Minimum specs for a decent subwoofer ?

wrote in message
m...

Many thanks for these tips.
Material being played should be rented DVDs and maybe mpeg-4 videos
with either AC-3 or mp3 audio.
The room I'd say is about 4 meters long by 6 meters wide and 2.5
meters high.

A 20-39 PCi would be plenty in that sized room. I use a 20-39 PC Plus in a
4m x 4m room :-) overkill I know, but I wasn't sure just how much headroom
the Plus has over my Rel Storm. I'd say quite a bit now ;-)

http://www.svsubwoofers.com/subs_pci_20-39.htm

Looking at £480 all-in price, and with the good exchance rate (1.7) it's a
good time to buy.

SVS have great customer service. Contact Tom V at SVS. He will not oversell
you, or tell you BS, in fact if you mention some other subs he sometimes
will recommend them over his own products (ie a Canadian can get a Servo 15
at a much better price compared to it's SVS competitor, the PCi)

I understand this is a very small room size for a HT
system and thus there shouldn't be a requirement for lots of power.
Could a 12-inch sub do a decent job regardless of how many Watts RMS
it is rated at ?

A good quality subwoofer should do fine, a decent 10 or 12". Again watts RMS
is another issue. A ported efficient large box subwoofer would require much
less power with no EQ, comapared to a small sealed box with a high amount of
EQ to correct the driver/cab issues. If you've got the money though, and
want lots of headroom (or like it loud) then buy the best subwoofer you can
afford, it's definetly worth spending £100-£200 more from a budget model to
one-up.

For example there's a huge multiple IB subwoofer with something like 32 x
18" drivers, a 18W tube amp is being used to drive it.

Compare a SVS PCi (300W) versus a Sunfire Junior (1.5KW) The Sunfire has a
much bigger amp. But in reality the SVS goes much louder, plays cleaner,
plays lower, with much lower distortion. The SVS is also cheaper too.

How many Watts minimum in a real world?

Can't answer that.

The site you provided suggests that the response of the lower end can
be compromised if it isn't as loud as the upper bass range (around
63hz). What would be an acceptable difference between the two ends ?
How can one minimize the effects of the above discrepancy, is there
any variable control that allows for some trimming-off of undesired
level emphasis ?

If you want a subwoofer to be flat(er), then consider a Behringer Feedback
Destroyer Pro. It's also a 12 band stereo parametric EQ. Read up here..you
might not need a BFD but it's worth considering later on. About £100.

http://www.snapbug.ws/bfd.htm

As I said, options aren't many. As far as models being sold nearby I
have seen these:
Acoustic Research AR PR1212
JBL E250P
Velodyne CHT-12

I would consider that SVS above that list. From other users the PCi is
superior to that of the CHT-12. Haven't really heard much about the JBL or
AR.

I take it you're looking around £350 for a subwoofer? What's the rest of the
system?


Are you familiar with any of these ? Could any do the job ?
Thanks, again,

Do the job, yes. So could a mid-range Yamaha subwoofer or Rel Quake. But do
you want something to "do the job" or do you want a great sounding
subwoofer?

"Nath" wrote:

What's a small room? Dimensions. How loud do you listen to the system? Is
your current subwoofer calibrated hot, or would you set your new subwoofer
hot? (by that I mean the subwoofer is set louder than the others via the
test tones generated by the amp, and measured with a SPL meter. Usually
you'll set it slightly lower due to RS meter being off. Some bass heads set
it +6dB or even higher) If so you'll need a better subwoofer

Thanks again. As much as I appreciate these excellent pieces of
advice, I realize that where I live I'm trapped with very few options.
I would seriously look at SVS, but unfortunately it doesn't seem to be
a choice. It seems the best I could get is a Velodyne CHT-12, for a
very high price (imports tax plus trasportation of these heavy units
make them way more expensive than your country, you'd be shocked). For
about 60% of the CHT-12's price I could get a JBL e250p, and for 50%,
I could buy an Acoustic research AR-PR1212 or a JBL e150p. So it
would be a matter of just how better one is compared to the others
even though maybe none of them would be the very best choice. For
example, both JBL models use a 12-inch driver, the difference
apparently being that one has a 250-watt amplifier while the other has
a 150-watt amp, maybe there's some extra control in the e250p. Coming
from a musical background I know for sure that even a cheaper and
smaller model can do the job because of the frequency range used in
music not being the same as in movies. So how do these few options
compare in movies, that's the question, which seems very difficult to
answer. I guess I'll be in the dark shooting and tell my brother to
get used to whichever I can pick for him, maybe he won't be able to
tell a difference that maybe I could tell.
all the best

