number:28},{n ame:"ITV",number:25},{name:"Ch4",number:32}]
},
{
type:"DTTPost",
itv:"West",
aergrp:"A",
aerpol:"V",
channels:[{name:"BBC
A",number:29,erp:0.08},{name:"D3&4",number:26,erp: 0.08},{name:"BBC
B",number:23,erp:0.08}]
}
]

Mendip (different aerial group):
/* Mendip */
var ST564488 =
[
{
type:"Analog",
itv:"Wales",
aergrp:"E",
aerpol:"H",
aerht:572,
erp:126,
channels:[{name:"Ch5",number:37}]
},
{
type:"Analog",
bbc:"West",
itv:"West",
aergrp:"C/D",
aerpol:"H",
aerht:600,
erp:500,

channels:[{name:"BBC1",number:58},{name:"BBC2",number:64},{n ame:"ITV",number:61},{name:"Ch4",number:54}]
},
{
type:"DTTPre",
itv:"West",
aergrp:"E/W",
aerpol:"H",
aerht:600,
channels:[{name:"Mux 1",number:59,erp:10},{name:"Mux
2",number:55,erp:10},{name:"Mux A",number:62,erp:10},{name:"Mux
B",number:65,erp:10},{name:"Mux C",number:56,erp:10},{name:"Mux
D",number:67,erp:10}]
},
{
type:"DTTPost",
itv:"West",
aergrp:"C/D",
aerpol:"H",
channels:[{name:"BBC
A",number:61,erp:100},{name:"D3&4",number:54,erp:1 00},{name:"BBC
B",number:58,erp:100},{name:"SDN",number:48,erp:10 0},{name:"NGW
A",number:52,erp:100},{name:"NGW B",number:56,erp:100}]
}
]

Rowridge, which confirms what Mark says:
/* Rowridge */
var SZ447865 =
[
{
type:"Analog",
bbc:"South",
itv:"Meridian",
aergrp:"A",
aerpol:"H",
aerht:279,
erp:500,

channels:[{name:"BBC1",number:31},{name:"BBC2",number:24},{n ame:"ITV",number:27},{name:"Ch4",number:21}]
},
{
type:"DTTPre",
itv:"Meridian",
aergrp:"A",
aerpol:"H",
aerht:260,
channels:[{name:"Mux 1",number:37,erp:20},{name:"Mux
2",number:32,erp:20},{name:"Mux A",number:30,erp:20},{name:"Mux
B",number:28,erp:20},{name:"Mux C",number:34,erp:20},{name:"Mux
D",number:33,erp:20}]
},
{
type:"DTTPost",
itv:"Meridian",
aergrp:"A",
aerpol:"H",
channels:[{name:"PSB 1",number:21,erp:200},{name:"PSB
2",number:24,erp:200},{name:"PSB 3",number:27,erp:200},{name:"Com
A",number:22,erp:50},{name:"Com B",number:25,erp:50},{name:"Com
C",number:28,erp:50}],
notes:"Rowridge will broadcast both horizontally and
vertically polarised signals for all six multiplexes after switchover.
All vertically polarised signals will be at an ERP of 200kW. The
horizontally polarised signals will be broadcast at 200 kW on channels
21, 24 & 27, and 50kW on channels 22, 25 & 28."
},
{
type:"DTTPost",
itv:"Meridian",
aergrp:"A",
aerpol:"V",
channels:[{name:"PSB 1",number:21,erp:200},{name:"PSB
2",number:24,erp:200},{name:"PSB 3",number:27,erp:200},{name:"Com
A",number:22,erp:200},{name:"Com B",number:25,erp:200},{name:"Com
C",number:28,erp:200}]
}
]

