BBC4 HD
 

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...
In article , Bob Latham
[email protected]
of-spam.invalid scribeth thus
In article ,
Mark Carver wrote:
On 26/11/2013 16:57, Roderick Stewart wrote:
Just been prompted to do an "add new channels" on Winter
Hill
Freeview, and found "This is BBC4 HD" on 106, starting
soon. So we
might get to see some of Borgen in HD, and next year's
Proms should
look good.

Yes, though on DTT it's on the new Mux 7, only going to be
available
from 30 sites, not the other 1124 that carry the main HD mux.
Belmont
and CP have also launched Mux 7 today, Black Hill was
supposed to too ?

Unfortunately it's BBC 3 HD that will be on the 'universal'
HD Mux,
better if it had been BBC 4 HD instead IMHO.

According to Digital UK there is a retune event at Sutton
Coldfield on
10/12/2013 and other sources suggest that local TV doesn't
start until
30/01/2014 so I'm hoping the 10/12/13 event will be for COM7.

ERP for COM7 Sutton is confusing. Most websites say it will be
a very weak
6,400 Watts ERP which is 14.9dB down and then of course it is
out of band
for my group B aerial, looks dodgy. However, the Digital UK
site says
81,300 Watts ERP which is just -4dB and much more possible for
me I would
have thought. I'd like to get that confirmed.

I'm probably misunderstanding what I'm reading though, ERP
always has me
head scratching.



Do you mean the term "ERP" and what it means Bob?...
Bob.




Is it possible that there is some confusion here between the
radiated power for the new local TV franchise and for COM7?

Per the comment about aerial banding, I'm not quite sure what is
happening. At SC local TV is in-band at 51, but Com7 and Com 8
are both out of band in the 30's. At EM local TV will be on 56
which is out of band one way and, like SC, com7 and com8 will be
in the 30's.

Another interesting one, Bilsdale, suggests that them that knows
best haven't thought it through properly. Middlesbrugh and York
are both getting local TV and both will be broadcast on
directional aerials ('petals' as they call them) from Bilsdale.
The problem is that most viewers in York watch Yorkshire from
Emley and not Tyne Tees from Bilsdale, which means that if they
want to watch local TV they will have to erect a new additional
aerial. Oh yes, I think NOT.

However York used to have local analogue TV which was radiated
from aerials on top of a water tower on the SW edge of the city
area at Askam Bryan (for those looking, in the NW corner of the
A64/A1237 junction) and on one of the few points of raised land
in the Vale of York. Those aerials are not only still there, but
for most viewers in York they would be within the beamwidth of a
yagi pointed at Emley. You couldn't make it up could you?


--
Woody

harrogate three at ntlworld dot com

BBC4 HD
 

Is it possible that there is some confusion here between the
radiated power for the new local TV franchise and for COM7?

Per the comment about aerial banding, I'm not quite sure what is
happening. At SC local TV is in-band at 51, but Com7 and Com 8
are both out of band in the 30's. At EM local TV will be on 56
which is out of band one way and, like SC, com7 and com8 will be
in the 30's.

Another interesting one, Bilsdale, suggests that them that knows
best haven't thought it through properly. Middlesbrugh and York
are both getting local TV and both will be broadcast on
directional aerials ('petals' as they call them) from Bilsdale.
The problem is that most viewers in York watch Yorkshire from
Emley and not Tyne Tees from Bilsdale, which means that if they
want to watch local TV they will have to erect a new additional
aerial. Oh yes, I think NOT.

However York used to have local analogue TV which was radiated
from aerials on top of a water tower on the SW edge of the city
area at Askam Bryan (for those looking, in the NW corner of the
A64/A1237 junction) and on one of the few points of raised land
in the Vale of York. Those aerials are not only still there, but
for most viewers in York they would be within the beamwidth of a
yagi pointed at Emley. You couldn't make it up could you?



Seems to me the whole things a big joke and will never make any money.

Even if it did stand a chance its now years too late..

Too much viewing competition..

--
Tony Sayer

BBC4 HD
 

On 28/11/2013 09:28, Bob Latham wrote:

I'm trying to overcome my pessimistic character and be optimistic about
this. In the preDSO days the muxes on Sutton were I think 8KW ERP. There
were 5 or 6 of them and analogue and there was also muxes from satellites
like Brierley Hill without interfering with somewhere else. OK, some
frequencies can no longer be used but now the whole of the West Midlands
is to be covered by one transmitter on an 'out of group' channel. And,
they propose less power than the preDSO muxes. I presume it is a case of
where in the country is C33 used where this signal could interfere
especially to the south west of Sutton which I think is where most of its
signal is steered?

