US ATSC conversion: with 700 some odd days until NTSC is turned off, you would think that US TV stations would run a dayly counter...

On Sat, 17 Feb 2007, davmel wrote:
Of course it's criminal and why it should belong to the country with the
highest per capita incarceration rates in the world! ;-)

The practice of putting violent criminals in prison is why the US is a
safer country than either the UK or Australia.

-- Mark --

http://panda.com/mrc
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.

"Mark Crispin" wrote in message
nda.com...
On Sat, 17 Feb 2007, davmel wrote:
Of course it's criminal and why it should belong to the country with the
highest per capita incarceration rates in the world! ;-)

The practice of putting violent criminals in prison is why the US is a
safer country than either the UK or Australia.

-- Mark --

Reason and fact will not work with the offshore hate America crowd.

After all, they are experts on America because they watch American TV shows
and movies.

On Feb 17, 10:54 am, "R Sweeney" wrote:
"Mark Crispin" wrote in message

nda.com...

On Sat, 17 Feb 2007, davmel wrote:
Of course it's criminal and why it should belong to the country with the
highest per capita incarceration rates in the world! ;-)

The practice of putting violent criminals in prison is why the US is a
safer country than either the UK or Australia.

-- Mark --

Reason and fact will not work with the offshore hate America crowd.

After all, they are experts on America because they watch American
TV shows
and movies.

Are you saying the Brits are like they're shown in the British TV on
PBS? _Oh_ _My_ _God_

GG

G-squared wrote:
On Feb 17, 10:54 am, "R Sweeney" wrote:
"Mark Crispin" wrote in message

nda.com...

On Sat, 17 Feb 2007, davmel wrote:
Of course it's criminal and why it should belong to the country
with the highest per capita incarceration rates in the world! ;-)

The practice of putting violent criminals in prison is why the US
is a safer country than either the UK or Australia.

-- Mark --

Reason and fact will not work with the offshore hate America crowd.

After all, they are experts on America because they watch American
TV shows
and movies.

Are you saying the Brits are like they're shown in the British TV on
PBS? _Oh_ _My_ _God_

You mean that all American men aren't like Al Bundy and Homer Simpson?


GG

Mark Crispin wrote:
On Sat, 17 Feb 2007, davmel wrote:
Of course it's criminal and why it should belong to the country with
the highest per capita incarceration rates in the world! ;-)

The practice of putting violent criminals in prison is why the US is a
safer country than either the UK or Australia.

-- Mark --

Safer country?

Safe like in not getting murdered by someone. That would be the number
one indicator of "safe" in my book.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cr...rms-per-capita

Murder with firearms among all countries in the world

US number 8 .0279 per 100,000 there are only 8 countries more murderous
than the US when it comes to firearms. The vast majority of those killed
are NOT criminals killed by innocents protecting themselves but by
criminals killing innocents.

UK number 32 .001 per 100,000 you are almost 28 times as likely to be
killed in the US than in the UK by a firearm.

Australia 27 .0029 per 100,000 you are almost 10 times more likely to be
killed in the US than in OZ by a firearm.

Murder in general

US number 24 .0428 per 100,000 I would not want to live in any of the
top 23 countries because they must use knives a lot. Knives are so much
more uncivilized than guns.

UK number 46 .014 per 100,000 you are more than 3 times as likely to be
murdered in the UK than in the US.

Australia 43 .015 per 100,000 you are close to 3 times as likely to be
murdered in OZ than the US.

If you are not murdered then the next worst thing to happen that I would
consider not "safe" would be assault.

US number 6
UK number 8
OZ number 10

There are a lot of other types of crime but those are the two that most
closely are related to a country being "safer"

Rape is a particular kind of assault but the rates at which it happens
in countries is skewed by the culture and reporting habits that can vary
greatly.

A higher incident of reported rapes can IMO suggest a more safe country.
If you look at the ranking of countries as to rape you will see that
Yemen and Saudi Arabia are listed at the bottom with Pakistan not even
listed. For a rape to be reported in those countries the women has to
have a death wish plus 5 eye witness males to the crime.

The US is one of the most unsafe countries in the world as to murder and
assault. I sure would not want to live in any of the countries that
score higher than us.

And that is true even though we lock up more prisoners, 715 in every
100,000, than ANY OTHER COUNTRY IN THE WORLD. Russia comes in second at 584.

Oz is number 74 at 116 per 100,000
UK is not on list but has 148 per 100,000 and is the highest in Western
Europe.

So something is not working in the US. We lock up 5 and 6 times as many
people yet have 3 times as many murders and more assaults.