If you want to do some more checking yourself, from the log of the
test routine here's a list of transmitters sorted by distance to 100km
out from your postcode, the 8 marked with an asterisk have DTT Pre DSO
transmissions:
Crockerton, ST877428: 12.35km
Donhead, ST907230: 12.99km
Bruton, ST680341: 13.61km
Frome, ST778481: 16.38km
Sutton Row, ST976284: 16.56km
Chitterne, ST995441: 21.64km
Till Valley, SU066370: 25.60km
Winterborne Stickland, ST838051: 27.14km
West Lavington, ST999525: 27.46km
Westwood, ST816597: 27.56km
Shrewton, SU072438: 28.25km
Mendip, ST564488: 30.10km*
Salisbury, SU136285: 32.34km*
Bath, ST769654: 33.57km
Cheselbourne, SY768985: 33.96km
Piddletrenthide, SY704989: 35.03km
Cerne Abbas, ST645013: 35.20km
Box, ST832688: 36.70km
Corsham, ST869699: 38.15km
Upavon, SU145518: 38.44km
Ubley, ST538594: 38.84km
Chilfrome, SY579991: 40.58km
Rampisham, ST544008: 41.41km
Calne, ST997699: 41.93km
Poulner, SU145053: 42.56km
Crewkerne, ST444092: 43.59km
Beaminster, ST490024: 44.03km
Burrington, ST477605: 44.10km
Canford Heath, SZ036939: 44.18km
Bovington, SY844878: 44.44km
Bristol Warmley, ST654736: 44.47km
Tidworth, SU228488: 44.56km
Bristol Ilchester Crescent, ST577700: 44.70km*
Siston, ST668744: 44.73km
Bristol Barton House, ST611729: 45.57km
Poole, SZ037921: 45.80km
Winterbourne Steepleton, SY629893: 46.69km
Luscombe Valley, SZ047908: 47.42km
Westbourne, SZ067916: 47.75km
Bristol Montpelier, ST590745: 47.95km
Bincombe Hill, SY687848: 49.03km
Preston, SY707833: 50.01km
Backwell, ST498716: 50.60km
Lulworth, SY824815: 50.65km
Corfe Castle, SY972821: 52.45km
Hutton, ST361588: 52.62km
Bristol Kings Weston Hill, ST547775: 52.67km*
Portbury, ST501751: 53.19km
Marlborough, SU209688: 53.84km
Bridport, SY453915: 54.40km
Chideock, SY412933: 55.95km
Weymouth, SY663778: 56.42km
Chisbury, SU274651: 56.53km
Kewstoke, ST347639: 56.53km
Ogbourne St George, SU205731: 56.58km
Easter Compton, ST566830: 56.62km
Portishead, ST458764: 56.84km
Redcliff Bay, ST439751: 57.07km
Charmouth, SY373933: 58.82km
Millbrook, SU374138: 58.86km
Hurstbourne Tarrant, SU377533: 60.08km
Chiseldon, SU190801: 60.90km
Aldbourne, SU262752: 62.09km
Dursley, ST788963: 64.22km
Hythe (Hants), SU421087: 65.00km
Seagry Court, SU149881: 65.19km
Avening, ST881975: 65.70km
Stockland Hill, ST222014: 66.77km
Nailsworth, ST849990: 66.95km
North Winchester, SU486355: 67.22km
Chepstow, ST544939: 67.43km
Kilve, ST143425: 67.96km
Hatch Bottom, SU486193: 68.35km
Chalford, SO882017: 69.89km
Lambourn, SU333794: 70.14km
Chalford Vale, SO886024: 70.62km
Beer, SY230896: 72.31km
Fawley, SU473022: 72.32km
