Philips LCD misleading specifications?

Sorry for the long post.

I recently purchased a Philips 37" HDTV TV model 37PF7320A. I purchased it
after researching its specifications on the internet and then going to look
at in the store. After bringing it home I took a look at the included cdrom.
On the cdrom are pages listing the specifications. I was unpleasantly
suprised to find the specifications listed on Philips website and the
specifications listed on the cdrom were quite a bit different.

On the web the response time is shown to be 8ms, on the cdrom 16ms. Contrast
on the web 800:1, on the cdrom 500:1. Brightness on the web 550cd/m, on the
cdrom 1000cd/m. There were also minor differences in the supported display
resolutions and a couple of other minor things.

I wanted to find out what the correct numbers were so I called Philips.
After I exhausted the nice Indian gentleman's prepared responses I was
tranferred to someone in America. I explained the situation and asked him
which specifications were correct and why there was a discrepancy. He
assured me the specifications posted on the interent were the correct
specifications but could not tell me why there was a difference between the
two. He seemed to be guessing about his answers.

I called back again (2) other times and also chatted with one of their
representatives online. (2) were positive the internet was correct and (2)
were positive the cd was correct.

I then emailed Philips with the same questions and received the reply copied
at the bottom of the post.

So basically I guess if you buy something from Philips you don't know
exactly what you are getting until you open the box.

Am I wrong to be very annoyed about this?

By the way tv has a very nice picture except for the black levels. The fonts
on the remote are ridiculously small and the program menu is not at all
intuitive. Owners manual is also very lame.

Francis

Dear Philips Customer,

Thank you for your email to Philips Customer Care.


We have received your request regarding the reason behind the different
information provided in the specification sheets and the CD for model
37PF7320A/37. We apologize for the confusion but as response to this
request, the CD contains accurate information since the specification sheets
merely provide an overview about the features of the TV.


For further information or if you wish to speak to a Customer Service
Representative, you may call us at 1-888-PHILIPS 7AM-11Pm EST
Mondays-Saturdays, and 8AM-11PM on Sundays. You will be listening to an
Interactive Voice Response Unit so please follow the voice prompts
accordingly and choose the best category that suits your product. Kindly
provide your reference number, ######, to the Customer Service
Representative who will be assisting you.

"Francis K" wrote in message
...
Sorry for the long post.

I recently purchased a Philips 37" HDTV TV model 37PF7320A. I purchased it
after researching its specifications on the internet and then going to
look at in the store. After bringing it home I took a look at the included
cdrom. On the cdrom are pages listing the specifications. I was
unpleasantly suprised to find the specifications listed on Philips website
and the specifications listed on the cdrom were quite a bit different.

On the web the response time is shown to be 8ms, on the cdrom 16ms.
Contrast on the web 800:1, on the cdrom 500:1. Brightness on the web
550cd/m, on the cdrom 1000cd/m. There were also minor differences in the
supported display resolutions and a couple of other minor things.

I wanted to find out what the correct numbers were so I called Philips.
After I exhausted the nice Indian gentleman's prepared responses I was
tranferred to someone in America. I explained the situation and asked him
which specifications were correct and why there was a discrepancy. He
assured me the specifications posted on the interent were the correct
specifications but could not tell me why there was a difference between
the two. He seemed to be guessing about his answers.

I called back again (2) other times and also chatted with one of their
representatives online. (2) were positive the internet was correct and (2)
were positive the cd was correct.

I then emailed Philips with the same questions and received the reply
copied at the bottom of the post.

So basically I guess if you buy something from Philips you don't know
exactly what you are getting until you open the box.

Am I wrong to be very annoyed about this?

By the way tv has a very nice picture except for the black levels. The
fonts on the remote are ridiculously small and the program menu is not at
all intuitive. Owners manual is also very lame.

Francis

Dear Philips Customer,

Thank you for your email to Philips Customer Care.


We have received your request regarding the reason behind the different
information provided in the specification sheets and the CD for model
37PF7320A/37. We apologize for the confusion but as response to this
request, the CD contains accurate information since the specification
sheets merely provide an overview about the features of the TV.


