Anyone heard of these guys? skycards

Is http:// sky card dot net / coshure?

They posted on my forum below but the address their DNS entry quotes
does not reconcile. I am rather suspicious that they don't quote all the
usual details a legitimate business should quote.

My understanding is that once money leaves UK jurisdiction, you have no
consumer rights.

This is not to imply any wrong doing on their part, just my suspicions?




http://forum.logofreetv.org/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=985





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Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

NO LOGO wrote:

Is http:// sky card dot net / coshure?

They posted on my forum below but the address their DNS entry quotes
does not reconcile. I am rather suspicious that they don't quote all the
usual details a legitimate business should quote.

Anyone selling Sky cards is probably committing an offence. Sky cards
are the property of Sky. It says so on the back. Anyone supplying Sky
cards abroad is certainly breaking the terms of their dealer agreement
with Sky.
Anyone charging as much as these people do is probably a crook.


My understanding is that once money leaves UK jurisdiction, you have no
consumer rights.

No, you do have consumer rights across the EU. Enforcing them is
another matter. Paying by UK credit card (not a debit card or non-UK
credit card) is a fair safeguard.

--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/yvnsy
How to get UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
Fed up with logos / red buttons? : http://logofreetv.org/
BBC gone? : http://www.astra2d.co.uk/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-)

On Sun, 09 May 2004 05:53:14 GMT, Jomtien wrote:

NO LOGO wrote:

Is http:// sky card dot net / coshure?

They posted on my forum below but the address their DNS entry quotes
does not reconcile. I am rather suspicious that they don't quote all the
usual details a legitimate business should quote.

Anyone selling Sky cards is probably committing an offence. Sky cards
are the property of Sky. It says so on the back.

I know that we have had this argument before but just to air it afresh for any
newcomers just because it says property of Sky on the back does not mean that
this is true. Many cards were given out completely free under the BBC Solus
scheme. The Free2view 23.50 cards also had no contract attached that said the
cards actually belong to Sky. When you sign up for a Sky sub you do indeed agree
that the card belongs to Sky. All the conditional access cards available for the
Digibox are identical they all say on the back that they are the property of
Sky. Those where you sign a contract are, those where you do not are not.

Jomtien's argument would also imply that anyone purchasing a Sky card is guilty
of receiving stolen goods & the seller of the card commits theft. To my
knowledge there has never been a prosecution of either party & don't forget that
these are criminal offences not some civil offence that must be instigated by
Sky.

--
Nigel Barker
Live from the sunny Cote d'Azur

Nigel Barker wrote:

Anyone selling Sky cards is probably committing an offence. Sky cards
are the property of Sky. It says so on the back.

I know that we have had this argument before but just to air it afresh for any
newcomers just because it says property of Sky on the back does not mean that
this is true. Many cards were given out completely free under the BBC Solus
scheme. The Free2view 23.50 cards also had no contract attached that said the
cards actually belong to Sky. When you sign up for a Sky sub you do indeed agree
that the card belongs to Sky.

Indeed. And the company in question does seem to be mostly selling Sky
sub cards.


All the conditional access cards available for the
Digibox are identical they all say on the back that they are the property of
Sky. Those where you sign a contract are, those where you do not are not.

Actually the phone numbers do vary on the different types of card so
they aren't really identical.


Jomtien's argument would also imply that anyone purchasing a Sky card is guilty
of receiving stolen goods & the seller of the card commits theft. To my
knowledge there has never been a prosecution of either party & don't forget that
these are criminal offences not some civil offence that must be instigated by
Sky.

Just because there have been no prosecutions doesn't mean that this is
either legal or contractually valid. This company would appear to be
falsifying viewing contracts on behalf of the end user, whose credit
card details are on the Sky payment authorisation. Others have done
the same and have been nobbled by Sky, to the detriment of users who
have paid a service fee up-front. It would do nothing to help others
to have the same misfortune, nor would I have anything good to say
about someone who charges £150 or £190 to falsify a form.

--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/yvnsy
How to get UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
Fed up with logos / red buttons? : http://logofreetv.org/
BBC gone? : http://www.astra2d.co.uk/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-)

On Mon, 10 May 2004 05:05:03 GMT, Jomtien wrote:

Actually the phone numbers do vary on the different types of card so
they aren't really identical.

Sorry, you are absolutely correct. I just checked my cards. I suppose that is
more of a support issue though making sure that e.g. FTV viewers ring an FTV
person with access to the FTV card holders list. Don't forget under the Data
Protection Act that details of these various subscriber or rather
non-subscribers should not be shared.

Jomtien's argument would also imply that anyone purchasing a Sky card is guilty
of receiving stolen goods & the seller of the card commits theft. To my
knowledge there has never been a prosecution of either party & don't forget that
these are criminal offences not some civil offence that must be instigated by
Sky.

Just because there have been no prosecutions doesn't mean that this is
either legal or contractually valid. This company would appear to be
falsifying viewing contracts on behalf of the end user, whose credit
card details are on the Sky payment authorisation. Others have done
the same and have been nobbled by Sky, to the detriment of users who
have paid a service fee up-front. It would do nothing to help others
to have the same misfortune, nor would I have anything good to say
about someone who charges £150 or £190 to falsify a form.

You are using the politician's method of answering the argument that you wanted
to answer & not the one that was actually proposed to you (BTW you are very good
at this & use the technique often:-)

You are referring to a particular company who appear to be guilty of fraud &
others who appear guilty of theft. This has nothing whatsoever to do with my
explanations that the sale of Solus or Free2view cards is an entirely different
matter. These cards are the property of the person who was given or bought them
& may be disposed of as they think fit. No civil or criminal offence is
committed.

--
Nigel Barker
Live from the sunny Cote d'Azur

Nigel Barker wrote:

You are using the politician's method of answering the argument that you wanted
to answer & not the one that was actually proposed to you (BTW you are very good
at this & use the technique often:-)

Watch out, Bruxelles!

( Hmm. Agent spell checker baulks at "Bruxelles" and proposes
"Cruellest". Does it know something we don't?)


You are referring to a particular company who appear to be guilty of fraud &
others who appear guilty of theft. This has nothing whatsoever to do with my
explanations that the sale of Solus or Free2view cards is an entirely different
matter.

Maybe not but it is the topic of the thread. Maybe politicians are all
closet usenet posters?


These cards are the property of the person who was given or bought them
& may be disposed of as they think fit. No civil or criminal offence is
committed.

I wonder. The original BBC cards were supplied without charge and at
no time did anyone say that ownership was transferred nor was there
any guarantee of functionality. Therefore it seems reasonable to
assume that they were merely on loan and that ownership stayed with
the issuer/software rights holder: NDS. Which is just what it says on
the back. The cards do contain patented software after all. Your bank
cards would probably fall into the same group.

The more recent pay FTV cards are slightly different in that they come
with a guarantee of service until end 2005 or beyond. It still doesn't
say anywhere that ownership is transferred and the payment could
clearly apply just to the ability to view (the only thing that is
guaranteed) rather than to actual purchase of the card. The same of
course applies to pay Sky cards: you are subscribing for the ability
to view, not for the card.

--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/yvnsy
How to get UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
Fed up with logos / red buttons? : http://logofreetv.org/
BBC gone? : http://www.astra2d.co.uk/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-)