My TV drops channels occasionally

I have two HDTV's. Both OTA. Only digital channels are watched.

About once a month, one of the TV's will drop a channel from it's
autoscanned list. Sometimes, an unwanted one (e.g. home shopping)
gets added, too. To re-add the dropped channel, I have to look up the
real broadcast channel and re-"add" it to the list. (e.g. if channel
4.1 gets dropped, I have to "add" channel 30 as digital channel 4 is
really on UHF channel 30)

Each TV is a different manufacturer (Panasonic / Philips). It's odd
that each TV occasionally drops channels.

Which brings up my second point: I wish stations would ignore PSIP.
If I'm really watching channel 4.1 on the frequency assigned to
channel 30, the TV should simply say "30.1". Even more, channel 4
(WBZ) has declared that they will use UHF-30 after 2009.

NadCixelsyd wrote:
I have two HDTV's. Both OTA. Only digital channels are watched.

About once a month, one of the TV's will drop a channel from it's
autoscanned list. Sometimes, an unwanted one (e.g. home shopping)
gets added, too. To re-add the dropped channel, I have to look up the
real broadcast channel and re-"add" it to the list. (e.g. if channel
4.1 gets dropped, I have to "add" channel 30 as digital channel 4 is
really on UHF channel 30)

Each TV is a different manufacturer (Panasonic / Philips). It's odd
that each TV occasionally drops channels.

Weird problem. I suspect the problem is that a station puts out a bad
PSIP header and the tuner picks that up. But I have not seen your
problem occur for either of my two ATSC tuners for the
Washington-Baltimore area. While you can manually re-add the channel,
any reason for not doing a full re-scan?

Which brings up my second point: I wish stations would ignore PSIP.
If I'm really watching channel 4.1 on the frequency assigned to
channel 30, the TV should simply say "30.1". Even more, channel 4
(WBZ) has declared that they will use UHF-30 after 2009.

They can't. The FCC requires the station to insert their analog
channel number into the PSIP field. The stations have built up an
identity as NBC 4, Fox 5, CW 50 so they will keep those displayed
channel numbers. The FCC mandates this because presumably it is less
confusing to the public. My one objection is that most (all?) ATSC
tuners do not display the actual broadcast channel number somewhere on a
channel setup menu. People will be confused why they need a UHF antenna
to get a VHF 3 station or even more confusing in a few areas, why they
need to get a low VHF antenna to receive a UHF station.

Alan F

"Alan F" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
NadCixelsyd wrote:
I have two HDTV's. Both OTA. Only digital channels are
watched.

About once a month, one of the TV's will drop a channel from
it's
autoscanned list. Sometimes, an unwanted one (e.g. home
shopping)
gets added, too. To re-add the dropped channel, I have to
look up the
real broadcast channel and re-"add" it to the list. (e.g. if
channel
4.1 gets dropped, I have to "add" channel 30 as digital
channel 4 is
really on UHF channel 30)

Each TV is a different manufacturer (Panasonic / Philips).
It's odd
that each TV occasionally drops channels.

Weird problem. I suspect the problem is that a station puts
out a bad
PSIP header and the tuner picks that up.

WBZ/CBS4 is my regular CBS affiliate and I have never seen
that
problem. I have a Westinghouse LTV32W6 and get all my
programming
OTA. This makes me think it has something to do with
Panasonic's
and Philips' firmware.


--

Rick Evans
---------------------------------------------------------------
Lon -71° 04' 35.3"
Lat +42° 11' 06.7"

..
While you can manually re-add the channel, any reason for not doing a full re-scan?

I could. But a full re-scan takes several minutes. Then, I have to
re-delete all the channels (weather maps, foreign language, bible-
beating, home-shopping, analog, etc) that I never watch.

This week, it was channel 4 (really 30) that was dropped and analog 6
that was added. A few weeks ago it was channel 7 (really 42) that was
dropped. Since this has happened on both my Panasonic and my
Phillips, it's not just one TV.

I also have a Sony HDD250 DVR tuned to my digital channels. I don't
think it has dropped a station in the past 14 months.