"Nath" wrote:

What's a small room? Dimensions. How loud do you listen to the system? Is
your current subwoofer calibrated hot, or would you set your new subwoofer
hot? (by that I mean the subwoofer is set louder than the others via the
test tones generated by the amp, and measured with a SPL meter. Usually
you'll set it slightly lower due to RS meter being off. Some bass heads set
it +6dB or even higher) If so you'll need a better subwoofer

Thanks again. As much as I appreciate these excellent pieces of
advice, I realize that where I live I'm trapped with very few options.
I would seriously look at SVS, but unfortunately it doesn't seem to be
a choice. It seems the best I could get is a Velodyne CHT-12, for a
very high price (imports tax plus trasportation of these heavy units
make them way more expensive than your country, you'd be shocked). For
about 60% of the CHT-12's price I could get a JBL e250p, and for 50%,
I could buy an Acoustic research AR-PR1212 or a JBL e150p. So it
would be a matter of just how better one is compared to the others
even though maybe none of them would be the very best choice. For
example, both JBL models use a 12-inch driver, the difference
apparently being that one has a 250-watt amplifier while the other has
a 150-watt amp, maybe there's some extra control in the e250p. Coming
from a musical background I know for sure that even a cheaper and
smaller model can do the job because of the frequency range used in
music not being the same as in movies. So how do these few options
compare in movies, that's the question, which seems very difficult to
answer. I guess I'll be in the dark shooting and tell my brother to
get used to whichever I can pick for him, maybe he won't be able to
tell a difference that maybe I could tell.
all the best

"Italo" wrote :
I have just bought the JBL 150P (Northridge series) subwoofer and it's a
stunning sub and great value for money. Plenty of slam and punch without
even a hint of distortion (105W RMS inbuilt amplifier, 225W peak), great for
music and movies and no 'humming' (digital inbuilt amplifier), I highly
recommend it.

Hi. Could you please share why you chose the 150p and not the 250p ?
How often have you been watching movies, do you feel you have already
gotten used to your system to be able to understand what the
limitations are ? Which other speakers do you use to match the 150p,
did you have to do much tuning adjustments ? Thanks for helping.

"Italo" wrote :
I have just bought the JBL 150P (Northridge series) subwoofer and it's a
stunning sub and great value for money. Plenty of slam and punch without
even a hint of distortion (105W RMS inbuilt amplifier, 225W peak), great for
music and movies and no 'humming' (digital inbuilt amplifier), I highly
recommend it.

Hi. Could you please share why you chose the 150p and not the 250p ?
How often have you been watching movies, do you feel you have already
gotten used to your system to be able to understand what the
limitations are ? Which other speakers do you use to match the 150p,
did you have to do much tuning adjustments ? Thanks for helping.

wrote in message
m...

Hi. Could you please share why you chose the 150p and not the 250p ?

The 150p fits neatly into the corner of my loungeroom (right next to the
wall unit) whereas the 250p would have been just too big. Unless you have a
hangar for a loungeroom (mine is 5m long, 3.6m wide and 2.7m high) the 150p
will do just fine. The price also fitted my budget perfectly.

Having said that (having now tested the 150P) I'd buy the 250P in an instant
if I had the right space for it. JBL finally has got it right with this
series of subs.

How often have you been watching movies, do you feel you have already
gotten used to your system to be able to understand what the
limitations are ?

No limitations so far. I replaced a Klipsch Sub which was very good for both
music and movies and was looking for a worthy replacement (at a reasonable
price). I did try the newer Klipsch subs but preferred the sound, specs (and
looks) of the JBL. Music/Movie listening, in both DVD-A, stereo or
multichannel is outstanding, clean clear bass with no distortion at any
listening level.

