Royalties

ATSC royalties for the US DTV modulation, 8-VSB, are 2300% higher than
those for the world standard, DVB-T. 8-VSB royalties at $23 and DVB-T at
under $1. The Chinese standard, DMB-TH will have no royalties inside
China.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/bizchin...ent_768603.htm

That extra $22 that US consumers must pay when they buy a TV set, that
is mandated to have an 8-VSB receiver even if they have no idea it is
there and have no plans on using it, is the price we pay for a corrupt
Congress.

$22 for your Congress critter so that they can be re-elected and screw
you again.

Pure graft, pure payment for services rendered.

Now they are going to take more of your tax money to advertise garbage
converter boxes and subsidize them. Probably have Haliburton distribute
them for a no bid cost plus contract that will dwarf the cost of the
receiver.

Bob Miller

Bob Miller wrote:

Wah, cry, complain, bitch, moan.....

Bob Miller

Bob, when are you going to shut the **** up and go away?

Chip

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Bob Miller wrote:
ATSC royalties for the US DTV modulation, 8-VSB, are 2300% higher than
those for the world standard, DVB-T. 8-VSB royalties at $23 and DVB-T at
under $1.

Unless you can take one receiver and take it to every country in the
world and receive DTV OTA, there's no "world standard." Your statement
about a "world standard" is either meant to deceive or... Well, I can't
think of any other reason you would post that. Can you?

Still, I'd rather have paid an extra $23 on my recent TV purchase (plus
the extra $23 or $46 for the two ATSC tuners in my sat receiver) and be
able to use it to watch great HDTV OTA broadcasts than save that extra $
and not be able to watch even DTV OTA because I live in a small town and
the broadcasters in my area didn't build out SFNs to cover my area since
there aren't any tall buildings around...

The Chinese standard, DMB-TH will have no royalties inside
China.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/bizchin...ent_768603.htm

So? Move to China and buy one of their no-royalty TVs. Even if OTA from
China reached here, I don't think there's very much content from there
I'd be interested in.


That extra $22 that US consumers must pay when they buy a TV set, that
is mandated to have an 8-VSB receiver even if they have no idea it is
there and have no plans on using it, is the price we pay for a corrupt
Congress.

I'm surprised that you think this is odd. If you believe all of us
owners of ATSC receivers in the US are stupid, why would you think we're
smart enough to worry about Congressional corruption?

Of course, your buddies at Sinclair are well above the political fray
and would never try to influence election results...


$22 for your Congress critter so that they can be re-elected and screw
you again.

You know, you could at least proof-read your postings if you're trying
to convince us... It's bad enough that a lot of your links don't support
your arguments, it's just sad when you're not consistent within the same
post!


Pure graft, pure payment for services rendered.

Got any proof, or just sour grapes?



Now they are going to take more of your tax money to advertise garbage
converter boxes and subsidize them.

Better than using public-owned airwaves to subsidize mobile advertising.
Why would I want to watch advertising on public transportation when I
generally TIVO most everything to skip over the commercials?


Probably have Haliburton distribute
them for a no bid cost plus contract that will dwarf the cost of the
receiver.

Bob Miller

"Bob Miller" wrote in

... $22 for your Congress critter so that they can be re-elected and screw
you again.

Bob gets desperate when nobody believes his lies.

"Bob Miller" wrote in message
link.net...
ATSC royalties for the US DTV modulation, 8-VSB, are 2300% higher than
those for the world standard, DVB-T. 8-VSB royalties at $23 and DVB-T at
under $1. The Chinese standard, DMB-TH will have no royalties inside
China.
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/bizchin...ent_768603.htm
That extra $22 that US consumers must pay when they buy a TV set, that is
mandated to have an 8-VSB receiver even if they have no idea it is there
and have no plans on using it, is the price we pay for a corrupt Congress.
$22 for your Congress critter so that they can be re-elected and screw you
again.
Pure graft, pure payment for services rendered.

