What the visual effect Im seeing?

ITV 5PM The Great Pretender quiz show. On both digital cable and
analogue... why does THAT show look like its got a low "frame rate" (for
want of a better description)?

Anyone know?

tia

G

Gingangooli wrote:

ITV 5PM The Great Pretender quiz show. On both digital cable and
analogue... why does THAT show look like its got a low "frame rate"
(for want of a better description)?

The producers have applied one variant out of many of the dire "filmic"
effect to their programme. It's used to, apparently, make the output look
more like film than video. Why would anyone want to make a quiz show look
like it had been filmed with the sort of camera you'd use for a cinema
movie? Your guess is as good as mine.

In any event, it of course in reality just looks awful and nothing like
film, but lots of people seem to enjoy destroying their output in this
way. It's seen everywhere and is one of many examples of the collapse of
standards in the broadcasting industry. This particular example does seem
to be particularly bad for introducing motion judder, but not as bad as
many examples in terms of how much it reduces the picture resolution.

--
TTFN, Andrew Hodgkinson
Find some electronic music at: Photos, wallpaper, software and mo
http://pond.org.uk/music.html http://pond.org.uk/

"Andrew Hodgkinson" wrote in message
...
Gingangooli wrote:

ITV 5PM The Great Pretender quiz show. On both digital cable and
analogue... why does THAT show look like its got a low "frame rate"
(for want of a better description)?

The producers have applied one variant out of many of the dire "filmic"
effect to their programme. It's used to, apparently, make the output look
more like film than video. Why would anyone want to make a quiz show look
like it had been filmed with the sort of camera you'd use for a cinema
movie? Your guess is as good as mine.

In any event, it of course in reality just looks awful and nothing like
film, but lots of people seem to enjoy destroying their output in this
way. It's seen everywhere and is one of many examples of the collapse of
standards in the broadcasting industry. This particular example does seem
to be particularly bad for introducing motion judder, but not as bad as
many examples in terms of how much it reduces the picture resolution.

--

This low frame rate has been occuring on an increasing number of programmes
in recent years. For instance - the current series of Casualty suffers from
it, but not the last series.
My theory is that the older stuff was record to video tape which gave smooth
motion. However, recordings on to digital hard disk just ain't up to it !
In my opinion digital is not yet to a acceptable broadcast standard yet.

Stefan

Stefan wrote:

My theory is that the older stuff was record to video tape which gave smooth
motion. However, recordings on to digital hard disk just ain't up to it !
In my opinion digital is not yet to a acceptable broadcast standard yet.

That's got nothing to do with it. Uncompressed digital video recordings,
whether on tape, HDD, or RAM do not suffer the degradation you refer to.

There's been digital processing in the broadcast Tx chain for almost 40 years.
It's digital *compression* that has led to a degradation of quality, and
that's been driven more by commercial rather than technical factors.
The film effect is applied for nothing more than idiotic poncy artistic
reasons, if it does save any 'bandwidth' then that's simply a by-product.


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

In article , Stefan wrote:
This low frame rate has been occuring on an increasing number of programmes*
in recent years. For instance - the current series of Casualty suffers from*
it, but not the last series.
My theory is that the older stuff was record to video tape which gave smooth*
motion. However, recordings on to digital hard disk just ain't up to it !
In my opinion digital is not yet to a acceptable broadcast standard yet.

Broadcast disk-based recording systems are perfectly capable of recording all
the information in full spec video signals without any degradation. The various
frame rate embuggerments that are applied in the name of "art" or "style", or
whatever they call it, are done deliberately.

Rod.

"Roderick Stewart" wrote in message
.. .
In article , Stefan wrote:
This low frame rate has been occuring on an increasing number of
programmes
in recent years. For instance - the current series of Casualty suffers
from
it, but not the last series.
My theory is that the older stuff was record to video tape which gave
smooth
motion. However, recordings on to digital hard disk just ain't up to it !
In my opinion digital is not yet to a acceptable broadcast standard yet.

Broadcast disk-based recording systems are perfectly capable of recording
all
the information in full spec video signals without any degradation. The
various
frame rate embuggerments that are applied in the name of "art" or "style",
or
whatever they call it, are done deliberately.

Rod.



Agreed that it is sometimes used for effect, but I know what I see. Juddered
or stroboscopic motion as if there are less frames per second.
A particular good (bad) example is a comedy series I think currently on
BBC1 - 'Live at the Appollo'. I could list a lot more, but do I need to when
you can see for yourself ?

As for Rod's comment about no degradation here is a BBC technical document
http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/whp/whp...les/WHP131.pdf
Broadcasting seems to have dropped to the lowest quality they think they can
get away with.

Of course it doesn't stop here. There are problems with blocking, artefacts,
poor sound quality on DAB due to low bit rates, even analogue FM suffers
from over use of compression resulting in pumping, breathing, no dynamic
range.
Some of the old engineers must be turning in their graves !

Stefan

In article , Stefan wrote:
As for Rod's comment about no degradation here is a BBC technical document*
http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/whp/whp...les/WHP131.pdf
Broadcasting seems to have dropped to the lowest quality they think they can*
get away with.

I was actually talking about the recording machines that are used for the
making of programmes within broadcast companies, which are quite capable of
handling the signal unharmed, though you are quite correct in your assessment
of the final transmitted signal.

Rod.

"Gingangooli" wrote in message
...
ITV 5PM The Great Pretender quiz show. On both digital cable and
analogue... why does THAT show look like its got a low "frame rate" (for
want of a better description)?

Anyone know?

tia

G


thanks for all the feedback. So its an arty-farty effect then. WOW !!! I
happen to be watching the very prog I mentioned originally and I have to say
its appalling (the effect..not the prog) and it makes me think "low budget
output" and not "Hmm... Arty". Hehe... cheers folks.

TTFN