For further information or if you wish to speak to a Customer Service
Representative, you may call us at 1-888-PHILIPS 7AM-11Pm EST
Mondays-Saturdays, and 8AM-11PM on Sundays. You will be listening to an
Interactive Voice Response Unit so please follow the voice prompts
accordingly and choose the best category that suits your product. Kindly
provide your reference number, ######, to the Customer Service
Representative who will be assisting you.



Not at all out of line to be a bit PO'd at them. I'd probably be that way
too. I'm personally in a ****ing match with Best Buy over some stupid
little stuff that went down over the past couple months, but it is a matter
of priciple, so they've lost my business. Part of me would want to return
the TV just for spite and the other part would say keep it, you like the tv.
BTW - Nice looking TV and good reviews. And, black levels are an issues on
all LCD tvs, so don't get too hung up on it being a weakness of that tv.

Okay, so which spec is correct? Bottom line, really... Who cares? To me,
it is not so much the spec, but how the picture really looks. You can get
two tvs with the same specs and they look completely different. So, if you
think you got a good deal by the features and the picture you got, then just
get over it and enjoy your new toy. You liked it enough to buy it and the
reviews are good, so it is most likely a good purchase.

That's just my opinion. But, it wouldn't stop me from writing a nastygram
to the company - who know's maybe they'll throw you a bone, a lot of
companies will do that when they get a valid complaint.

Just a thought... Could the CD be for a model number that is similar, but
not exact? Perhaps it is from a previous model. My first guess would be
the specs on the web and at the stores is the correct version.

Jim

"Scooby" wrote in message
ink.net...
"Francis K" wrote in message
...


Not at all out of line to be a bit PO'd at them. I'd probably be that way
too. I'm personally in a ****ing match with Best Buy over some stupid
little stuff that went down over the past couple months, but it is a
matter of priciple, so they've lost my business. Part of me would want to
return the TV just for spite and the other part would say keep it, you
like the tv. BTW - Nice looking TV and good reviews. And, black levels
are an issues on all LCD tvs, so don't get too hung up on it being a
weakness of that tv.

Okay, so which spec is correct? Bottom line, really... Who cares? To
me, it is not so much the spec, but how the picture really looks. You can
get two tvs with the same specs and they look completely different. So,
if you think you got a good deal by the features and the picture you got,
then just get over it and enjoy your new toy. You liked it enough to buy
it and the reviews are good, so it is most likely a good purchase.

That's just my opinion. But, it wouldn't stop me from writing a nastygram
to the company - who know's maybe they'll throw you a bone, a lot of
companies will do that when they get a valid complaint.

Just a thought... Could the CD be for a model number that is similar, but
not exact? Perhaps it is from a previous model. My first guess would be
the specs on the web and at the stores is the correct version.

Jim


Thank you for the reply.

Model numbers are exactly the same on both. They used my serial number to
confirm the cd matched my tv and the model number on the web page is exactly
the same also. I also thought the information posted on the web would be
more accurate but according to 3 out of 5 of my contacts with them the cdrom
is correct. I was thinking about going for 6 out of 10 but I really don't
have the time.

My main problem with the whole situation is millions of people use the
specifications provided by manufacturers to help them choose which products
to buy. Whether it's a tv's contrast ratios or a cars horsepower. When you
look at tv's in stores you usually don't have much choice in what kind of
signal is being fed into them, lighting, etc... My eyes can't automatically
tell whether a tv is 720p or 1080p just by looking at it in the store. I
have to read the specs.

It's ridiculous to only be able to find out the true specifications of a
product by purchasing the item and opening the box. Fortunately I bought it
from Costco which has a great return policy. I haven't decided yet if I'm
annoyed enough to bring it back. (My wife likes it and just rolls her eyes
when I mention the specification thing.)

Francis

Francis K ) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
On the web the response time is shown to be 8ms, on the cdrom 16ms.

Since there is no standard for LCD pixel response time specs, if one is
"off to on" while the other is "off to on to off" (both are used by
different companies), they would match pretty much exactly.

Contrast
on the web 800:1, on the cdrom 500:1.

Not a good thing, but contrast isn't much of a big deal after about 300:1.
Linear response in darker regions is far more important.