As I said in my original post, it's a minor annoyance. At least it
keeps me on my toes as to where the channels really are.

In article [email protected] Alan F writes:
NadCixelsyd wrote:

Which brings up my second point: I wish stations would ignore PSIP.
If I'm really watching channel 4.1 on the frequency assigned to
channel 30, the TV should simply say "30.1". Even more, channel 4
(WBZ) has declared that they will use UHF-30 after 2009.

They can't. The FCC requires the station to insert their analog
channel number into the PSIP field. The stations have built up an
identity as NBC 4, Fox 5, CW 50 so they will keep those displayed
channel numbers. The FCC mandates this because presumably it is less
confusing to the public.


Interesting. In this area, both KDTV-DT and KCSM-DT do not transmit
their analog channel number in the PSIP.

KDTV is probably just confused, as they stopped using the analog
channel number a few months ago.

KCSM recognizes the reality that they are pretty much a digital-only
channel now.

Now, I understand that stations would want to maintain their valuable
channel identity.

Over the long run, I think it does the public a dis-service, as:

o It confuses them about what channels the station is really using.

o It increases the risk of confusion between two channels transmitting
on different frequencies having a conflict between the PSIP values,
or a conflict between one's PSIP and another's actual RF channel
assignment.

If someone has a reference to this requirement (such as from a FCC
regulatory web page), I would appreciate it. I don't distrust the
poster (hey, I like the name!), but I wanted to point to the source for
other discussions.


My one objection is that most (all?) ATSC
tuners do not display the actual broadcast channel number somewhere on a
channel setup menu. People will be confused why they need a UHF antenna
to get a VHF 3 station or even more confusing in a few areas, why they
need to get a low VHF antenna to receive a UHF station.

Exactly.


Alan

On Mon, 2 Jul 2007 07:33:00 +0000 (UTC) Alan wrote:

| Interesting. In this area, both KDTV-DT and KCSM-DT do not transmit
| their analog channel number in the PSIP.
|
| KDTV is probably just confused, as they stopped using the analog
| channel number a few months ago.
|
| KCSM recognizes the reality that they are pretty much a digital-only
| channel now.
|
| Now, I understand that stations would want to maintain their valuable
| channel identity.
|
| Over the long run, I think it does the public a dis-service, as:
|
| o It confuses them about what channels the station is really using.
|
| o It increases the risk of confusion between two channels transmitting
| on different frequencies having a conflict between the PSIP values,
| or a conflict between one's PSIP and another's actual RF channel
| assignment.
|
| If someone has a reference to this requirement (such as from a FCC
| regulatory web page), I would appreciate it. I don't distrust the
| poster (hey, I like the name!), but I wanted to point to the source for
| other discussions.

In many cities, many stations are electing to keep their (usually UHF)
digital channel for the post-2009-2-17 all-digital era. Probably most.
What that does is leaves a lot of abandoned channels that were, and may
well still be, used as identities. In Pittsburgh, channels 2, 4, and
11 have elected to use their digital UHF channels, 25, 51, and 48. So
what if after the FCC resumes accepting applications for new stations
that these abandoned analog channels get requested for new stations?
Will they be required to choose a different never-used-by-them channel
fpr PSIP to avoid that conflict? Suppose channel 11 (the frequency)
gets assigned to a new broadcaster in Pittsburgh? Will they be allowed
to use "11" in PSIP, in likely conflict with those guys over at WPXI
that are using "11" in PSIP over RF channel 48?

Maybe the FCC will move the allocations around. I guess I could, in that
phase, petition to have the channel 11 allocation moved over to Wheeling
or Steubenville where the existing stations have elected to stay on VHF
hi-band, or maybe down to the Clarksburg area, where it would fit right
in between channels 10 (a case of UHF analog moving to VHF digital) and
12 (a stay-on-VHF case).

And then there might be a new bunch of low power digital stations crop up
given the technical success of digital (sorry, Bob, but ... it's true).
Maybe we might even see some improved programming choice on OTA in the
future. How much of that might get carried on cable is another question.

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