Digital TV and Tivo?

"John" shaped the electrons to say:
converter can still act as the tuner for TIVO series 1 boxes. What I don't
know is if the A/D converter will accept the IR inputs from TIVOs IR
blaster. That may be the difference between the $50 model, and the $70 (or

At this point in time the TiVo doesn't have IR codes to control any of
the converter boxes, and it is unknown if TiVo will add them.

How difficult would it be for someone to add the codes themselves?
I seem to recall some kind of Linux driver that could receive IR
codes and tell you what they were. So you get one person with a
Linux setup and a remote control for the converter box and a little
time, and you've got the codes (or maybe the manufacturer will
publish them anyway). Someone said there's a file with all the IR
codes on the Tivos, and there are known (but not necessarily really
easy) methods for modifying files. Now, how hard is it to add some
codes to the IR code file in the right format, if you've got the codes?

There are additional problems. You won't have any guide data for analog
stations that no longer exist. Also, the method of selecting channels
may end up being different (I'm sure S1 Tivos know nothing about a '-'
in a channel number) so it's more than just translating the character
sequence '13' into IR codes to get channel 13.

more) models. I would assume the S2 and S3 TIVOS are the same, and will
accept any channel as input as well

For a S1 and S2 Tivo that gets antenna input, a converter box with
the channel manually set would now give you time-record (unfortunately,
NOT time-and-channel-record) capability.

Never assume. The S3 and HD don't support *any* external boxes, only
direct cable and/or antenna input. But, since they both natively
support digital signals, you don't need a box anyway.

The S2 has the same issue as the S1 - no IR codes. And the S2DT
doesn't support antenna at all.

As far as basic cable (I assume you mean analog), that may be up to the
cable company. Since they are a closed system (not OTA), they can continue

It is. Cable is unrelated.

Has anyone thought about the interference from all those cables that's
on these new frequencies that someone else is supposed to start using?
This also includes all those people who have mis-connected their
game consoles that use channel 3 or 4 so they are broadcasting
OUT their antenna.

(Gordon Burditt) shaped the electrons to say:
How difficult would it be for someone to add the codes themselves?

AFAIK no one has ever been able to add IR codes to the TiVo, other
than Tivo.

Has anyone thought about the interference from all those cables that's
on these new frequencies that someone else is supposed to start using?

What new frequencies? All of the ATSC channels are using spectrum
that has long been assigned to VHF or UHF TV stations.

-MZ
--
megazone-at-megazone.org http://www.MegaZone.org/ Gweep, Geek, Human, me.
http://www.TiVoLovers.com/ http://www.Eyrie-Productions.com/ -- Hail Eris
"A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men" 508-852-2171

Doug Jacobs shaped the electrons to say:
A TV antenna is a TV antenna. My mom has one of those large roof antennas

Not true. There are VHF-only and UHF-only antennas, so if you have
one of those it won't tune channels using the other range.

-MZ
--
megazone-at-megazone.org http://www.MegaZone.org/ Gweep, Geek, Human, me.
http://www.TiVoLovers.com/ http://www.Eyrie-Productions.com/ -- Hail Eris
"A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men" 508-852-2171

Once upon a time, Doug McIntyre said:
The different markets have different requirements for antenna. Mostly
they'll all be in the UHF range now though. If you get the HD channels
now on your Series3, it'll remain unchanged after Feb 2009.

That is not necessarily true. Most OTA stations currently have two
frequencies assigned, one for analog and one for digital transmissions.
After the "great cutoff", they have to give one up, but I think they get
to choose.

Some will have to give up a frequency because it will no longer be
available for TV. For example, in my area, one station will lose their
current analog frequency (UHF 54), and another will lose their current
digital frequency (UHF 59); the UHF TV band will end at channel 51. I
think the rest get to choose which frequency to keep.

So, just because you receive a station today (with a UHF antenna for
example) doesn't mean you'll be able to receive them after the cutoff
(they could switch to a VHF frequency currently used for analog).

--
Chris Adams
Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services
I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble.

The S1 and S2 cannot, so you're screwed. Unless TiVo adds
support for the external converted boxes, which they have yet to
indicated they will do. (Maybe next week at CES - but they'd probably
rather you buy a S3/HD.)

It would seem phenomenally unwise to take an existing base of paying
customers and leave them in the lurch.

They're already supporting a boatload of different cable TV systems and
boxes, so it's not like it'd be all that much work.

But there is the downside of dealing with reception issues. Right now if
there's a picture problem the customer has to call the cable company. With
OTA there's no cable company involved, and the calls would end up at Tivo.
That's certainly a cost Tivo would (rightly) prefer to avoid.

It would be interesting to get an idea of how many of Tivo's existing
subscribers don't use a cable or satellite provider. The number may indeed
be so low as to make it a bit of a waste to bother. It'd probably be a lot
cheaper to just offer them a sweet deal on a TivoHD instead.