6K4W would be pretty poor IMHO and I question if it would be worth the
bother for the number of people who could and would use the service. I
don't think I could pull that in being out of band as well.

Well, Sutton C was testing on 33 and 35 yesterday afternoon, (with blank
carriers) vanished again at 4:30pm, but worth a try now, (if your
receiver can 'see' blank carriers (some can't))

Indications are the power was at a 'healthy level'

http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1914449


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

BBC4 HD
 

Woody wrote:

Another interesting one, Bilsdale, suggests that them that knows
best haven't thought it through properly. Middlesbrugh and York
are both getting local TV and both will be broadcast on
directional aerials ('petals' as they call them) from Bilsdale.
The problem is that most viewers in York watch Yorkshire from
Emley and not Tyne Tees from Bilsdale, which means that if they
want to watch local TV they will have to erect a new additional
aerial. Oh yes, I think NOT.

See
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...Local%20TV.jpg


However York used to have local analogue TV which was radiated
from aerials on top of a water tower on the SW edge of the city
area at Askam Bryan (for those looking, in the NW corner of the
A64/A1237 junction) and on one of the few points of raised land
in the Vale of York. Those aerials are not only still there, but
for most viewers in York they would be within the beamwidth of a
yagi pointed at Emley.

See
http://tx.mb21.co.uk/gallery/askham-bryan.php

You couldn't make it up could you?

No you couldn't.

Presumably the TV company will squeal until OFCOM let them braodcast
from Askham Bryan as well as Bilsdale. I wonder who owns the Askham
Bryan equipment.

Bill

BBC4 HD
 

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
Woody wrote:

Another interesting one, Bilsdale, suggests that them that knows best
haven't thought it through properly. Middlesbrugh and York are both
getting local TV and both will be broadcast on directional aerials
('petals' as they call them) from Bilsdale. The problem is that most
viewers in York watch Yorkshire from Emley and not Tyne Tees from
Bilsdale, which means that if they want to watch local TV they will have
to erect a new additional aerial. Oh yes, I think NOT.

See
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...Local%20TV.jpg

It's a great shame that the geography of North Yorkshire precludes a lot of
it from receiving Yorkshire regional TV eg from Emley Moor, and that the
best high ground for transmitting to North Yorkshire can also serve the
south Tyne Tees area so they choose to transmit Tyne Tees news from there.
If only Bilsdale could transmit more directionally, with an additional
transmitter to serve the Newcastle-centred areas further north.

Where I am (near Malton) it's frustrating that Whitwell Hill blocks the
Emley Moor signal so I can't get BBC and ITV news from Leeds.

I doubt whether the local TV beam from Bilsdale will spread far enough
eastwards to reach me.

Mind you, I wonder what the quality of the local TV programmes will be like.
When I used to live near Abingdon I could receive Six TV (local Oxford TV)
and the technical and production standards were very poor - as if made using
cheap domestic camcorders and with very uneven studio lighting. And the
local news bulletins were hilarious: one newsreader had trouble reading the
autocue and sat frozen like a tharn (*) rabbit caught in the headlights
while mumbling away. A classic case of pay-peanuts-get-monkeys!

(*) Tharn - a word that Richard Adams invented in Watership Down to describe
a rabbit that sits transfixed in the path of oncoming danger.

The only good thing from Six TV was the excellent nature / country-living
series presented by the cute Sasha Norris.


However York used to have local analogue TV which was radiated from
aerials on top of a water tower on the SW edge of the city area at Askam
Bryan (for those looking, in the NW corner of the A64/A1237 junction) and
on one of the few points of raised land in the Vale of York. Those
aerials are not only still there, but for most viewers in York they would
be within the beamwidth of a yagi pointed at Emley.

See
http://tx.mb21.co.uk/gallery/askham-bryan.php

You couldn't make it up could you?

No you couldn't.

Presumably the TV company will squeal until OFCOM let them braodcast from
Askham Bryan as well as Bilsdale. I wonder who owns the Askham Bryan
equipment.

Bill

BBC4 HD
 

"NY" wrote in message
...


"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
Woody wrote:

Another interesting one, Bilsdale, suggests that them that
knows best haven't thought it through properly. Middlesbrugh
and York are both getting local TV and both will be broadcast
on directional aerials ('petals' as they call them) from
Bilsdale. The problem is that most viewers in York watch
Yorkshire from Emley and not Tyne Tees from Bilsdale, which
means that if they want to watch local TV they will have to
erect a new additional aerial. Oh yes, I think NOT.

