Poor Freeview EPG Layouts

I've just purchased a new Proline TV with built in freeview.

Happy with the TV but the EPG in awful compared to my old Netgem STB
which is effectively redundant now.

One doesn't often get to view the EPG until the device comes out of the
box and gets switched on but with more and more channels available the
layout is quite important.

Geoff Lane

"Geoff Lane" wrote in message
...
I've just purchased a new Proline TV with built in freeview.

Happy with the TV but the EPG in awful compared to my old Netgem STB which
is effectively redundant now.

One doesn't often get to view the EPG until the device comes out of the
box and gets switched on but with more and more channels available the
layout is quite important.

Geoff Lane

I am disappointed with the no "now" and "next" on a Samsung TV when
I change channels. If they can do it on a freeview box, why not a TV?

On 08/11/2008, Geoff Lane wrote in message :

One doesn't often get to view the EPG until the device comes out of the
box and gets switched on but with more and more channels available the
layout is quite important.

Yep. As someone who designs user interfaces professionally, I think the
general public is going to become more and more savvy about what makes a
good user interface. Some of the current ones, as you point out, suck.

I hope that screenshots of EPGs and menus become part of the standard
advertising of such devices.

Simon.
--
http://www.hearsay.demon.co.uk

In message , Simon Slavin
. uk wrote
On 08/11/2008, Geoff Lane wrote in message :

One doesn't often get to view the EPG until the device comes out of the
box and gets switched on but with more and more channels available the
layout is quite important.

Yep. As someone who designs user interfaces professionally, I think the
general public is going to become more and more savvy about what makes a
good user interface. Some of the current ones, as you point out, suck.


I own a Topfield Freeview PVR where the EPG screens and functionality
can be changed by the use of third party applications (software). As a
result there are many replacement EPG that can be tried out but I doubt
if there is a consensus on what makes a good screen/menu.

I personally find the default screen poor because of:

The colours used. For instance, white or yellow text on a light blue
background or visa-versa. The light grey on dark grey is a nice idea! I
no longer have perfect eyesight and prefer higher contrasts between text
and background.

The fonts that have been used and are unsuitable for an interlaced CRT
TV. Some horizontal lines are only 'one pixel/ one line' wide and only
appear one field in the frame i.e. they tend to flash at 25Hz.

There isn't enough information shown on the screen. I prefer to see 3
hour of EPG for 10 channels all on a single screen.

Some of the replacement screens are, in my opinion, equally as bad,
especially those that have used a shaded background in order to give a
3D type of effect. These again cut down the contrast ratio for those
with less than perfect eyesight.

A good font for text that can easily be seen against the background is
often considered to be old fashioned by modern GUI designers who prefer
eye candy over content. (If they had their own way everything would be
replaced by meaningless icons instead of readable text)



--
Alan
news2006 {at} amac {dot} f2s {dot} com

On Nov 9, 11:12*pm, Alan wrote:
In message , Simon Slavin
. uk wrote

On 08/11/2008, Geoff Lane wrote in message :

One doesn't often get to view the EPG until the device comes out of the
box and gets switched on but with more and more channels available the
layout is quite important.

Yep. *As someone who designs user interfaces professionally, I think the
general public is going to become more and more savvy about what makes a
good user interface. *Some of the current ones, as you point out, suck..

I own a Topfield Freeview PVR where the EPG screens and functionality
can be changed by the use of third party applications (software). *As a
result there are many replacement EPG that can be tried out but I doubt
if there is a consensus on what makes a good screen/menu.

I personally find the default screen poor because of:

The colours used. For instance, white or yellow text on a light blue
background or visa-versa. The light grey on dark grey is a nice idea! *I
no longer have perfect eyesight and prefer higher contrasts between text
and background.

The fonts that have been used and are unsuitable for an interlaced CRT
TV. Some horizontal lines are only 'one pixel/ one line' wide and only
appear one field in the frame i.e. they tend to flash at 25Hz.

There isn't enough information shown on the screen. I prefer to see 3
hour of EPG for 10 channels all on a single screen.

Some of the replacement screens are, in my opinion, *equally as bad,
especially those that have used a shaded background in order to give a
3D type of effect. These again cut down the contrast ratio for those
with less than perfect eyesight.

A good font for text that can easily be seen against the background is
often considered to be old fashioned by modern GUI designers who prefer
eye candy over content. (If they had their own way everything would be
replaced by meaningless icons instead of readable text)

--
Alan
news2006 {at} amac {dot} f2s {dot} com

Agree with the original tenor of this post - EPG layout varies hugely,
and some of the "good" TV / STB manufacturers still manage to produce
awful EPGs.