Now you are going to tell me about the higher burglar rate? That is a
property crime that does not involve anything unsafe. If those
statistics did they would be in the murder and assault ledger.

The UK and OZ are far safer than the US.

Bob Miller

Mark Crispin wrote:
On Sat, 17 Feb 2007, Bob Miller wrote:
For the same reason NO one followed the US with 8-VSB because it was
and still is lousy. In fact many countries that had been counted as in
the ATSC 8-VSB camp jumped ship since it was so lousy.

As a result, most of those countries still don't have HDTV.

No the decision to do SD or HD is another thing entirely. Japan failed
to follow us with 8-VSB and still does HDTV. Australia did the same
thing and has HD. Taiwan chose SD as did most of Europe but now France
is going to do DVB-T with HD and the UK plans on doing so likewise.

HD and when and if to do it is more a timing thing or a choice that has
nothing to do with the modulation as you well know.

No the Europeans felt that they might be able to solve the multipath
problem while going digital, thought that was a good goal to aim for
and dismissed 8-VSB because it did not address the issue. I think that
was the logical thing to do and they did it.

Just as it was logical to design PAL to work around cheap single vacuum
tube front ends that couldn't hold stable color in NTSC. Never mind
that modern solid state electronics solved the problem for NTSC, and
that the phase shift in PAL is now a detriment. The Europeans still
cling to the fantasy that they have better TV than the US because their
color system works better with 1960s vacuum tube front ends.

Better ATSC receivers have scored significant advances on the multipath
problem, and there's still another two years of technology advance to
go. By the time the Europeans get HDTV going, multipath will be a
complete non-issue with ATSC, but the Europeans will be stuck with a
system that requires more power and covers less distance.

COFDM systems cover more and better at the same power as has been shown
in all test to date. Two more years and we will see 8-VSB fail
spectacularly early 2009.

Yes imagine a system that that is stuck with MPEG-2 compression,

MPEG-2 is a fine compression for the purpose of carrying HDTV in a North
American 6MHz channel allocation. The only reason to want MPEG-4 is to
cram more channels into less bandwidth.

With MPEG-2 1080i is shoehorned in to a 6 MHz channel. Much better to
have MPEG-4. This will become painfully obvious to US travelers over the
next decade.

As numerous people have reported, OTA broadcasts in MPEG-2 regularly
outperform the same material on DirecTV's MPEG-4. Psycho Bob can rant
and rave as much as he wants, but the fact remains is that there is NO
evidence of superior performance from MPEG-4 over MPEG-2, and ABUNDANT
evidence of superior performance from MPEG-2 over MPEG-4.

MPEG-4 will be used by all DTV systems HD or otherwise and is far
superior to MPEG-2.

does not work mobile

Nor does COFDM. As I reported from PERSONAL EXPERIENCE in January,
Japan's COFDM-based digital TV system fails in a vehicle moving faster
than about 10MPH. I tried it both in cars (as a passenger) and trains.

COFDM works fine mobile as has been demonstrated for years. It is the
choice for Mediaflo, DVB-H, DMB-TH, T-DMB and every other wireless
broadcast and broadband venture now in operation or planned.


2006 vintage receivers, such as DirecTV's H20, work much better; and by
the time analog is turned off receivers will work even better. The
multipath problems are already non-existant for many viewers, and will
become non-existant for most viewers shortly.

Funny I thought multipath problems didn't exist according to you way
back in 1999. They exist and will become a dominant theme in early 2009
when many of those who still depend on OTA find out that OTA does not
work for them any more.

Bob Miller

Its criminal. There should be a law against 8-VSB.

There should be a law against Bob Miller and other snake-oil salesmen.

-- Mark --

http://panda.com/mrc
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.

"Ivan" wrote in message
...


You mean that all American men aren't like Al Bundy and Homer Simpson?


But surely all British women are just like Hyacinth Bucket (It's pronounced
"bouquet.")

Bob Miller wrote:
Mark Crispin wrote:
On Sat, 17 Feb 2007, davmel wrote:
Of course it's criminal and why it should belong to the country with
the highest per capita incarceration rates in the world! ;-)

The practice of putting violent criminals in prison is why the US is a
safer country than either the UK or Australia.

-- Mark --

Safer country?

Safe like in not getting murdered by someone. That would be the number
one indicator of "safe" in my book.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cr...rms-per-capita


Murder with firearms among all countries in the world

US number 8 .0279 per 100,000 there are only 8 countries more murderous
than the US when it comes to firearms. The vast majority of those killed
are NOT criminals killed by innocents protecting themselves but by
criminals killing innocents.

UK number 32 .001 per 100,000 you are almost 28 times as likely to be
killed in the US than in the UK by a firearm.

