Pin number request for SKY MOVIES recorded

{{{{{Welcome}}}}} wrote:

So what is the point on having these restrictions if you can then record the
programme by way of Sky+ for the kids to be able to watch it without the PIN
request, it would seem stupid, therefore Sky have had to enable PIN request on
the playback of such material.

I previously pointed out that for Sky+ users the "broadcast" doesn't
effectively take place until playback: therefore a PIN number would be
required at that time in order to comply with the regulations.

--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/7rm2m
UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
BBC reception questions? ; http://www.astra2d.com/
Fed up with on-screen logos? : http://logofreetv.org/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-)

Thus spaketh Jomtien:
{{{{{Welcome}}}}} wrote:

So what is the point on having these restrictions if you can then
record the programme by way of Sky+ for the kids to be able to watch
it without the PIN request, it would seem stupid, therefore Sky have
had to enable PIN request on the playback of such material.

I previously pointed out that for Sky+ users the "broadcast" doesn't
effectively take place until playback: therefore a PIN number would be
required at that time in order to comply with the regulations.

That you may, unfortunately I don't see this post.

Mike Henry wrote:

So what is the point on having these restrictions if you can then record the
programme by way of Sky+ for the kids to be able to watch it without the PIN
request, it would seem stupid,

But that also applies to every other PVR, DVD recorder and VHS machine.
Ofcom don't regulate the software for these devices.

The Sky+ is different from a DVD recorder, Tivo or VCR in that the
transmission remains encrypted and totally unwatchable until the time
of playback. The Sky+ actually delays the broadcast. The other devices
merely record the broadcast at transmission time from whatever source
and play it back again later.

I can understand how any Ofcom live broadcast rules could be
considered to be applicable to the Sky+ and not to those other
devices.

Given the likely progression of MPEG4 push services over DSL, DSAT and
DTT in the next few years this is something that Ofcom needs to sort
out quickly. They probably will by 2050, if they can tear themselves
away from lunch.

--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/7rm2m
UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
BBC reception questions? ; http://www.astra2d.com/
Fed up with on-screen logos? : http://logofreetv.org/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-)

Jomtien wrote on Mon, 26 Sep 2005 07:43:46 +0200:
Mike Henry wrote:

So what is the point on having these restrictions if you can then record the
programme by way of Sky+ for the kids to be able to watch it without the PIN
request, it would seem stupid,

But that also applies to every other PVR, DVD recorder and VHS machine.
Ofcom don't regulate the software for these devices.

The Sky+ is different from a DVD recorder, Tivo or VCR in that the
transmission remains encrypted and totally unwatchable until the time
of playback. The Sky+ actually delays the broadcast. The other devices
merely record the broadcast at transmission time from whatever source
and play it back again later.

The broadcast happened when the program was transmitted from a
satellite. The Sky+ merely records the broadcast (as transmitted)
from the satellite, then decrypts and plays it back later.

I don't see why not decrypting it for a few hours counts as
broadcasting -- only one person is watching it, so its "unicasting"
or something.


--
David Taylor

On Sun, 25 Sep 2005 05:54:17 GMT, "{{{{{Welcome}}}}}"
wrote:

Thus spaketh Mike Henry:
In , "Beck"
wrote:


"dbf" wrote in message
...
OK that explains a lot....as I tried to watch again later at night
and it worked! This is really stupid.....if people have kids, they
can activate the pin feature, but why apply it to everyone??

I agree. Its a useful feature but it should be optional. Unless
there is now some new law they are adhering to which we don't know
about?

Nope. A few people said they'd heard it was an Ofcom requirement,
which probably originated from Sky's call centre idiots. Reading the
regulations it wasn't true though: Ofcom's regulations only cover
broadcasting. Ofcom does not regulate the software features of PVRs,
DVD recorders and VHS machines. (If there was a new law everyone I can
imagine people didn't have a Sky+ having to surrender it to their
nearest Police station in some kind of "bad software" amnesty - Rupert
Murdoch would love that to happen, but we're still some way off from
that!)

