Death of OTA Broadcasting

Jim L wrote:
Being an OTA fan for 50+ years, I am sad to say that I will be forced into
cable in 2009. I'm sure that there are thousands like me in the Pacific
Northwest that are in the same boat. We have put up 30+ foot high gain hdtv
antennas and gone to extreme lengths to get the new OTA digital broadcasts
only to find that a little wind in the trees and it is gone. We wait for
winter for the trees to shed so we can get better reception. We switch to
the NTSC channels for relief, knowing that those will be going away in a
couple of years. We are resolved to the fact that a high percentage of
folks will be forced onto cable or satelite in 2009 and we are a part of
those. Who won? The cable companies. Maybe we will put our $60 a month
into DVD's or Blue Ray..........(:}

Jim


Loss of signal due to wind in the trees is NOT necessary. This is
multipath and this problem has been solved.

The only reason you have a problem is because the US has chosen a
modulation, 8-VSB, that was not designed nor is it capable of handling
dynamic multipath like what you describe.

That goes for the best 5th gen receivers also though none have been
offered on the market yet. So far only inferior 5th gen receivers are
for sale.

This problem does not exist in most countries that have gone digital and
in those countries the sale and promotion of DTV is extremely
successful. They are all using modulation that use COFDM.

Tell your Congressperson.

Bob Miller

Bob Miller wrote:

Loss of signal due to wind in the trees is NOT necessary. This is
multipath and this problem has been solved.

The only reason you have a problem is because the US has chosen a
modulation, 8-VSB, that was not designed nor is it capable of handling
dynamic multipath like what you describe.

That goes for the best 5th gen receivers also though none have been
offered on the market yet. So far only inferior 5th gen receivers are
for sale.

This problem does not exist in most countries that have gone digital and
in those countries the sale and promotion of DTV is extremely
successful. They are all using modulation that use COFDM.

Tell your Congressperson.

Bob Miller

Who has offered only "inferior" 5th generation receivers Bob?

Chip

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"Bob Miller" wrote in message
ink.net...
Jim L wrote:
Being an OTA fan for 50+ years, I am sad to say that I will be forced
into cable in 2009. I'm sure that there are thousands like me in the
Pacific Northwest that are in the same boat. We have put up 30+ foot
high gain hdtv antennas and gone to extreme lengths to get the new OTA
digital broadcasts only to find that a little wind in the trees and it is
gone. We wait for winter for the trees to shed so we can get better
reception. We switch to the NTSC channels for relief, knowing that those
will be going away in a couple of years. We are resolved to the fact
that a high percentage of folks will be forced onto cable or satelite in
2009 and we are a part of those. Who won? The cable companies. Maybe
we will put our $60 a month into DVD's or Blue Ray..........(:}

Jim
Loss of signal due to wind in the trees is NOT necessary. This is
multipath and this problem has been solved.

The only reason you have a problem is because the US has chosen a
modulation, 8-VSB, that was not designed nor is it capable of handling
dynamic multipath like what you describe.

That goes for the best 5th gen receivers also though none have been
offered on the market yet. So far only inferior 5th gen receivers are for
sale.

This problem does not exist in most countries that have gone digital and
in those countries the sale and promotion of DTV is extremely successful.
They are all using modulation that use COFDM.

Tell your Congressperson.

Bob Miller



Tell your congressperson "thank-you" for NOT letting miller get rich with
his COFDM/mobile-datacasting garbage.

http://www.megalithia.com/elect/aerialsite/settop.html

Yes...OTA 8-VSB signals are picky. For one thing, the digital channels
have been moved UP in frequency from where the analogs were. These higher
frequencies don't propagate as well in hilly/forested terrain. Also, there
was some forgiveness in the analogs, as multipath showed up as some
ghosting, but you didn't loose the picture. You get alittle multipath with
8-VSB and you've lost your picture. No....there is no forgiveness with OTA
DTV here in the US. I only speak from my personal experience.

Regards, Jim

wrote in message
...
"Jim L" wrote:

We have put up 30+ foot high gain hdtv
antennas and gone to extreme lengths to get the new OTA digital broadcasts
only to find that a little wind in the trees and it is gone. We wait for
winter for the trees to shed so we can get better reception. We switch to
the NTSC channels

Are OTA digital channels THAT picky abt signal?

You believe that analog OTA signals are much more
robust in that they are more reliable as far as
reception?

On Sun, 6 Aug 2006, Bob Miller wrote:
This problem does not exist in most countries that have gone digital

Instead of having multipath, they have distance reception problems and
lose the signal due to impulse noise if a motor is running nearby.
Problem reports are pouring in from all over the UK and Australia.

and in
those countries the sale and promotion of DTV is extremely successful.

But much less successful than in the USA, which is the only country with
nationwide HDTV.

They
are all using modulation that use COFDM.

