TV over LAN - advice please

"Dean" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 08:12:00 +0100, Dean wrote:

On Wed, 20 Sep 2006 10:29:55 +0100, Dr Zoidberg wrote:

In our new office building we are planning on having a few flat screens
scattered about the building and need a way of distributing a video feed
to
them.

As far as I can see we have a number of options.

1) Coax feeds to all locations - needs RF output from video source , not
easy to move screens.
2) Composite video/RGB + audio feeds to all locations - easier to connect
to
multiple sources , same problem with moving screens if we need to , and
lots
of cables.
3) devices like the slingbox or Sony equivalent that feed a video signal
over the LAN http://www.slingmedia.com/indexa.php
No need for any extra cabling above the normal cat6 , but it would
require a
PC connected to every screen. On the upside , PCs and screens could
easily
be moved to different locations as everywhere will be cabled for cat 5.
4) converters that send audio and video signals over cat5 cable - no need
for PCs with the screens , but will the quality be any good?

Has anyone had practical experience of options 3 or 4?

Have you considered something like Hauppauge MVP?

Sorry, I meant to add that I recently used the MVP, ditched the Hauppauge
software and ran a streaming video client, IPTV
http://www.quixotic-research.net/. These boxes boot via dhcp/tftp. You
then
broadcast video from say VLC www.videolan.org. The MVP can only decode
MPEG2 video but with VLC you can transcode and it also supports multicast.
HTH


We set something up like this. We bought a Hauppauge PVR150 and installed
it in a fairly low spec P3 running a basic Ubuntu setup. Installed IVTV and
VLC, Ubuntu found the PVR card on boot and VLC can stream the built-in
analogue tuner or a feed from either the composite or s-video inputs. We
used a freeview box into the composite input and VLC to stream, lots of
transcoding and bit rate options too, we use http. The clients then simply
have a shortcut on the windows desktops to connect to the 'tv server' and
view whatever is being streamed so they can't get that wrong. You can
(apparently) stream multiple channels by fitting additional tv cards, though
not tried that. You can also install LIRC on the tv server to make use of
the PVR150's remote control to change analogue channels or inputs.

Steve

"Dr Zoidberg" wrote in message
...
In our new office building we are planning on having a few flat screens
scattered about the building and need a way of distributing a video feed
to them.

As far as I can see we have a number of options.

1) Coax feeds to all locations - needs RF output from video source , not
easy to move screens.
2) Composite video/RGB + audio feeds to all locations - easier to connect
to multiple sources , same problem with moving screens if we need to , and
lots of cables.
3) devices like the slingbox or Sony equivalent that feed a video signal
over the LAN http://www.slingmedia.com/indexa.php
No need for any extra cabling above the normal cat6 , but it would require
a PC connected to every screen. On the upside , PCs and screens could
easily be moved to different locations as everywhere will be cabled for
cat 5.
4) converters that send audio and video signals over cat5 cable - no need
for PCs with the screens , but will the quality be any good?

Has anyone had practical experience of options 3 or 4?

--
Alex

Piece by piece the penguins have taken my sanity
www.drzoidberg.co.uk www.ebayfaq.co.uk


OK, one last try, for some reason my response keeps appearing as
unavailable, doh!

We set something up like this. We bought a Hauppauge PVR150 and installed
it in a fairly low spec P3 running a basic Ubuntu setup. Installed IVTV and
VLC, Ubuntu found the PVR card on boot and VLC can stream the built-in
analogue tuner or a feed from either the composite or s-video inputs. We
used a freeview box into the composite input and VLC to stream, lots of
transcoding and bit rate options too, we use http. The clients then simply
have a shortcut on the windows desktops to connect to the 'tv server' and
view whatever is being streamed so they can't get that wrong. You can
(apparently) stream multiple channels by fitting additional tv cards, though
not tried that. You can also install LIRC on the tv server to make use of
the PVR150's remote control to change analogue channels or inputs.

Steve

Owain wrote:

Now if I can get some nice user friendly version of Linux then it
should be easy enough to train them how to start things up , but
it's by no means certain :0)

What about a thin client application running on a modded Xbox.
Wouldn't even need a keyboard.

Xbox Linux [1] distributions [2] can run VLC (VideoLAN client [3]),
mplayer [4], Freevo [5], MythTV [6], etc. For example, it is possible to
multicast a DVB broadcast to the LAN and view it with a modified Xbox.
Or tune in to the same stream simultaneously with several modified
Xboxes.

It's also possible to run rdesktop [7] for "Remote Desktop" sessions to
Windows XP Pro machines (or Terminal Server sessions to Windows Terminal
Server.) Or VNC [8], if that feels like a better approach. These
techniques make it possible, for instance, to remotely display a
PowerPoint presentation from your own desktop PC.

Things can be configured in an idiot-proof way - with the Xbox booting
straight into a simple, nice graphical menu with limited options. It is
also possible to use devices such as USB remote controls or wireless
"desktops" (mouse + keyboard combinations) on a modified Xbox.