Australia 27 .0029 per 100,000 you are almost 10 times more likely to be
killed in the US than in OZ by a firearm.

Murder in general

US number 24 .0428 per 100,000 I would not want to live in any of the
top 23 countries because they must use knives a lot. Knives are so much
more uncivilized than guns.

UK number 46 .014 per 100,000 you are more than 3 times as likely to be
murdered in the UK than in the US.

That should be reversed obviously. 3 times more likely to be murdered in
the US than the UK.

Australia 43 .015 per 100,000 you are close to 3 times as likely to be
murdered in OZ than the US.

Same here. 3 times as likely to be murdered in the US than in OZ.

Bob Miller

If you are not murdered then the next worst thing to happen that I would
consider not "safe" would be assault.

US number 6
UK number 8
OZ number 10

There are a lot of other types of crime but those are the two that most
closely are related to a country being "safer"

Rape is a particular kind of assault but the rates at which it happens
in countries is skewed by the culture and reporting habits that can vary
greatly.

A higher incident of reported rapes can IMO suggest a more safe country.
If you look at the ranking of countries as to rape you will see that
Yemen and Saudi Arabia are listed at the bottom with Pakistan not even
listed. For a rape to be reported in those countries the women has to
have a death wish plus 5 eye witness males to the crime.

The US is one of the most unsafe countries in the world as to murder and
assault. I sure would not want to live in any of the countries that
score higher than us.

And that is true even though we lock up more prisoners, 715 in every
100,000, than ANY OTHER COUNTRY IN THE WORLD. Russia comes in second at
584.

Oz is number 74 at 116 per 100,000
UK is not on list but has 148 per 100,000 and is the highest in Western
Europe.

So something is not working in the US. We lock up 5 and 6 times as many
people yet have 3 times as many murders and more assaults.

Now you are going to tell me about the higher burglar rate? That is a
property crime that does not involve anything unsafe. If those
statistics did they would be in the murder and assault ledger.

The UK and OZ are far safer than the US.

Bob Miller

On Sun, 18 Feb 2007, Bob Miller wrote:
US number 8 .0279 per 100,000 there are only 8 countries more murderous than
the US when it comes to firearms. The vast majority of those killed are NOT
criminals killed by innocents protecting themselves but by criminals killing
innocents.

Sorry, Psycho Bob. You don't know what you are talking about.

About half of Americans who die by firearms are suicides. Although the US
suicide rate is quite moderate, the bullet to the brain method is the
American male's indisputable favorite. The Japanese kill themselves about
twice as much as we do, but they use ropes.

The second large group is criminal-on-criminal homicide, primarily among
gang-bangers involved in the drug trade. Together, these two groups are
the overwhelming majority of firearms deaths in the US.

It's only when you get to the third group (domestic violence) that you
find innocents. But at this point, you find that the US murder rate is
quite moderate compared to other countries.

In order to make the US look bad, the US-haters have to lump in the
suicides and drug-criminal murders.

US number 6
UK number 8
OZ number 10

Wrong again. Violent crime in Scotland affect 3% of the population
annually; in England and Wales it is 2.8%. The US rate is 1.2%.

People in London are SIX times more likely to be mugged than people in New
York City.

Overall, gun crimes in the UK have more than doubled since the current
Labour government took control. In January-June 2004, recorded gun crime
in the UK rose by 3% to 10,590 incidents, an average of 29/day, and a 14%
rise in violent crime (265,800 incidents April-June compared to 233,600 in
the previous year).

But why don't you move to the UK or Australia? Assuming that they would
accept a Psycho Bob. Even better, why don't you put a bullet in your own
brain?

-- Mark --

http://staff.washington.edu/mrc
Science does not emerge from voting, party politics, or public debate.
Si vis pacem, para bellum.

On Sun, 18 Feb 2007, Bob Miller wrote:
COFDM works fine mobile as has been demonstrated for years. It is the choice
for Mediaflo, DVB-H, DMB-TH, T-DMB and every other wireless broadcast and
broadband venture now in operation or planned.

Then why doesn't it work in Japan, Psycho Bob???

Funny I thought multipath problems didn't exist according to you way back in
1999. They exist and will become a dominant theme in early 2009 when many of
those who still depend on OTA find out that OTA does not work for them any
more.

Psycho Bob, you need to get your dick out of your mouth! I didn't even
have an HDTV system until 2004. So I couldn't have been commenting about
ATSC multipath in 1999.

-- Mark --

http://staff.washington.edu/mrc
Science does not emerge from voting, party politics, or public debate.
Si vis pacem, para bellum.