--
Jeff Rife | "Because he was human; because he had goodness;
| because he was moral they called him insane.
| Delusions of grandeur; visions of splendor;
| A manic-depressive, he walks in the rain."
| -- Rush, "Cinderella Man"

"Francis K" wrote in
:

Sorry for the long post.

I recently purchased a Philips 37" HDTV TV model 37PF7320A. I
purchased it after researching its specifications on the internet and
then going to look at in the store. After bringing it home I took a
look at the included cdrom. On the cdrom are pages listing the
specifications. I was unpleasantly suprised to find the specifications
listed on Philips website and the specifications listed on the cdrom
were quite a bit different.

On the web the response time is shown to be 8ms, on the cdrom 16ms.
Contrast on the web 800:1, on the cdrom 500:1. Brightness on the web
550cd/m, on the cdrom 1000cd/m. There were also minor differences in
the supported display resolutions and a couple of other minor things.

I wanted to find out what the correct numbers were so I called
Philips. After I exhausted the nice Indian gentleman's prepared
responses I was tranferred to someone in America. I explained the
situation and asked him which specifications were correct and why
there was a discrepancy. He assured me the specifications posted on
the interent were the correct specifications but could not tell me why
there was a difference between the two. He seemed to be guessing about
his answers.

I called back again (2) other times and also chatted with one of their
representatives online. (2) were positive the internet was correct and
(2) were positive the cd was correct.

I then emailed Philips with the same questions and received the reply
copied at the bottom of the post.

So basically I guess if you buy something from Philips you don't know
exactly what you are getting until you open the box.

Am I wrong to be very annoyed about this?

By the way tv has a very nice picture except for the black levels. The
fonts on the remote are ridiculously small and the program menu is not
at all intuitive. Owners manual is also very lame.

Francis

Dear Philips Customer,

Thank you for your email to Philips Customer Care.


We have received your request regarding the reason behind the
different information provided in the specification sheets and the CD
for model 37PF7320A/37. We apologize for the confusion but as response
to this request, the CD contains accurate information since the
specification sheets merely provide an overview about the features of
the TV.


For further information or if you wish to speak to a Customer Service
Representative, you may call us at 1-888-PHILIPS 7AM-11Pm EST
Mondays-Saturdays, and 8AM-11PM on Sundays. You will be listening to
an Interactive Voice Response Unit so please follow the voice prompts
accordingly and choose the best category that suits your product.
Kindly provide your reference number, ######, to the Customer Service
Representative who will be assisting you.



What I didn't like about that TV is the remote allows you to switch
between the TV, VCR, DVD & cable but you can't program it. I called
Philips and they said it is only programed for Philips products. It's
useless for my needs! I couldn't find a signal strength indicator either
but I think it has a great picture and is stylish.

In the FAQ on the support web page it gives instructions on how to program
the remote to work with some devices but it doesn't mention whether they
have to be philips products or not. I tried the instructions but couldn't
get it to work with any of my equipment.

There was nothing in the owners manual except a sentence saying it would
work with most philips products.

http://www.p4c.philips.com/cgi-bin/d...slg=AEN&scy=US

The owners manual on the cdrom also has more information than the printed
owners manual for some odd reason.

"Wayne" wrote in message
. 102...
"Francis K" wrote in
:

Sorry for the long post.

I recently purchased a Philips 37" HDTV TV model 37PF7320A. I
purchased it after researching its specifications on the internet and
then going to look at in the store. After bringing it home I took a
look at the included cdrom. On the cdrom are pages listing the
specifications. I was unpleasantly suprised to find the specifications
listed on Philips website and the specifications listed on the cdrom
were quite a bit different.

On the web the response time is shown to be 8ms, on the cdrom 16ms.
Contrast on the web 800:1, on the cdrom 500:1. Brightness on the web
550cd/m, on the cdrom 1000cd/m. There were also minor differences in
the supported display resolutions and a couple of other minor things.

I wanted to find out what the correct numbers were so I called
Philips. After I exhausted the nice Indian gentleman's prepared
responses I was tranferred to someone in America. I explained the
situation and asked him which specifications were correct and why
there was a discrepancy. He assured me the specifications posted on
the interent were the correct specifications but could not tell me why
there was a difference between the two. He seemed to be guessing about
his answers.