Thanks to COFDM, they are all wondering how they will ever catch up with
the USA. Thanks to COFDM, Europe doesn't have OTA HDTV at all, but are
hoping maybe to have some by 2011.

Tell your Congressperson.

Yes, tell your Congressperson "thank you" for not allowing Psycho Bob
Miller (and his fellow scoundrels) to ruin HDTV.

-- Mark --

http://panda.com/mrc
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.

On Sun, 6 Aug 2006, David wrote:
http://www.megalithia.com/elect/aerialsite/settop.html

Psycho Bob doesn't believe that. He insists that all you need are little
rabbit ears on the TV and you can receive COFDM stations from hundreds of
miles away (presumably using the magic Tesla coil mounted on his tin-foil
hat).

Psycho Bob has yet to address the hard data on that web page. He just
wants you to believe that all signal strength/quality issues are based
solely upon the modulation and have nothing to do with the antenna.

-- Mark --

http://panda.com/mrc
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.

Bob Miller wrote:

Tell your Congressperson.

Bob Miller

Tell your congressperson what? That, at this late stage of the game, we
should switch to COFDM? You are a damn fool if you think that will ever
happen. Seeing that and some of the other lies and crap you posted in
the past few years leave some of us to conclude that you can no longer
make logical conclusions. It doesn't matter how much you don't like it
or how much money you lost because of it, 8-VSB is here to stay. Live
with it.
--
Bill R.

Remove nospam_ in e-mail address to reply by e-mail

"Jim L" writes:

Yes...OTA 8-VSB signals are picky. For one thing, the digital channels
have been moved UP in frequency from where the analogs were. These higher
frequencies don't propagate as well in hilly/forested terrain. Also, there
was some forgiveness in the analogs, as multipath showed up as some
ghosting, but you didn't loose the picture. You get alittle multipath with
8-VSB and you've lost your picture. No....there is no forgiveness with OTA
DTV here in the US. I only speak from my personal experience.

Regards, Jim

I thought they (e.g., Motorola) "solved" the 8-VSB multipath problem
years ago with "blind adaptive equalization." Not true?
--
% Randy Yates % "Rollin' and riding and slippin' and
%% Fuquay-Varina, NC % sliding, it's magic."
%%% 919-577-9882 %
%%%% % 'Living' Thing', *A New World Record*, ELO
http://home.earthlink.net/~yatescr

"Gonzo" writes:

"Randy Yates" wrote in message
...
"Gonzo" writes:

Now we have to pay for TV and we are still force fed advertisments
as well.

I guess Im the only one that sees something wrong with that. The
broadcasters are having their cake and eating it too.

Amen, brother! I second that.

This will however change in the digital age.

Huh? I only see it getting worse. As more and more
lawyers get involved and DRM gets more entrenched,
our options get smaller.

Well the entire idea behind the Government mandate

Government mandate? I have no idea what you're referring to.

is to give the air back to the people who are paying the taxes and
curbing the power of the monopolisitic broadcasting system we have
now.

You may very well be right though. Regardless, I will refuse cable and
satelite and I will NOT pay for advertisement funded TV no mater what comes.

I applaud you. I wish I had the discipline to also refuse it. Instead,
I pay $65/month for DISH and channel-hop during the commercials.

BTW, I never had a TIVO, but I hear they're making it illegal to sell
such devices now.
--
% Randy Yates % "So now it's getting late,
%% Fuquay-Varina, NC % and those who hesitate
%%% 919-577-9882 % got no one..."
%%%% % 'Waterfall', *Face The Music*, ELO
http://home.earthlink.net/~yatescr

On Sun, 06 Aug 2006 15:08:00 +0000, Jim L wrote:

Being an OTA fan for 50+ years, I am sad to say that I will be forced into
cable in 2009. I'm sure that there are thousands like me in the Pacific
Northwest that are in the same boat. We have put up 30+ foot high gain hdtv
antennas and gone to extreme lengths to get the new OTA digital broadcasts
only to find that a little wind in the trees and it is gone. We wait for
winter for the trees to shed so we can get better reception. We switch to
the NTSC channels for relief, knowing that those will be going away in a
couple of years. We are resolved to the fact that a high percentage of
folks will be forced onto cable or satelite in 2009 and we are a part of
those. Who won? The cable companies. Maybe we will put our $60 a month
into DVD's or Blue Ray..........(:}

This from a person that thinks there is such a thing as an HDTV antenna.:-)
An OTA antenna is just that, the same antenna you used with analog is
usuable with digital. Now if you had a crappy antenna to begin with, you
may or may not receive the digital signal very good. There's also a
possibilty that the digital stations in your area aren't broadcasting at
full power yet. And there's a hugh tree about 30 ft. in front of my
antenna and it doesn't present a major problem. I'm about 45miles from the
towers. Screw analog. It sucks. I wish they'd dump it today.

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