-Bill Kearney

On Thu, 03 Jan 2008 00:15:33 +0000, Gordon Burditt wrote:

How difficult would it be for someone to add the codes themselves? I
seem to recall some kind of Linux driver that could receive IR codes and
tell you what they were. So you get one person with a Linux setup and a
remote control for the converter box and a little time, and you've got
the codes (or maybe the manufacturer will publish them anyway). Someone
said there's a file with all the IR codes on the Tivos, and there are
known (but not necessarily really easy) methods for modifying files.
Now, how hard is it to add some codes to the IR code file in the right
format, if you've got the codes?

I never needed an IR blaster so I never looked where they store the codes,
but creating the codes is pretty simple. I've done several for different
remotes using Linux Infrared Remote Control (LIRC), lirc.org. If they are
using lirc and I don't know if they are, you may be able to do it from tty
if they have the whole package installed. If not, it's a simple matter to
create a file with the codes. Here's part of one I did;

# lircd.conf.ofa
# Please make this file available to others
# by sending it to
#
# this config file was automatically generated
# using lirc-0.8.0pre4-pvr150(all) on Sat Sep 23 12:37:15 2006
#
# contributed by W.Newell
#
# brand: One For All with serial IR rec. (lirc_serial)
# model no. of remote control: URC-8810 (default cable device)
# devices being controlled by this remote: MythTV, whatever
#

begin remote

name URC8810_Cable_Mode
flags RAW_CODES|CONST_LENGTH
eps 30
aeps 100

ptrail 510
repeat 0 0
gap 100206

begin raw_codes

name menu
9077 4498 506 4487 518 2213
509 2238 533 4453 527 4434
576 2182 550 2189 584 2166
570 2180 569 2186 562 2162
605 2150 597 2138 593 4401
590 4412 616 2105 608

name guide
9075 4498 481 2276 484 2253
493 2252 525 2221 503 4465
539 4447 571 2170 588 2173
553 2217 540 2180 560 2203
567 2174 571 4403 575 2168
587 4432 566 4402 612

name power
9099 4466 469 2289 477 4499
523 2240 490 4481 544 2196
527 2222 537 2198 576 2174
548 2192 603 2134 607 2148
544 2205 575 2173 559 4439
573 4405 639 2121 580

Left out the rest

end raw_codes

end remote


If I get a remote, it's not a problem to generate a code file. Here's
remote codes for many devices.

http://lirc.sourceforge.net/remotes/

--
Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org
My Tivo Experience http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/tivo.htm
Tivo HD/S3 compared http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/mythtivo.htm
AMD cpu help http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php

How difficult would it be for someone to add the codes themselves?

AFAIK no one has ever been able to add IR codes to the TiVo, other
than Tivo.

Has anyone thought about the interference from all those cables that's
on these new frequencies that someone else is supposed to start using?

What new frequencies? All of the ATSC channels are using spectrum
that has long been assigned to VHF or UHF TV stations.

No, I'm talking about the frequencies radiated from CABLE that are
no longer assigned to TV, but to emergency communications or whatever.

On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 20:56:10 +0000, MegaZone wrote:

"John" shaped the electrons to
say:
converter can still act as the tuner for TIVO series 1 boxes. What I
don't know is if the A/D converter will accept the IR inputs from TIVOs
IR blaster. That may be the difference between the $50 model, and the
$70 (or

At this point in time the TiVo doesn't have IR codes to control any of
the converter boxes, and it is unknown if TiVo will add them.

They may not have to add them. A requirement for the box is that it uses
standard codes, and they must be made available to the user.

18. Remote Control
A remote control to operate the equipment shall be provided with
batteries. Standard codes will be used and provided so the
consumer can program an existing remote control to, at a minimum, change
channels and turn on and off the converter box and the
consumer’s existing analog television receiver.



--
Want the ultimate in free OTA SD/HDTV Recorder? http://mythtv.org
My Tivo Experience http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/tivo.htm
Tivo HD/S3 compared http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/mythtivo.htm
AMD cpu help http://wesnewell.no-ip.com/cpu.php

Drew Lawson wrote:
I don't know whether you
need a different design of antenna for ATSC than for NTSC.

There is no difference. Antenna design is affected by distance
and frequency ranges (UHF vs VHF). Both criteria are identical for
ATSC transmissions in digital form and NTSC transmissions in analog form.

-Joe

Gordon Burditt wrote:

Has anyone thought about the interference from all those cables that's
on these new frequencies that someone else is supposed to start using?

No, I'm talking about the frequencies radiated from CABLE that are
no longer assigned to TV, but to emergency communications or whatever.

There is very little leakage of signals from coax cable.
I haven't heard of any in the UHF channel 61 to channel 69 range (the
ones being auctioned off). Do you know of any specific reports?

-Joe

P.S. Don't try to feed "Burditt" to the Thunderbird spell checker ;-)