Jeff Rife wrote:
Mark Crispin ) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:

Even if it were true, $110 represents about 3.6% of the cost of a $3000
plasma TV.

In high-end electronics, $110 is less than the price differential between
the earlier more expensive "A" model, and the 6-month later less-expensive
and more featureful "B" model.


It's also less than 10% (as you point out), which means *any* store will
happily knock that price difference off to make a sale.

Happily knock off that price for either a model with or without a tuner.
If they knock it off the one with the tuner and not the one without both
they and then the manufacturer has incentive to not include a tuner to
begin with.

If they have to include a tuner they want to make it for all units as
the article mentions. My argument is that the focus will then be on
monitors since monitors will still be less expensive since they have NO
tuners at all.

Of course once the 5th gen receiver tech is available this will change
as consumers are re-introduced to OTA broadcasting and OTA will become
the PRIME and first choice of consumers. This will not happen because of
current broadcasters. It initially will be driven by new broadcasters
like USDTV. They and manufacturers like Hisense have the incentive,
broadcasters do not as of yet.

Broadcasters will be supplied with incentive as they FOLLOW the lead of
such as USDTV. Emmis is an example. They followed the lead of USDTV
almost immediately. There will be others.

Bob Miller

On Sun, 14 Nov 2004, Brad Griffis wrote:
I'm not saying it's wrong to incorporate a tuner into a tv. If consumer
demand dictates it then the companies will create it. I'm saying it's wrong
for the government to mandate that it be incorporated.

By your logic, it was wrong for the government to mandate a standard
electric voltage. If you're stupid enough to buy a 50V appliance when
your neighborhood is served with 127V, that's your fault. If consumer
demand dictates it there will be a standard.

The cellular telephone network in North America is widely critized for
having (at least) four incompatible digital standards.

As far as consumer demand goes, most consumers have been waiting until
there are affordable (3-digit prices) HDTVs with built-in ATSC tuners.
This is especially the case in today's market where 4:3 analog color TVs
sell for as little as $40.

I know a consumer who is waiting to buy an HDTV until she can get a CRT
(plasma and LCD is out of her price range) model with a built-in ATSC
tuner and about the same physical size and weight as a 19" 4:3 TV (which
is her current TV). The location where that TV is installed will not
accomodate a larger or heavier set. The smallest CRT HDTV with built-in
ATSC tuner is still a bit above her price range and too large and heavy
for where it would be placed.

The only thing wrong with the mandate is that it is taking too long. The
sooner it is mandatory for all TVs, the better.

-- Mark --

http://staff.washington.edu/mrc
Science does not emerge from voting, party politics, or public debate.
Si vis pacem, para bellum.

Broadcasters will be supplied with incentive as they FOLLOW the lead of
such as USDTV. Emmis is an example. They followed the lead of USDTV

BOB, virtually every prediction you have EVER made has been proven to be false.
This will be no exception.

The purpose of the mandate is twofold:
1) the broaden the variety of TVs with built-in ATSC tuners
2) to provide a guarantee to the market that is no longer subject to the
winds of change.

It is that second purpose that scares Bob Miller.

Mark, that is it in a nutshell. This is why BOB is on another of his frenetic
attempts at disinformation. He is once again in full panic mode. His
predictions never come true and he now realizes how entrenched 8VSB has become.
He knows the mandate simply makes it worse for him and his COFDM buddies. Our
Maste Snake Oil Salesman is pulling out all the stops in an attempt to thwart
the inevitable.

On 2004-11-14 17:45:35 -0800, (Vidguy7) said:

Broadcasters will be supplied with incentive as they FOLLOW the lead of
such as USDTV. Emmis is an example. They followed the lead of USDTV

BOB, virtually every prediction you have EVER made has been proven to be false.
This will be no exception.

Won't you be surprised when the FCC, all broadcasters, and all
consumers suddenly see the light and decide to drop 8VSB and go to
COFDM.

The prophet shall be vindicated.

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004, Phil wrote:
Won't you be surprised when the FCC, all broadcasters, and all consumers
suddenly see the light and decide to drop 8VSB and go to COFDM.

The prophet shall be vindicated.

I have $1000 that says that it will not happen.

-- Mark --

http://staff.washington.edu/mrc
Science does not emerge from voting, party politics, or public debate.
Si vis pacem, para bellum.

Phil ) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
Won't you be surprised when the FCC, all broadcasters, and all
consumers suddenly see the light and decide to drop 8VSB and go to
COFDM.

Somebody forgot the smiley on this post to show that it's sarcasm.

Of course, it could just be another Bob sockpuppet.

--
Jeff Rife |
SPAM bait: | http://www.nabs.net/Cartoons/Sherman...enLemmings.gif
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Mark Crispin wrote in message .washington.edu...
On Sun, 14 Nov 2004, Brad Griffis wrote:
I'm not saying it's wrong to incorporate a tuner into a tv. If consumer
demand dictates it then the companies will create it. I'm saying it's wrong
for the government to mandate that it be incorporated.

By your logic, it was wrong for the government to mandate a standard
electric voltage. If you're stupid enough to buy a 50V appliance when
your neighborhood is served with 127V, that's your fault. If consumer
demand dictates it there will be a standard.

The cellular telephone network in North America is widely critized for
having (at least) four incompatible digital standards.

As far as consumer demand goes, most consumers have been waiting until
there are affordable (3-digit prices) HDTVs with built-in ATSC tuners.
This is especially the case in today's market where 4:3 analog color TVs
sell for as little as $40.

I know a consumer who is waiting to buy an HDTV until she can get a CRT
(plasma and LCD is out of her price range) model with a built-in ATSC
tuner and about the same physical size and weight as a 19" 4:3 TV (which
is her current TV). The location where that TV is installed will not
accomodate a larger or heavier set. The smallest CRT HDTV with built-in
ATSC tuner is still a bit above her price range and too large and heavy
for where it would be placed.

The only thing wrong with the mandate is that it is taking too long. The
sooner it is mandatory for all TVs, the better.

-- Mark --

http://staff.washington.edu/mrc
Science does not emerge from voting, party politics, or public debate.
Si vis pacem, para bellum.


I don't see how you can compare setting a voltage std with mandating
consumers pay for and buy something that most will never use. There
is no comparison at all. The voltage std analogy would be setting the
NTSC std, not forcing one to buy a tuner.

And isn't it quite odd that the govt sees this as perfectly
legitimate, forcing hardware on consumers without choice. Yet, at
the same time, when Microsoft chooses to add some features to it's
software and give it to consumers for free, the govt sues them
claiming anti-competitive practices.

Bob Miller wrote in message link.net...

...as consumers are re-introduced to OTA broadcasting and OTA will
become the PRIME and first choice of consumers.

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA haha....

Chet Hayes ) wrote in alt.tv.tech.hdtv:
I don't see how you can compare setting a voltage std with mandating
consumers pay for and buy something that most will never use. There
is no comparison at all. The voltage std analogy would be setting the
NTSC std, not forcing one to buy a tuner.

Then you should be up in arms about cable-ready analog tuners in larger TVs.
Various surveys show that those tuners are *never* used because the sets
use satellite, digital cable, or external HD tuners as their only "TV".

This has been true for several years, yet nobody seems to mind the fact
that all those sets have "useless" tuners they are paying for.

--
Jeff Rife |
SPAM bait: | http://www.nabs.net/Cartoons/RhymesW...atsAndDogs.jpg
|
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