Honiton, SY164997: 72.71km
Culm Valley, ST108148: 72.77km
Monksilver, ST085362: 73.08km
Tintern, SO538002: 73.47km
Slad, SO872055: 73.58km
Hannington, SU527568: 75.38km*
Stroud, SO836077: 75.59km
Cirencester, SP004057: 75.96km
Branscombe, SY195882: 75.97km
Washford, ST058409: 76.17km
Blakeney, SO664069: 76.26km
Pillowell, SO625065: 76.74km
St Briavels, SO557049: 77.19km
Rowridge, SZ447865: 77.98km*
Parkend, SO616083: 78.71km
Roadwater, ST026375: 79.05km
Upper Soudley, SO662101: 79.44km
Clearwell, SO574084: 79.97km
Brighstone, SZ435816: 80.01km
Carhampton, ST016426: 80.55km
Usk, SO384006: 80.88km
Sidmouth, SY136879: 81.01km
Redbrook, SO538092: 81.88km
Risca, ST240906: 81.98km
Wenvoe, ST110742: 82.07km*
Coleford, SO569106: 82.22km
Mynydd Machen, ST223900: 82.76km
Machen Upper, ST211897: 83.41km
Wattsville, ST215911: 84.10km
Van Terrace, ST168864: 84.42km
Bampton, SS966236: 85.30km
Pontypool, ST284990: 85.36km*
Monmouth, SO526127: 85.58km
Cwmfelinfach, ST184909: 86.20km
Llanfach, ST217947: 86.52km
Lydbrook, SO600163: 86.86km
Taffs Well, ST123848: 86.93km
Woodcombe, SS951458: 87.44km
Pennar, ST209958: 87.87km
Andoversford, SP002183: 88.17km
Cwm Ffrwd-Oer, SO265014: 88.42km
Crumlin, ST228984: 88.50km
Mynydd Bach, ST168926: 88.53km
Wootton Courtenay, SS934426: 88.69km
Abertridwr, ST123885: 89.22km
Brushford, SS921262: 89.57km
Tiverton, SS939126: 89.72km
Horndean, SU698152: 89.94km
Llanhilleth, SO213003: 90.92km
Alton, SU722386: 90.96km
Brading, SZ612872: 91.52km
Blaenavon, SO277063: 91.60km
Abertillery, SO224023: 91.72km
Budleigh Salterton, SY043825: 91.76km
Ventnor, SZ567783: 92.51km
Luccombe, SZ581800: 92.69km
Aberbeeg, SO215029: 92.75km
Pontypridd, ST084904: 93.45km
Porlock, SS883462: 94.22km
Blaenau Gwent, SO215049: 94.29km
Ross-On-Wye, SO605243: 94.52km
Guiting Power, SP101233: 95.55km
Pennsylvania, SX934948: 95.66km
Abercynon, ST093952: 95.84km
Treharris, ST103964: 95.89km
Bargoed, SO145010: 96.06km
Llanharan, SS998832: 96.32km
Gelli-fendigaid, ST070935: 96.49km
Llanfoist, SO308143: 96.53km
Exford, SS847379: 96.94km
Tonyrefail, ST009874: 97.70km
Blaina, SO196083: 98.12km
Icomb Hill, SP201228: 98.55km
Deri, SO121022: 98.59km
Ebbw Vale South, SO176073: 98.63km
Abergavenny, SO244126: 98.65km
Trebanog, ST020906: 98.66km
Porth, ST029919: 98.71km
Bedlinog, SO102005: 98.75km
Penrhiwceiber, ST066966: 98.80km
South Tredegar, SO155060: 99.03km
Winchcombe, SP036287: 99.06km
Ascott Under Wychwood, SP287193: 99.14km
Ynysowen, ST082992: 99.33km
Clydach, SO227125: 99.56km
Rhymney, SO127043: 99.68km
Hemdean, SU710762: 99.79km
Exeter St Thomas, SX898922: 99.99km