Now they are going to take more of your tax money to advertise garbage
converter boxes and subsidize them. Probably have Haliburton distribute
them for a no bid cost plus contract that will dwarf the cost of the
receiver.

Bob Miller


I'm beginning to think that if Congress HAD gone with cofdm,

you'd now still be an unfortunate usenet fruitcake.

On Mon, 15 Jan 2007, Bob Miller wrote:
ATSC royalties for the US DTV modulation, 8-VSB, are 2300% higher than those
for the world standard, DVB-T.

There are at least three world standards for digital TV: 8-VSB, DVB-T, and
ISDB-T. Each of these has variations. For example, the Brazilians did
not like ISDB-T, and have made incompatible modifications to it which will
not be deployed in Japan.

It's just like the situation with analog TV, in which there were three
color standards with variations and a several television standards.

Some things stay the same. Governments choose incompatible broadcast
standards to prevent the import/export of domestic TV models. And Psycho
Bob Miller remains a Psycho Bob.

The Chinese standard, DMB-TH will have no royalties inside China.

The Chinese government, which owns everything inside China ("private
ownership" in China is really a type of lease), does not charge itself
royalties. Duh!

It is not surprising that China went its own way. It is not in the
interest of the Chinese government to have compatible TV systems. Right
now, there's a battle being waged over whether Hong Kong will be allowed
to have a compatible digital TV system with China.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/bizchin...ent_768603.htm

That China Daily article is not about DMB-TH, but rather that Chinese
manufacturers will have to pay royalties in order to export ATSC TVs to
the US. They feel that $23 will "make it impossible for them to break
even."

The article goes on to say that the major patent holders in this royalty
dispute are Thomson and Sony. [But Psycho Bob blames the Koreans...]

My heart just bleeds for these People's Liberation Army (PLA) businesses.
Why, if they have to pay royalties, the next thing that may happen is that
the workers in their plants may actually start demanding a decent wage,
instead of most of the profits going first to line the pockets of the PLA
generals (and their families) and second to fund arms acquisition for the
Great Glorious Liberation of Taiwan. What then will become of the Great
Proletarian People's Democratic Dictatorship?

If anything, the Chinese aren't being charged enough.

That extra $22 that US consumers must pay when they buy a TV set,

From China

that is
mandated to have an 8-VSB receiver

Because the analog tuner will stop working for OTA reception in 2009

even if they have no idea it is there

Which is why they tell the clerk at the store that they want to buy a TV
with an HDTV tuner.

Which is why they tell the cleck at the store that they don't want a TV
that will stop working in 2009.

and have no plans on using it,

An unsubstantiated statement, but that is the only thing that Psycho Bob
can do.

is the price we pay for a corrupt Congress.

It's the price we pay for nationwide HDTV, now.[*]

It's the price we pay for a digital TV service that serves rural areas
and not just the big cities [**].

Last but not least, it's the price we pay to block Viacel, Psycho Bob's
sleazy company (which recently withdrew its bids on FCC licenses), from
broadcasting tampon and "natural male enhancement" pills to video screens
on city buses.

And it is worth every cent.

Now they are going to take more of your tax money to advertise garbage
converter boxes and subsidize them.

You mean like the garbage converter boxes that are advertised and
subsidized in the UK that crap out whenever a refrigerator kicks in?

Probably have Haliburton distribute them
for a no bid cost plus contract that will dwarf the cost of the receiver.

Here we see Psycho Bob's pathetic attempt to exploit anti-Bush sentiment.
Never mind that Halliburton (the correct spelling) has nothing to do with
electronics; they're in the oil and gas business.

If Gore had won, we would have seem him rage against the Democrats'
favorite contractors.

[*] Europe, the big DVB-T booster, does not have broadcast HDTV.
Australia has HDTV, but most of the broadcasters cheat by simply
upconverting SD programs. Japan is the only other country which comes
close to the US; Japan was once ahead, but the US leapfrogged over Japan
and now Japan is playing catch-up.