Which other speakers do you use to match the 150p,
did you have to do much tuning adjustments ? Thanks for helping.

I use a set of Klipsch Quintets surrounds and the JBL complements them
wonderfully since it has a higher cutoff than the previous sub and far more
power. It's extremely punchy without a hint of distortion, chuffing or noise
from the internal amp, it's just a great buy.

--
Italo

wrote in message
m...

Hi. Could you please share why you chose the 150p and not the 250p ?

The 150p fits neatly into the corner of my loungeroom (right next to the
wall unit) whereas the 250p would have been just too big. Unless you have a
hangar for a loungeroom (mine is 5m long, 3.6m wide and 2.7m high) the 150p
will do just fine. The price also fitted my budget perfectly.

Having said that (having now tested the 150P) I'd buy the 250P in an instant
if I had the right space for it. JBL finally has got it right with this
series of subs.

How often have you been watching movies, do you feel you have already
gotten used to your system to be able to understand what the
limitations are ?

No limitations so far. I replaced a Klipsch Sub which was very good for both
music and movies and was looking for a worthy replacement (at a reasonable
price). I did try the newer Klipsch subs but preferred the sound, specs (and
looks) of the JBL. Music/Movie listening, in both DVD-A, stereo or
multichannel is outstanding, clean clear bass with no distortion at any
listening level.

Which other speakers do you use to match the 150p,
did you have to do much tuning adjustments ? Thanks for helping.

I use a set of Klipsch Quintets surrounds and the JBL complements them
wonderfully since it has a higher cutoff than the previous sub and far more
power. It's extremely punchy without a hint of distortion, chuffing or noise
from the internal amp, it's just a great buy.

--
Italo

"Italo" wrote:

The 150p fits neatly into the corner of my loungeroom (right next to the
wall unit) whereas the 250p would have been just too big.

That's certainly a crucial aspect (wanting Vs having the space for),
and your remarks about the 150p encourage me to suggest it as an
alternative solution should my brother
have spacing concerns.

Having said that (having now tested the 150P) I'd buy the 250P in an instant
if I had the right space for it. JBL finally has got it right with this
series of subs.

I see. In which way do you feel the 250p would make a difference,
since the power rating isn't considered a major spec and they have the
same driver size? Is there any tuning control on the 250p that is
lacking on the 150p, or is it basicaly a subjective impression that
the overall low end would sound more natural in the 50p?
Thanks for shariung your very useful experience.
all the best

"Italo" wrote:

The 150p fits neatly into the corner of my loungeroom (right next to the
wall unit) whereas the 250p would have been just too big.

That's certainly a crucial aspect (wanting Vs having the space for),
and your remarks about the 150p encourage me to suggest it as an
alternative solution should my brother
have spacing concerns.

Having said that (having now tested the 150P) I'd buy the 250P in an instant
if I had the right space for it. JBL finally has got it right with this
series of subs.

I see. In which way do you feel the 250p would make a difference,
since the power rating isn't considered a major spec and they have the
same driver size? Is there any tuning control on the 250p that is
lacking on the 150p, or is it basicaly a subjective impression that
the overall low end would sound more natural in the 50p?
Thanks for shariung your very useful experience.
all the best

wrote in message
m...
"Italo" wrote:

I see. In which way do you feel the 250p would make a difference,
since the power rating isn't considered a major spec and they have the
same driver size?

That's incorrect, the 250P has a 12" driver and the 150P has a 10" driver,
also the amplifier of the 250P is rated at 250W RMS Vs the 150P rated at
150W RMS, the frequency range is also (barely) lower.

Is there any tuning control on the 250p that is
lacking on the 150p, or is it basicaly a subjective impression that
the overall low end would sound more natural in the 50p?
Thanks for shariung your very useful experience.
all the best

For a standard loungeroom the 150P is more than sufficient, though if I had
a dedicated HT room the 250P would also have been a good buy. Either way
it's a great sub.

--
Italo