One caveat, however, is that unlike the earlier models, the latest
Xboxes (hardware version 1.6) do not support overscan [9] compensation
in hardware. This isn't too bad for full-screen video players, but can
make the use of ordinary desktop applications tricky. (You would perhaps
need to use Xnest for keeping the desktop applications within the "safe
area".)

* * *

If I was the IT guy for a company, I could certainly consider deploying
modified Xboxes for this kind of use, but I also acknowledge that a
solution built on modified Xboxes might be considered a bit too
"hackish" for some environments.

Finally, it should also be pointed out that in company environments, no
"native" homebrew Xbox applications could be used at all because the
binaries for such software (such as the Xbox Media Center [10]) contain
unlicensed Microsoft code. This makes Linux applications the only legal
option as far as application software goes, and Cromwell [11] the only
legal "alternative" firmware.

_____

[1] http://www.xbox-linux.org/
[2] http://www.xbox-linux.org/wiki/Download
[3] http://www.videolan.org/vlc/streaming.html
[4] http://www.mplayerhq.hu/design7/info.html
[5] http://freevo.sourceforge.net/screenshots.html
[6] http://www.mythtv.org/modules.php?name=MythFeatures
[7] http://www.rdesktop.org/
[8] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VNC
[9] http://scanline.ca/overscan/
[10] http://www.xboxmediacenter.de/info_screens.htm
[11] http://www.xbox-linux.org/wiki/Cromwell_Manual

--
znark

Steve wrote:

We set something up like this. We bought a Hauppauge PVR150 and
installed it in a fairly low spec P3 running a basic Ubuntu setup.
Installed IVTV and VLC, Ubuntu found the PVR card on boot and VLC can
stream the built-in analogue tuner or a feed from either the
composite or s-video inputs. We used a freeview box into the
composite input and VLC to stream, lots of transcoding and bit rate
options too, we use http.

Capturing the DVB broadcast from a separate set-top box - using an
analogue capture card and analogue connections - was probably the most
convenient way in your setup, but you could also have used a dedicated
DVB-S/T/C card for receiving the DVB broadcast directly to the computer
in its original digital format.

--
znark

Jukka Aho wrote:

If I was the IT guy for a company, I could certainly consider
deploying modified Xboxes for this kind of use, but I also
acknowledge that a solution built on modified Xboxes might be
considered a bit too "hackish" for some environments.

Yup , those in charge wouldn't go for anything that sounds like a bodge.
Some cheap SFF PCs running Linux would be fine though
--
Alex

Piece by piece the penguins have taken my sanity
www.drzoidberg.co.uk www.ebayfaq.co.uk

"Jukka Aho" wrote in message
...
Steve wrote:

We set something up like this. We bought a Hauppauge PVR150 and
installed it in a fairly low spec P3 running a basic Ubuntu setup.
Installed IVTV and VLC, Ubuntu found the PVR card on boot and VLC can
stream the built-in analogue tuner or a feed from either the
composite or s-video inputs. We used a freeview box into the
composite input and VLC to stream, lots of transcoding and bit rate
options too, we use http.

Capturing the DVB broadcast from a separate set-top box - using an
analogue capture card and analogue connections - was probably the most
convenient way in your setup, but you could also have used a dedicated
DVB-S/T/C card for receiving the DVB broadcast directly to the computer in
its original digital format.

--
znark


Sure thing, but when we started the project we didn't have a good enough
digital signal, we're in a very marginal area for Freeview and an existing
Freeview box was practically unwatchable. Only after we bought the tv card
did the building's aerial, splitter/amp and cable get upgraded. This was a
pretty inexpensive setup to stream tv, video, dvd or whatever, tv card for
about £65, a cheap Freeview box from Tesco for about £25, an old redundant
pc and some free software, plus a few hours of my time.

Steve

Dr Zoidberg wrote:
steve wrote:
Dr Zoidberg wrote:
linker3000 wrote:
steve wrote:
Certainly use the PCs, but Windows+MS Office for Powerpoint equals
an additional few hundred notes. Use a diskless mini-itx box
running a minimalist Linux with one of the many video options.
Such a box should set you back less than ?200 notes.

If the video is compressed then 802.11g can work too
...or stick to Windows and use OpenOffice which will cope with most
PowerPoints unless they are too complex.
Bear in mind that these PCs will need to be operated by typical
office workers and recepitionists with about half a clue between
them. If it's not ***exactly*** the same as their normal windows desktop
they'll struggle
Really depends on the application - is it a normal PC occasionally
showing video or a dedicated video client (with single or multiple
feeds).
I also think you under estimate people's ability to operate computers

I do our internal IT support for these people , some of them can be
amazingly dense.

Oh, I do know,.
I was having to talk one of our salespeople through running a program a few
weeks back and I had to go step by step starting with clicking the Start
button , moving the pointer to the "all programs" section........

Indeed, though that does prove my point, they are daily windows users
yet are still lost. Windows is not the issue, the people are.


