A half-mute button?

Kishin wrote:
"Anthony Buckland" wrote in message
...
When the commercials (frequently louder than the program)
come on, there are basically two choices:
1) put up with them, and then you'll know when the program
restarts;
2) mute them, and then you have to watch them so you'll
know when the program restarts.

What I'd like is a most-of-the-way mute button, so that I
could listen to a nice quiet version of the commercial sound,
so that .... right, you guessed.

About the best I can do in this regard is to drastically
reduce the volume, which takes time, and then ramp it
back up when the program restarts, which takes time,
risks missing a bit of dialog or effects, and involves
being careful about stopping at the original volume level.

21st-century technology should be able to solve this
problem.

How about 20th century technology? Some TVs (Magnavox, I think) keep the
volume level constant, turning down the loud commercials to the volume of
the shows. It's a simple technology (doing this with an electric guitar you
use a device called a Compressor), and I'm surprised more TVs don't do it.

--

Kishin




My Sony has it, and I have confidence this otherwise useless feature
would work fine if I didn't skip past the commercials.

--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'

Charlie Hoffpauir wrote:
On Sun, 5 Apr 2009 18:15:57 -0700, "Anthony Buckland"
wrote:

When the commercials (frequently louder than the program)
come on, there are basically two choices:
1) put up with them, and then you'll know when the program
restarts;
2) mute them, and then you have to watch them so you'll
know when the program restarts.

What I'd like is a most-of-the-way mute button, so that I
could listen to a nice quiet version of the commercial sound,
so that .... right, you guessed.

About the best I can do in this regard is to drastically
reduce the volume, which takes time, and then ramp it
back up when the program restarts, which takes time,
risks missing a bit of dialog or effects, and involves
being careful about stopping at the original volume level.


Actually, the problem was solved years ago.... it's called DVRs. Just
record everything you want to watch, and then when watching it, fast
forward through the commercials.

Then you still have to watch the commercials to know when to get off the
fast-forward button & back onto the play button...

(admittedly you don't have to listen to them, and they're gone faster)

I've found the 30-second skip button only partially useful as many
commercial breaks are not an exact multiple of 30 seconds in length.



It does kinda beg the question, if people keep going to DVRs, when does
the point hit when advertisers are no longer getting enough "eyeballs"
to pay enough for the airtime to keep the programs on the air? Do we
hit a point where *every* channel is a premium channel? (with an extra
charge on your cable/satellite bill)

Or are we going to see a return to the advertising structure we saw in
radio before World War II, where there wasn't that much 30-second spot
advertising -- but a "sponsor" sponsored an entire program, and in
return got frequent mention *during* the program? (we're already seeing
quite a bit of that during "reality" shows. I suspect we'll be seeing
more.)

--

Doug Smith W9WI
Pleasant View, TN EM66

On Mon, 06 Apr 2009 09:43:41 -0500, sorry-spammers
""w9wi\"@(sorry-spammers)" wrote:

Charlie Hoffpauir wrote:
On Sun, 5 Apr 2009 18:15:57 -0700, "Anthony Buckland"
wrote:

When the commercials (frequently louder than the program)
come on, there are basically two choices:
1) put up with them, and then you'll know when the program
restarts;
2) mute them, and then you have to watch them so you'll
know when the program restarts.

What I'd like is a most-of-the-way mute button, so that I
could listen to a nice quiet version of the commercial sound,
so that .... right, you guessed.

About the best I can do in this regard is to drastically
reduce the volume, which takes time, and then ramp it
back up when the program restarts, which takes time,
risks missing a bit of dialog or effects, and involves
being careful about stopping at the original volume level.


Actually, the problem was solved years ago.... it's called DVRs. Just
record everything you want to watch, and then when watching it, fast
forward through the commercials.

Then you still have to watch the commercials to know when to get off the
fast-forward button & back onto the play button...

(admittedly you don't have to listen to them, and they're gone faster)

I've found the 30-second skip button only partially useful as many
commercial breaks are not an exact multiple of 30 seconds in length.



It does kinda beg the question, if people keep going to DVRs, when does
the point hit when advertisers are no longer getting enough "eyeballs"
to pay enough for the airtime to keep the programs on the air? Do we
hit a point where *every* channel is a premium channel? (with an extra
charge on your cable/satellite bill)

Or are we going to see a return to the advertising structure we saw in
radio before World War II, where there wasn't that much 30-second spot
advertising -- but a "sponsor" sponsored an entire program, and in
return got frequent mention *during* the program? (we're already seeing
quite a bit of that during "reality" shows. I suspect we'll be seeing
more.)


Some interesting points....