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/tv/ifi/codes...ngu18/#content

1.22 Premium subscription film services may broadcast up to BBFC 15-rated
films or their equivalent, at any time of day provided:
there is a protection system (a mandatory PIN or other equivalent protection)
pre 2000 and post 0530, that seeks satisfactorily to restrict access solely to
those authorised to view when material other than BBFC U-rated or PG-rated or
their equivalents is shown; and
those security systems which are in place to protect children are clearly
explained to all subscribers.

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/media/news/2...050525#content


Protecting the Under 18s

This new section lays greater emphasis on rules to safeguard the under 18s,
and in particular children (defined in the Code as the under 15s) who are too
young to exercise fully informed choices for themselves.

Children must be protected by appropriate scheduling - with the use of, for
instance, the watershed - from material that is unsuitable for them.
Children can also be protected by other means, including, for example, PIN
mechanisms. For premium subscription film services, Ofcom believes such
measures provide sufficient security to allow the rules for these services to
be changed. Therefore, provided there is a protection system such as a
mandatory PIN - and that these systems are clearly explained to all
subscribers - premium subscription film services will now be able to broadcast
films which are rated up to a BBFC (British Board of Film Classification) 15
certificate, 24 hours a day. Ofcom believes this will extend viewer choice
whilst ensuring children are properly protected.

However, in the case of adult material with a BBFC R18 certificate (commonly
known as hard-core pornography), Ofcom believes that it is appropriate to take
a more precautionary approach. Research commissioned by Ofcom indicates that
some children in the current environment are able to access and use their
parents'/carers' PIN numbers without these adults' knowledge. Given the
strength of the material - and adopting the precautionary approach - Ofcom is
not satisfied that under 18s can be effectively protected. Therefore, under
the new Code, R18-rated material is not permitted to be broadcast. However, if
future developments enable more secure protection, Ofcom would consider
whether to review this position.


So what is the point on having these restrictions if you can then record the
programme by way of Sky+ for the kids to be able to watch it without the PIN
request, it would seem stupid, therefore Sky have had to enable PIN request on
the playback of such material.


Typical of the authorites, I interpret that as a PIN has to be
mandatory in the system, however, it doesnt mean that it has to be
active, i.e the user can choose whether to use it or not

On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 21:31:43 +0100, spam wrote:

Typical of the authorites, I interpret that as a PIN has to be
mandatory in the system, however, it doesnt mean that it has to be
active, i.e the user can choose whether to use it or not

"A mandatory PIN requires a viewer to input a PIN before accessing the
material, irrespective of whether the viewer has set up any domestic
security mechanisms, i.e. it is set by the broadcaster/platform
provider."

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/tv/ifi/guida.../guidance1.pdf

On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 21:37:02 GMT, (Zero
Tolerance) wrote:

On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 21:31:43 +0100, spam wrote:

Typical of the authorites, I interpret that as a PIN has to be
mandatory in the system, however, it doesnt mean that it has to be
active, i.e the user can choose whether to use it or not

"A mandatory PIN requires a viewer to input a PIN before accessing the
material, irrespective of whether the viewer has set up any domestic
security mechanisms, i.e. it is set by the broadcaster/platform
provider."

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/tv/ifi/guida.../guidance1.pdf


But you can read that in the same way as "a pin is mandatory only for
implementation" it doesn't necessarily have to be used by the
customer...

On Sat, 08 Oct 2005 01:07:24 +0100, spam wrote:

"A mandatory PIN requires a viewer to input a PIN before accessing the
material, irrespective of whether the viewer has set up any domestic
security mechanisms, i.e. it is set by the broadcaster/platform
provider."

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/tv/ifi/guida.../guidance1.pdf

But you can read that in the same way as "a pin is mandatory only for
implementation" it doesn't necessarily have to be used by the
customer...

What part of "A mandatory PIN REQUIRES a viewer to input a PIN ...
IRRESPECTIVE of whether the viewer has set up any domestic security
measures" is unclear? A mandatory pin means all viewers must enter a
PIN. That's what mandatory means.