I called back again (2) other times and also chatted with one of their
representatives online. (2) were positive the internet was correct and
(2) were positive the cd was correct.

I then emailed Philips with the same questions and received the reply
copied at the bottom of the post.

So basically I guess if you buy something from Philips you don't know
exactly what you are getting until you open the box.

Am I wrong to be very annoyed about this?

By the way tv has a very nice picture except for the black levels. The
fonts on the remote are ridiculously small and the program menu is not
at all intuitive. Owners manual is also very lame.

Francis

Dear Philips Customer,

Thank you for your email to Philips Customer Care.


We have received your request regarding the reason behind the
different information provided in the specification sheets and the CD
for model 37PF7320A/37. We apologize for the confusion but as response
to this request, the CD contains accurate information since the
specification sheets merely provide an overview about the features of
the TV.


For further information or if you wish to speak to a Customer Service
Representative, you may call us at 1-888-PHILIPS 7AM-11Pm EST
Mondays-Saturdays, and 8AM-11PM on Sundays. You will be listening to
an Interactive Voice Response Unit so please follow the voice prompts
accordingly and choose the best category that suits your product.
Kindly provide your reference number, ######, to the Customer Service
Representative who will be assisting you.



What I didn't like about that TV is the remote allows you to switch
between the TV, VCR, DVD & cable but you can't program it. I called
Philips and they said it is only programed for Philips products. It's
useless for my needs! I couldn't find a signal strength indicator either
but I think it has a great picture and is stylish.

"Francis K" wrote in

So basically I guess if you buy something from Philips you don't know
exactly what you are getting until you open the box.

Am I wrong to be very annoyed about this?


I am not an engineer, but I used to work for a company that manufactured
electronics. Releasing a product from the engineering organization to
the factory organization for production did not mean it was a stable
product. Instead the process engineers took over, and it was their job
to find faster and cheaper means of production. Cheaper focused heavily
on quality levels because the cost of producing rejected products is
always rolled into the cost of producing good units. As quality levels
rise, the cost per good unit falls. The process engineers typically did
their job and every product would go through a series of product
revision levels.

In addition, the purchasing organization would play a role and they
could change the source for components several times - engineering could
have specified Motorola in the original design and purchasing would buy
Samsung components for a few months and then later switch back to
Motorola or go to a third vendor. Swapping components could sometimes
trigger other changes in the design or manufacturing process.

An added problem is the consumer documentation is probably outsourced
and may not reflect the changes in the product engineering. Sometimes
this is really obvious because the pictures don't match the product as
received.

You can hope the marketing organization and company lawyers are involved
enough to prevent a reduction in the specs below what is being advertised.

As consumers we have a right to be annoyed when the specs don't match
and the manufacturer can't give us a straightforward answer as to why
the specs don't match. But a guess is you probably have old consumer
documentation and the product you have is performing at the better
specs. That said, it is always good to check for a manufacturing date
to ensure your unit has not been sitting in a warehouse for years
because units manufactured later are usually (not always) better.

Roger

I tried the proceedure listed but it doesn't work for this remote. That's
why I called Philips. I will probably get an universal remote soon. I
wonder if the plasmas have a different remote then the LCD'S? Did you see
that the supplied IR cable has NO function at this time? Software
upgrades may fix that but it probably won't work with anything but
Philips components.


"Francis K" wrote in
:

In the FAQ on the support web page it gives instructions on how to
program the remote to work with some devices but it doesn't mention
whether they have to be philips products or not. I tried the
instructions but couldn't get it to work with any of my equipment.

There was nothing in the owners manual except a sentence saying it
would work with most philips products.

http://www.p4c.philips.com/cgi-bin/d...F7320A/37&dct=
FAQ&slg=AEN&scy=US

The owners manual on the cdrom also has more information than the
printed owners manual for some odd reason.

"Wayne" wrote in message
. 102...
"Francis K" wrote in
:

Sorry for the long post.