My favourite ever EPG is on the Thomson DHD 4000 PVR. Top left is
filled with programme description, top right shows the currently
channel playing (with sound) so that you're not disrupting your
viewing whilst seeing the EPG. Then the bottom left to right shows 5
channels with the start / end time. The channel list can be edited so
that similar channels are grouped together.

My TV (Pana Viera 32in LCD) is very poor by comparising - a simply
grid of programmes showing about 12 channels. You need a further
press (i) to bring up detailed info, and the sound and picture of the
currently watched channel disappear even when viewing the guide
simply.

Even good ol' teletext / ceefax usually had a "transparent" view, or
half screen so that your viewing pleasure wasn't interrupted by
checking the TV guide.

I'm more surprised that all manafacturers haven't gravitated towards a
single "style". Obviously there are too many programmers around....

Matt

My TV (Pana Viera 32in LCD) is very poor by comparising - a simply
grid of programmes showing about 12 channels. *You need a further
press (i) to bring up detailed info, and the sound and picture of the
currently watched channel disappear even when viewing the guide
simply.

Interesting to see how people have differing preferences.
I actually find the EPG layout on my Panasonic Viera excellent,
certainly compared to the Sony my M.I.L has.

I suppose it just proves that you can please some of the people some
of the time.........

On 10 Nov, 13:54, Brian wrote:
My TV (Pana Viera 32in LCD) is very poor by comparising - a simply
grid of programmes showing about 12 channels. *You need a further
press (i) to bring up detailed info, and the sound and picture of the
currently watched channel disappear even when viewing the guide
simply.

Interesting to see how people have differing preferences.
I actually find the EPG layout on my Panasonic Viera excellent,
certainly compared to the Sony my M.I.L has.

I suppose it just proves that you can please some of the people some
of the time.........

Trust me, if you've ever used the Thomson DHD4000 you'll never be
satisfied with another!!

To be honest, though, you are right - its horses for courses. Perhaps
the panacea is to have STB's and iDTVs shipped with several optional
layouts, and we get to choose the one we like.

Matt

larkim wrote:

To be honest, though, you are right - its horses for courses. Perhaps
the panacea is to have STB's and iDTVs shipped with several optional
layouts, and we get to choose the one we like.

All I'd like is to be able to alter the order the programs are displayed.

Geoff Lane

On Dec 8, 10:52*am, Kay Robinson wrote:
On Sat, 08 Nov 2008 15:45:51 +0000, Geoff Lane
sharpened a new quill and scratched:

I've just purchased a new Proline TV with built in freeview.

Happy with the TV but the EPG in awful compared to my old Netgem STB
which is effectively redundant now.

One doesn't often get to view the EPG until the device comes out of the
box and gets switched on but with more and more channels available the
layout is quite important.

Geoff Lane

I've found the EPG varies considerably on the four different makes I
have, however, having said that I do have to be pretty bored to look
at the EPG. Like most people I buy a TV paper and choose the
programmes I want to watch via that medium and, when it comes to
recording, I always set the timer and include a little padding to
allow for early/late start/finish times. So I only really see the EPG
when those plonkers at the (name your channel) have decided to replace
the one I've selected to watch with some sport or political report at
short notice, leaving me to find something else to do or scan for
anything that may interest me. EPG, a very over-rated service IMO.

Kay

It needs civilization, it needs second thoughts,
to realise that Napoleon and Ceasar and Alexander
are not really the highest types of humanity,
that war making is not a glory but a crime

Do I assume that you don't have a PVR then? IMHO (very H!) PVRs are
no improvement over VCRs unless the EPG is used.

Matt

In article ,
Kay Robinson wrote:
I've found the EPG varies considerably on the four different makes I
have, however, having said that I do have to be pretty bored to look
at the EPG. Like most people I buy a TV paper and choose the
programmes I want to watch via that medium

I doubt it's most people by any stretch of the imagination. The days of
the Radio Times etc being in every household are long since gone. Its
circulation is well under 1 million.

To me most EPGs are a triumph of graphic design over practicality. All I
want is a simple text list. Rather like Teletext does - only faster.

The original on my Toppy is just fine for conveying what I need - unlike
just about every other one I've seen. The one on my Sony FreeView box is
pretty good too, though.

--
*El nino made me do it

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.