HTHs

On Sun, 26 Jul 2009 14:46:18 -0500, Davy
wrote:

I live on the outer margins of Rowridge at BA12 6DG and theoretically
should not get any signal at all.

======================================

Please always reply to news group as the email address in
this post's header does not exist. Alternatively, use one of the
contact addresses at:
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/JavaJive.html
http://www.macfh.co.uk/Macfarlane/Macfarlane.html

Davy wrote in
09.145:

I live on the outer margins of Rowridge at BA12 6DG and theoretically
should not get any signal at all. However since the March 2009
frequency changes on Rowridge things have improved so I can get most
digital terrestial channels including BBC 1,2 & 3.
However, BBC4, the one I really want, I just can't get.
A manual tune of Mux1 gives me 75% power and 100% quality (Humax 9200)
but does not find BBC4. An automatic tune gets it on an 800 range but
it is unwatchable.

Can anybody offer an explanation?

I know other transmitters are more local but they are behind hills.

DAvy

Thanks guy for your replies. But no-one has really answered my question
as to why it is just BBC4 missing from Mux1?

DAvy

Mark answered it.

On Mon, 27 Jul 2009 14:49:08 -0500, Davy
wrote:

Thanks guy for your replies. But no-one has really answered my question
as to why it is just BBC4 missing from Mux1?

======================================

Please always reply to news group as the email address in
this post's header does not exist. Alternatively, use one of the
contact addresses at:
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/JavaJive.html
http://www.macfh.co.uk/Macfarlane/Macfarlane.html

On Mon, 27 Jul 2009 14:49:08 -0500, Davy
wrote:

Davy wrote in
. 109.145:

I live on the outer margins of Rowridge at BA12 6DG and theoretically
should not get any signal at all. However since the March 2009
frequency changes on Rowridge things have improved so I can get most
digital terrestial channels including BBC 1,2 & 3.
However, BBC4, the one I really want, I just can't get.
A manual tune of Mux1 gives me 75% power and 100% quality (Humax 9200)
but does not find BBC4. An automatic tune gets it on an 800 range but
it is unwatchable.

Can anybody offer an explanation?

I know other transmitters are more local but they are behind hills.

DAvy

Thanks guy for your replies. But no-one has really answered my question
as to why it is just BBC4 missing from Mux1?

There isn't space for it on Mux1. It isn't the only BBC TV channel
"missing" from Mux1.

Also on MuxB are BBC Parliament and the BBCi (Red Button) channels 301
and 302.

The full list of services carried by each Rowridge Mux is given he
http://www.ukfree.tv/txdetail.php?a=SZ447865&PGSTART=0


--
Peter Duncanson
(in uk.tech.digital-tv)

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Davy wrote:


Thanks guy for your replies. But no-one has really answered my
question as to why it is just BBC4 missing from Mux1?

DAvy

Yes they have! Mark Carver pointed out that BBC4 isn't on Mux1 - it's on Mux
B.

Well, (covered in embarrassment) so the reason
why I can't see BBC4 on MUX1 is cos it is on
MUX4 !
As predicted by the those who replied, I can't
find ANY channels on MUX4. Yet Rowridge
transmit it at the same power and mode as MUX1
- which I can receive reasonably well.
Anyway thanks guys for pointing out my goof.

I can think of two differences between Mux1 and
4 from Rowridge:
One is that MUX4 has the lowest channel number
(28) and frequency of the Rowridge muxes. Gain
curves for a typical high gain group A aerial
like mine show that it will be 2db down at
channel 28. 2db might not sound much but I am
right on the fringe of the area.
The second is that Stockland Hill (my nearest
transmitter which has just converted and is at
approx 130deg off beam) uses the range 22-29
including 28. So I might be getting
interference on channel 28 from Stockland Hill?

Dont know which of these, if any, theories are
likely to be correct. Any thoughts anyone?

DAvy

Davy wrote:

The second is that Stockland Hill (my nearest
transmitter which has just converted and is at
approx 130deg off beam) uses the range 22-29
including 28. So I might be getting
interference on channel 28 from Stockland Hill?

Very likely, since Stockland's DSO a couple of months ago, its DTT
signals have been reported to have been received as far away as Swindon !

Ch 28 is used for COM 3

--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

http://www.paras.org.uk/

"Davy" wrote in message
. 109.145...
(28) and frequency of the Rowridge muxes. Gain
curves for a typical high gain group A aerial
like mine show that it will be 2db down at
channel 28. 2db might not sound much but I am
right on the fringe of the area.

2dB relative to what? I would have though a normal Gp aerial would be very
efficient on ch28.

Bill