I recently purchased a Philips 37" HDTV TV model 37PF7320A. I
purchased it after researching its specifications on the internet
and then going to look at in the store. After bringing it home I
took a look at the included cdrom. On the cdrom are pages listing
the specifications. I was unpleasantly suprised to find the
specifications listed on Philips website and the specifications
listed on the cdrom were quite a bit different.

On the web the response time is shown to be 8ms, on the cdrom 16ms.
Contrast on the web 800:1, on the cdrom 500:1. Brightness on the web
550cd/m, on the cdrom 1000cd/m. There were also minor differences in
the supported display resolutions and a couple of other minor
things.

I wanted to find out what the correct numbers were so I called
Philips. After I exhausted the nice Indian gentleman's prepared
responses I was tranferred to someone in America. I explained the
situation and asked him which specifications were correct and why
there was a discrepancy. He assured me the specifications posted on
the interent were the correct specifications but could not tell me
why there was a difference between the two. He seemed to be guessing
about his answers.

I called back again (2) other times and also chatted with one of
their representatives online. (2) were positive the internet was
correct and (2) were positive the cd was correct.

I then emailed Philips with the same questions and received the
reply copied at the bottom of the post.

So basically I guess if you buy something from Philips you don't
know exactly what you are getting until you open the box.

Am I wrong to be very annoyed about this?

By the way tv has a very nice picture except for the black levels.
The fonts on the remote are ridiculously small and the program menu
is not at all intuitive. Owners manual is also very lame.

Francis

Dear Philips Customer,

Thank you for your email to Philips Customer Care.


We have received your request regarding the reason behind the
different information provided in the specification sheets and the
CD for model 37PF7320A/37. We apologize for the confusion but as
response to this request, the CD contains accurate information since
the specification sheets merely provide an overview about the
features of the TV.


For further information or if you wish to speak to a Customer
Service Representative, you may call us at 1-888-PHILIPS 7AM-11Pm
EST Mondays-Saturdays, and 8AM-11PM on Sundays. You will be
listening to an Interactive Voice Response Unit so please follow the
voice prompts accordingly and choose the best category that suits
your product. Kindly provide your reference number, ######, to the
Customer Service Representative who will be assisting you.



What I didn't like about that TV is the remote allows you to switch
between the TV, VCR, DVD & cable but you can't program it. I called
Philips and they said it is only programed for Philips products. It's
useless for my needs! I couldn't find a signal strength indicator
either but I think it has a great picture and is stylish.

Thanks for the reply. It was manufactured in the 44th week of this year
according to the serial number.

I received a second email from philips. This time it states the online
specifications are correct. Basically I just don't think anyone in their
support department really knows. And maybe it is really not that important
but it's not like it is a $100.00 dvd player. A couple thousand dollars is
not small change to me.


"Roger" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
"Francis K" wrote in

So basically I guess if you buy something from Philips you don't know
exactly what you are getting until you open the box.

Am I wrong to be very annoyed about this?


I am not an engineer, but I used to work for a company that manufactured
electronics. Releasing a product from the engineering organization to the
factory organization for production did not mean it was a stable product.
Instead the process engineers took over, and it was their job to find
faster and cheaper means of production. Cheaper focused heavily on
quality levels because the cost of producing rejected products is always
rolled into the cost of producing good units. As quality levels rise, the
cost per good unit falls. The process engineers typically did their job
and every product would go through a series of product revision levels.

In addition, the purchasing organization would play a role and they could
change the source for components several times - engineering could have
specified Motorola in the original design and purchasing would buy Samsung
components for a few months and then later switch back to Motorola or go
to a third vendor. Swapping components could sometimes trigger other
changes in the design or manufacturing process.

An added problem is the consumer documentation is probably outsourced and
may not reflect the changes in the product engineering. Sometimes this is
really obvious because the pictures don't match the product as received.

You can hope the marketing organization and company lawyers are involved
enough to prevent a reduction in the specs below what is being advertised.

As consumers we have a right to be annoyed when the specs don't match and
the manufacturer can't give us a straightforward answer as to why the
specs don't match. But a guess is you probably have old consumer
documentation and the product you have is performing at the better specs.
That said, it is always good to check for a manufacturing date to ensure
your unit has not been sitting in a warehouse for years because units
manufactured later are usually (not always) better.

Roger