See
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...Local%20TV.jpg

It's a great shame that the geography of North Yorkshire
precludes a lot of it from receiving Yorkshire regional TV eg
from Emley Moor, and that the best high ground for transmitting
to North Yorkshire can also serve the south Tyne Tees area so
they choose to transmit Tyne Tees news from there. If only
Bilsdale could transmit more directionally, with an additional
transmitter to serve the Newcastle-centred areas further north.

Where I am (near Malton) it's frustrating that Whitwell Hill
blocks the Emley Moor signal so I can't get BBC and ITV news
from Leeds.

I doubt whether the local TV beam from Bilsdale will spread far
enough eastwards to reach me.

Mind you, I wonder what the quality of the local TV programmes
will be like. When I used to live near Abingdon I could receive
Six TV (local Oxford TV) and the technical and production
standards were very poor - as if made using cheap domestic
camcorders and with very uneven studio lighting. And the local
news bulletins were hilarious: one newsreader had trouble
reading the autocue and sat frozen like a tharn (*) rabbit
caught in the headlights while mumbling away. A classic case of
pay-peanuts-get-monkeys!

(*) Tharn - a word that Richard Adams invented in Watership
Down to describe a rabbit that sits transfixed in the path of
oncoming danger.

The only good thing from Six TV was the excellent nature /
country-living series presented by the cute Sasha Norris.


However York used to have local analogue TV which was
radiated from aerials on top of a water tower on the SW edge
of the city area at Askam Bryan (for those looking, in the NW
corner of the A64/A1237 junction) and on one of the few
points of raised land in the Vale of York. Those aerials are
not only still there, but for most viewers in York they would
be within the beamwidth of a yagi pointed at Emley.

See
http://tx.mb21.co.uk/gallery/askham-bryan.php

You couldn't make it up could you?

No you couldn't.

Presumably the TV company will squeal until OFCOM let them
braodcast from Askham Bryan as well as Bilsdale. I wonder who
owns the Askham Bryan equipment.

Bill



Have a look at
http://www.macfh.co.uk/Test/UKTerrestrialTVTest.html
It might give you an option. Given where you are I can understand
you not wanting to watch Lovely Peter Levey on BBC Yorks & Lincs
but have you tried maybe Sheffield or Olivers Mount at
Scarborough?

There is a simple alternative - Freesat and give it a Leeds
postcode.


--
Woody

harrogate three at ntlworld dot com

BBC4 HD
 

On 28/11/2013 12:34, Bob Latham wrote:
In article ,
Mark Carver wrote:

Well, Sutton C was testing on 33 and 35 yesterday afternoon, (with blank
carriers) vanished again at 4:30pm, but worth a try now, (if your
receiver can 'see' blank carriers (some can't))

Indications are the power was at a 'healthy level'

http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1914449


Hey Mark thanks for the info and the link, very good of you.

Can't try it at the moment i'm not home and I've got to change the aerial
down lead filter as the current one blocks 37 and below. I've had one made
for sutton by taylors and hopefully I can set it up on Saturday.

Good news if the power is healthy though.

Very it would seem. Indoor aerial in Broadway ! :-

http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showp...4&postcount=26


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

BBC4 HD
 

Woody wrote:

Where I am (near Malton) it's frustrating that Whitwell Hill
blocks the Emley Moor signal so I can't get BBC and ITV news
from Leeds.

Have a look at
http://www.macfh.co.uk/Test/UKTerrestrialTVTest.html
It might give you an option. Given where you are I can understand
you not wanting to watch Lovely Peter Levey on BBC Yorks & Lincs
but have you tried maybe Sheffield

Crosspool received near Malton? No chance at all, even if there was no CCI.

Bill

BBC4 HD
 

"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
Woody wrote:

Where I am (near Malton) it's frustrating that Whitwell Hill
blocks the Emley Moor signal so I can't get BBC and ITV news
from Leeds.

Have a look at
http://www.macfh.co.uk/Test/UKTerrestrialTVTest.html
It might give you an option. Given where you are I can
understand you not wanting to watch Lovely Peter Levey on BBC
Yorks & Lincs but have you tried maybe Sheffield

Crosspool received near Malton? No chance at all, even if there
was no CCI.

Bill


The OP said that he couldn't get EM as Whitwell Hill is in the
way. That suggests that he lives either on the SW side of Malton
or even out of Malton towards Whitwell. That land is somewhat
elevated so I would have thought there was a good possibility of
something from Crosspool.

Either that or Waltham!!


--
Woody

harrogate three at ntlworld dot com

BBC4 HD
 

Woody wrote:

The OP said that he couldn't get EM as Whitwell Hill is in the
way. That suggests that he lives either on the SW side of Malton
or even out of Malton towards Whitwell. That land is somewhat
elevated so I would have thought there was a good possibility of
something from Crosspool.

Not a prayer.

Bill