1. with my DVRs, if you fast forward at "fast" (there are 4 levels of
fast forward, call them whatever but the "next" to fastest I'm calling
"fast") until you see the "program" again and then hit "play" the DVR
backs up just enough so that you get the very end of the commercial,
then the program starts again. The amount that the DVR backs up is
dependent on the speed at which you fast forward, at the lowest speed,
it backs up little or none, at 2x a bit more, at 3x more still, and at
4x it backs up for nearly an entire 30 sec commercial. So depending on
your reflexes, this all might not work well for you. For me, the 3x
works perfectly, the 4x backs up too much, and at 2x it doesn't seem
to back up far enough.

I also find the 30 second skip button ineffective.

2. I agree that we're probably heading to "commercials" embedded in
the content. So long as they don't increase the volume when they show
a product, I really don't mind. In fact, I enjoy watching cop shows
and figuring our who the auto sponsor is by which brand of car the
good guys drive.

I also really don't mind if they start charging me for the shows I
watch.... provided they don't make me sit through commercials as well.
When they started showing a bunch of commercials at movie theaters it
really turned me off of going to movies. I also think that unless they
go to "a la carte" selection of paid content, it won't be accepted by
the public.

"Free" anything doesn't seem to work for very long... just look at the
spam we have on the internet! It there were some way to charge for
every email message (or usenet post) there would be a lot less spam.

Charlie Hoffpauir wrote:

"Free" anything doesn't seem to work for very long... just look at the
spam we have on the internet! It there were some way to charge for
every email message (or usenet post) there would be a lot less spam.


True, unlimited outbox quotas contribute to spam, but also are the bogus
email accounts, either hijacked from legit users or created by email
admins in cahoots with a spammer/scammer.

--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'

"Anthony Buckland" wrote in message
...
When the commercials (frequently louder than the program)
come on, there are basically two choices:
1) put up with them, and then you'll know when the program
restarts;
2) mute them, and then you have to watch them so you'll
know when the program restarts.

What I'd like is a most-of-the-way mute button, so that I
could listen to a nice quiet version of the commercial sound,
so that .... right, you guessed.

About the best I can do in this regard is to drastically
reduce the volume, which takes time, and then ramp it
back up when the program restarts, which takes time,
risks missing a bit of dialog or effects, and involves
being careful about stopping at the original volume level.

21st-century technology should be able to solve this
problem.


Many receivers will allow you to set the db level for muting. I have
a Denon that works like this. My normal listening level is at
about -18 to -20, mute is set for -35. It also allows you to set the
db level at power up instead of where it was last left at when turned
off.

Anthony Buckland wrote:
When the commercials (frequently louder than the program)
come on, there are basically two choices:
1) put up with them, and then you'll know when the program
restarts;
2) mute them, and then you have to watch them so you'll
know when the program restarts.

What I'd like is a most-of-the-way mute button, so that I
could listen to a nice quiet version of the commercial sound,
so that .... right, you guessed.


My JVC car stereo has this feature built into the power button: hit it
quickly and the volume goes to a very low level. Hit it again and it
comes back to where it was. Trouble is that to turn the thing off, you
have to hold the button for a few seconds. So ideally it should be a
separate button!

On Apr 6, 1:55*pm, Charlie Hoffpauir wrote:
On Mon, 06 Apr 2009 09:43:41 -0500, sorry-spammers





""w9wi\"@(sorry-spammers)" wrote:
Charlie Hoffpauir wrote:
On Sun, 5 Apr 2009 18:15:57 -0700, "Anthony Buckland"
wrote:

When the commercials (frequently louder than the program)
come on, there are basically two choices:
1) put up with them, and then you'll know when the program
* *restarts;
2) mute them, and then you have to watch them so you'll
* *know when the program restarts.

What I'd like is a most-of-the-way mute button, so that I
could listen to a nice quiet version of the commercial sound,
so that .... right, you guessed.

About the best I can do in this regard is to drastically
reduce the volume, which takes time, and then ramp it
back up when the program restarts, which takes time,
risks missing a bit of dialog or effects, and involves
being careful about stopping at the original volume level.

Actually, the problem was solved years ago.... it's called DVRs. Just
record everything you want to watch, and then when watching it, fast
forward through the commercials.

Then you still have to watch the commercials to know when to get off the
fast-forward button & back onto the play button...

(admittedly you don't have to listen to them, and they're gone faster)

I've found the 30-second skip button only partially useful as many
commercial breaks are not an exact multiple of 30 seconds in length.

