Freeview audio quality compared to DAB.

Hi,
I wondered what was better, Freeview audio, or DAB?
Cheers,

Rob.

"Robert Wilson" wrote in message
...
Hi,
I wondered what was better, Freeview audio, or DAB?
Cheers,

Rob.

Warning - rants approaching! If you look at the archives for this NG you'll
see what I mean.

I believe that Freeview is better because it has greater bandwidth available
(at present) whereas DAB has been "squeezed" into low bandwidth to favour
"quality over quantity". On the horizon is DAB+ which uses a different
compression codec and could produce better sound - providing the suits don't
decide to use this extra compression to squeeze further and negating the
codec gain with bandwidth reducations.

That's a quick precis of what you are about to receive! You have been
warned.

Paul DS

Paul D.Smith wrote:
"Robert Wilson" wrote in message
...
Hi,
I wondered what was better, Freeview audio, or DAB?
Cheers,

Rob.

Warning - rants approaching! If you look at the archives for this NG you'll
see what I mean.

I believe that Freeview is better because it has greater bandwidth available
(at present) whereas DAB has been "squeezed" into low bandwidth to favour
"quality over quantity". On the horizon is DAB+ which uses a different
compression codec and could produce better sound - providing the suits don't
decide to use this extra compression to squeeze further and negating the
codec gain with bandwidth reducations.

That's a quick precis of what you are about to receive! You have been
warned.

Paul DS


Thanks for that...I think!

Paul D.Smith wrote:
"Robert Wilson" wrote in message
...
Hi,
I wondered what was better, Freeview audio, or DAB?
Cheers,

Rob.

Warning - rants approaching! If you look at the archives for this NG
you'll see what I mean.


Presumably you're referring to me? The reality is that you don't like what I
write, so you try to label it as a rant. The reality is that I rarely if
ever rant these days - that was ages ago.


I believe that Freeview is better because it has greater bandwidth
available (at present)


Do you have any evidence to back up your implication that the bandwidth for
the radio stations is going to decrease on Freeview? At the end of the day,
you can fit about 15 - 20 radio stations into the same space as 1 TV
channel, so I can't see the radio stations' bandwidth ever being squeezed,
because there's so little to gain from doing it.


whereas DAB has been "squeezed" into low
bandwidth to favour "quality over quantity". On the horizon is DAB+
which uses a different compression codec and could produce better
sound - providing the suits don't decide to use this extra
compression to squeeze further and negating the codec gain with
bandwidth reducations.


The BBC at least will provide higher quality on DAB+.


--
Steve - www.digitalradiotech.co.uk - Digital Radio News & Info

Robert Wilson wrote:
Hi,
I wondered what was better, Freeview audio, or DAB?
Cheers,


The BBC stations use higher bit rates on Freeview than on DAB, so the audio
quality is higher. The only exceptions to this are Radio 3 and the World
Service, which use the same bit rates on both Freeview and DAB.

The commercial stations on Freeview use the same bit rate levels as on DAB,
so the audio quality is the same.

The bit rate levels can be compared on he

http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/da..._bit_rates.htm

(presumably this post doesn't count as a rant, although I wouldn't put it
past some people classifying it as such)


--
Steve - www.digitalradiotech.co.uk - Digital Radio News & Info

In article ,
DAB sounds worse than FM [email protected] wrote:
The BBC at least will provide higher quality on DAB+.

While hoping you're correct I wouldn't bank on it long term. History has
shown them to reduce standards to the point where the majority are 'happy'
- not maintain the best possible ones. In near every field. It's a very
different BBC these days from yesteryear.

--
*Microsoft broke Volkswagen's record: They only made 21.4 million bugs.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 16:13:07 GMT, "DAB sounds worse than FM"
[email protected] wrote:

The reality is that I rarely if ever rant these days - that was ages ago.

You must be living in a different 'reality' to me. Mid April wasn't
'ages ago' was it? Then you keenly argued the case that people you
didn't know but who simply disagreed with you on the smoking ban were
Nazis.

--
Z

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
DAB sounds worse than FM [email protected] wrote:
The BBC at least will provide higher quality on DAB+.

While hoping you're correct I wouldn't bank on it long term.


Okay then, Dave, explain to me what services the BBC is going to transmit on
the ~70% of the multiplex that will be empty once they have switched their
stations to using DAB+ and they've decided not to improve the audio quality.

The one and only legitimate argument, which wasn't even close to being
realistic (but I can't be arsed to explain why) was that the BBC might use
the freed up space to broadcast their TV channels as mobile TV channels.
Unfortunately that argument now can't even be used, because the EU telecoms
commissioner has decided to force European countries to use DVB-H for mobile
TV, and BT Movio (the mobile TV service on the Digital One multiplex) is
closing next year - which will be linked to the EU commissioner's decision
to back DVB-H.

So, let's hear what new services you can think up to fill up the space, or
I'm afraid you're just full of hot air.


History
has shown them to reduce standards to the point where the majority
are 'happy' - not maintain the best possible ones. In near every
field. It's a very different BBC these days from yesteryear.


I'm not intereted in history, I'm interested in cause and effect, so provide
the cause that leads to the effect, or you're just being pessimistic for the
sake of it.


--
Steve - www.digitalradiotech.co.uk - Digital Radio News & Info

"Robert Wilson" wrote in message
...
Hi,
I wondered what was better, Freeview audio, or DAB?
Cheers,

Rob.

On paper in almost all cases the bandwidth on DTT or Satellite is better and
equivalent to MP3..

Analog satellite was comparable (with Wenger / Panda ?)

Nicam or stereo FM also better.

For really dross quality try streamed over the internet!

Zathras wrote:
On Mon, 06 Aug 2007 16:13:07 GMT, "DAB sounds worse than FM"
[email protected] wrote:

The reality is that I rarely if ever rant these days - that was ages
ago.

You must be living in a different 'reality' to me. Mid April wasn't
'ages ago' was it? Then you keenly argued the case that people you
didn't know but who simply disagreed with you on the smoking ban were
Nazis.


Oh, I'm allowed a rant about that, and I stand by what I said about the
anti-smokers being true Nazi members. The full smoking ban is an absolute
disgrace. But I don't want to get back into another argument about that, so
please don't start one now.

But the original accusation was to do with me supposedly ranting about DAB,
but I'm afraid I don't do that any more. Basically, I used to rant through
the frustration that I knew full well that I was right about the fact that
DAB should never have been adopted, and there was never any need for the
broadcasters to provide the low audio quality they are providing. And now
I've been completely vindicated by the design of DAB+, which will make DAB
obsolete.

You see, they've followed my recommendations:

http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/dv...ecommendations

DAB+ is identical to DMB in terms of the main technologies it uses (the DAB
core system with the AAC+ (HE-AAC) audio codec and RS error correction
coding added), and I recommended they should do that in, oh, 2003.

Basically, I have nothing to rant about any more. But I am thoroughly
looking forward to the time when the small minority of people who'll oppose
the introduction of DAB+ will start crying about the money they spent on
their DAB radios. Been there, spent my money only for the service I paid for
being withdrawn (i.e. the quality was there when I bought it, and then they
took it away) and got no sympathy off ****s who like DAB, and therefore I
will have zero sympathy for them in return when it happens to them.


--
Steve - www.digitalradiotech.co.uk - Digital Radio News & Info