[**] I recently downloaded Japan's current digital TV coverage maps and
studied them carefully. The big cities in the flatlands on the main
island are covered, with more limited coverage on the other islands
(coverage in Hokkdaido is still very much a work in progress, with many
towns and small cities with no digital coverage). With limited exceptions
(e.g., there is one TV station in the resort towns near Mt. Fuji), there
is no attempt to cover the hill country.

Japan has made impressive progress, but still has quite a way to go before
they can switch off analog TV. That's why their current scheduled
switchoff is three years after the US.

-- Mark --

http://panda.com/mrc
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.

FWIW: unsure about the reliability of the source, but here is the source and the
quote on page dated: 21 Sep 2005

http://www.tvtechnology.com/features...ors_chip.shtml

PROMOTING ATSC
........
Korea-based LG Electronics, which acquired the patent on 8-VSB when it
purchased Zenith in 1999, is another major player in the DTV chip market.
........

Mark Crispin wrote:

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/bizchin...ent_768603.htm

That China Daily article is not about DMB-TH, but rather that Chinese
manufacturers will have to pay royalties in order to export ATSC TVs to
the US. They feel that $23 will "make it impossible for them to break
even."

The article goes on to say that the major patent holders in this royalty
dispute are Thomson and Sony. [But Psycho Bob blames the Koreans...]

"Bob Miller" wrote in message
link.net...
ATSC royalties for the US DTV modulation, 8-VSB, are 2300% higher than
those for the world standard, DVB-T.


This makes perfect sense to me, seeing as the USA probably has ~2300% more
solid HDTV OTA coverage than any cofdm-using country.

That's correct, but the China Daily article says that China's problems are
with patents that are held by Thomson and Sony, and not the LG patent.

Only in the simplistic world of Psycho Bob is there only one patent. In
real life, the business of making a technology product requires that you
obtain licenses from quite a few patent holders. Often a single product
involves many dozens of patents.

Not even LG can make an 8-VSB DTV without paying license fees to other
companies for patents held by those companies.

Are you starting to see how this works? It has nothing to do with
"robbing US consumers" (as Psycho Bob claims) and everything to do with
non-Chinese manufacturers competing with Chinese. The Chinese have slave
labor, and thus have been undercutting other manufacturers.

The US is a lucrative market, and is extremly price-sensitive. US TVs,
including HDTVs, are considerably cheaper than in any other country in the
world. The US market is so large that manufacturers fight each other to
get market share in the US. They recover their costs by charging more
(much more!) in other countries.

This is also why there is no way in hell that Europe would EVER allow the
same technical standard in Europe as in the US. If the US were to adopt
DVB-T (as Psycho Bob advocates) then Europe would immediately drop it like
a hot potato. Neither the Europeans nor the Japanese want to allow grey
market imports of inexpensive TVs from the US.

On Mon, 15 Jan 2007, steve_k wrote:

FWIW: unsure about the reliability of the source, but here is the source and
the quote on page dated: 21 Sep 2005

http://www.tvtechnology.com/features...ors_chip.shtml

PROMOTING ATSC
.......
Korea-based LG Electronics, which acquired the patent on 8-VSB when it
purchased Zenith in 1999, is another major player in the DTV chip market.
.......

Mark Crispin wrote:

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/bizchin...ent_768603.htm

That China Daily article is not about DMB-TH, but rather that Chinese
manufacturers will have to pay royalties in order to export ATSC TVs to the
US. They feel that $23 will "make it impossible for them to break even."

The article goes on to say that the major patent holders in this royalty
dispute are Thomson and Sony. [But Psycho Bob blames the Koreans...]



-- Mark --

http://staff.washington.edu/mrc
Science does not emerge from voting, party politics, or public debate.
Si vis pacem, para bellum.