It does kinda beg the question, if people keep going to DVRs, when does
the point hit when advertisers are no longer getting enough "eyeballs"
to pay enough for the airtime to keep the programs on the air? *Do we
hit a point where *every* channel is a premium channel? *(with an extra
charge on your cable/satellite bill)

Or are we going to see a return to the advertising structure we saw in
radio before World War II, where there wasn't that much 30-second spot
advertising -- but a "sponsor" sponsored an entire program, and in
return got frequent mention *during* the program? *(we're already seeing
quite a bit of that during "reality" shows. *I suspect we'll be seeing
more.)

Some interesting points....

1. *with my DVRs, if you fast forward at "fast" (there are 4 levels of
fast forward, call them whatever but the "next" to fastest I'm calling
"fast") until you see the "program" again and then hit "play" the DVR
backs up just enough so that you get the very end of the commercial,
then the program starts again. The amount that the DVR backs up is
dependent on the speed at which you fast forward, at the lowest speed,
it backs up little or none, at 2x a bit more, at 3x more still, and at
4x it backs up for nearly an entire 30 sec commercial. So depending on
your reflexes, this all might not work well for you. For me, the 3x
works perfectly, the 4x backs up too much, and at 2x it doesn't seem
to back up far enough.

I also find the 30 second skip button ineffective.

2. I agree that we're probably heading to "commercials" embedded in
the content. So long as they don't increase the volume when they show
a product, I really don't mind. In fact, I enjoy watching cop shows
and figuring our who the auto sponsor is by which brand of car the
good guys drive.

I also really don't mind if they start charging me for the shows I
watch.... provided they don't make me sit through commercials as well.
When they started showing a bunch of commercials at movie theaters it
really turned me off of going to movies. I also think that unless they
go to "a la carte" selection of paid content, it won't be accepted by
the public.

"Free" anything doesn't seem to work for very long... just look at the
spam we have on the internet! It there were some way to charge for
every email message (or usenet post) there would be a lot less spam.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Just for what its worth...

My discontinued Sony HD DVR has the "skip back after fast forward"
feature as well. Like yours the "skip back" differs based on the fast
forward speed. But I can also select the amount of skip back for each
speed. Once I tuned the system for my reflexes, I can fast forward
through commercial breaks at 30x or 90x, hit play when I see the show,
and pretty much be right where I want to be.

Alternately, my "skip forward" and "skip backwards" buttons are
configurable as well. I set the forward for 1 minute and the
backwards for 15 seconds. At a commercial break, I can skip forward
in one minute increments until I see the program, and then skip back
to the start of the segment.

I've used both mechanisms effectively to painlessly skip commercials.
In conjunction with the mute button (I use a universal remote), the
entire procedure is fast and painless. i.e. mutes-fs-fs-f(see
program)s-bs-b(see comercial)wait a momentunmute or
muteffffff(wait for end of comercial at 30x)playunmute

Dan (Woj...)

"dmaster" wrote

Just for what its worth...

My discontinued Sony HD DVR has the "skip back after fast forward"
feature as well. Like yours the "skip back" differs based on the fast
forward speed.

(for Charlie, too):


Interesting... I was under the impression only Tivos had this [patented?]
feature. My Dish DVRs don't have it, and it's sorely missed.

On Wed, 8 Apr 2009 11:10:09 -0400, "Kalarama"
wrote:

"dmaster" wrote

Just for what its worth...

My discontinued Sony HD DVR has the "skip back after fast forward"
feature as well. Like yours the "skip back" differs based on the fast
forward speed.

(for Charlie, too):


Interesting... I was under the impression only Tivos had this [patented?]
feature. My Dish DVRs don't have it, and it's sorely missed.


Actually, the DirecTV HD DVR model 20 did NOT have this feature when
it first came out. It was added (as were many features) with a
software upgrade (downloaded automatically). This feature makes the
HR20 (and 21) an acceptable DVR. I always rated it as unacceptable
until it was added, and after it was added, I eliminated my DirecTivo
HD DVR (HR10-250).

My understanding was that it was also a patented feature. My "guess"
is that because of the relationship Tivo has with DirecTV, they have
licensed this technology, whereas Dish has not. Of course, they could
just add it anyway, but with the current litigation, that isn't
likely.

Thanks

"Charlie Hoffpauir" wroteInteresting... I was under
the impression only Tivos had this [patented?]
feature. My Dish DVRs don't have it, and it's sorely missed.

Actually, the DirecTV HD DVR model 20 did NOT have this feature when
it first came out. It was added (as were many features) with a
software upgrade (downloaded automatically). This feature makes the
HR20 (and 21) an acceptable DVR. I always rated it as unacceptable
until it was added, and after it was added, I eliminated my DirecTivo
HD DVR (HR10-250).
My understanding was that it was also a patented feature. My "guess"
is that because of the relationship Tivo has with DirecTV, they have
licensed this technology, whereas Dish has not. Of course, they could
just add it anyway, but with the current litigation, that isn't
likely.