Now if I can get some nice user friendly version of Linux then it should be
easy enough to train them how to start things up , but it's by no means
certain :0)

I still don't know exactly what you are trying to achieve, why do you
need operators at the physical node for instance? Are you showing a live
feed to all boxes, a looped feed to all boxes, a different looped feed
to each box. All of these don't require local intervention.

Perhaps you need to allow people to display a certain video at a certain
time? Burn a DVD and use a £30 DVD player.

Requirements......

On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 12:06:55 +0100, Steve wrote:


"Dean" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 08:12:00 +0100, Dean wrote:

On Wed, 20 Sep 2006 10:29:55 +0100, Dr Zoidberg wrote:

In our new office building we are planning on having a few flat screens
scattered about the building and need a way of distributing a video feed
to
them.

As far as I can see we have a number of options.

1) Coax feeds to all locations - needs RF output from video source , not
easy to move screens.
2) Composite video/RGB + audio feeds to all locations - easier to connect
to
multiple sources , same problem with moving screens if we need to , and
lots
of cables.
3) devices like the slingbox or Sony equivalent that feed a video signal
over the LAN http://www.slingmedia.com/indexa.php
No need for any extra cabling above the normal cat6 , but it would
require a
PC connected to every screen. On the upside , PCs and screens could
easily
be moved to different locations as everywhere will be cabled for cat 5.
4) converters that send audio and video signals over cat5 cable - no need
for PCs with the screens , but will the quality be any good?

Has anyone had practical experience of options 3 or 4?

Have you considered something like Hauppauge MVP?

Sorry, I meant to add that I recently used the MVP, ditched the Hauppauge
software and ran a streaming video client, IPTV
http://www.quixotic-research.net/. These boxes boot via dhcp/tftp. You
then
broadcast video from say VLC www.videolan.org. The MVP can only decode
MPEG2 video but with VLC you can transcode and it also supports multicast.
HTH


We set something up like this. We bought a Hauppauge PVR150 and installed
it in a fairly low spec P3 running a basic Ubuntu setup. Installed IVTV and
VLC, Ubuntu found the PVR card on boot and VLC can stream the built-in
analogue tuner or a feed from either the composite or s-video inputs. We
used a freeview box into the composite input and VLC to stream, lots of
transcoding and bit rate options too, we use http. The clients then simply
have a shortcut on the windows desktops to connect to the 'tv server' and
view whatever is being streamed so they can't get that wrong. You can
(apparently) stream multiple channels by fitting additional tv cards, though
not tried that. You can also install LIRC on the tv server to make use of
the PVR150's remote control to change analogue channels or inputs.

Steve


With a PCI freeview card, you can stream a whole mux. The client can then
select the desired pid.
For freeview I used linux on the server too. I also had good results using
VLC to stream a IEEE1394 connected camcorder on windows xp.

On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 17:06:46 +0100, Steve wrote:


"Jukka Aho" wrote in message
t...
Steve wrote:

We set something up like this. We bought a Hauppauge PVR150 and
installed it in a fairly low spec P3 running a basic Ubuntu setup.
Installed IVTV and VLC, Ubuntu found the PVR card on boot and VLC can
stream the built-in analogue tuner or a feed from either the
composite or s-video inputs. We used a freeview box into the
composite input and VLC to stream, lots of transcoding and bit rate
options too, we use http.

Capturing the DVB broadcast from a separate set-top box - using an
analogue capture card and analogue connections - was probably the most
convenient way in your setup, but you could also have used a dedicated
DVB-S/T/C card for receiving the DVB broadcast directly to the computer in
its original digital format.

--
znark


Sure thing, but when we started the project we didn't have a good enough
digital signal, we're in a very marginal area for Freeview and an existing
Freeview box was practically unwatchable. Only after we bought the tv card
did the building's aerial, splitter/amp and cable get upgraded. This was a
pretty inexpensive setup to stream tv, video, dvd or whatever, tv card for
about £65, a cheap Freeview box from Tesco for about £25, an old redundant
pc and some free software, plus a few hours of my time.

Steve


I found my PCI DVB-T cards need a higher SNR than standalone freeview boxes
due to all the signal noise generated by the PC.

On Wed, 20 Sep 2006 10:29:55 +0100, Dr Zoidberg wrote:

In our new office building we are planning on having a few flat screens
scattered about the building and need a way of distributing a video feed to
them.

As far as I can see we have a number of options.

1) Coax feeds to all locations - needs RF output from video source , not
easy to move screens.
2) Composite video/RGB + audio feeds to all locations - easier to connect to
multiple sources , same problem with moving screens if we need to , and lots
of cables.
3) devices like the slingbox or Sony equivalent that feed a video signal
over the LAN http://www.slingmedia.com/indexa.php
No need for any extra cabling above the normal cat6 , but it would require a
PC connected to every screen. On the upside , PCs and screens could easily
be moved to different locations as everywhere will be cabled for cat 5.
4) converters that send audio and video signals over cat5 cable - no need
for PCs with the screens , but will the quality be any good?

Has anyone had practical experience of options 3 or 4?

Use the PC's and install ORB on the sender server.
You can then stream the video to each PC on demand.
Orb is a slingbox system but freeware