Very basic cabling/distribution advice needed please
 

Well firstly I'd test the basic signal from the provided socket with a
decent flylead and see if there are any issues on the gear which is now not
providing the full set of channels.

Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"Jim" wrote in message
m...
OK I'll be upfront I know very little about this so please bear with me as
I'm well out of my comfort zone here.

I live in a small block of 4 flats and we all get our TV signal from the
same external aerial and gets it's feed from Crystal Palace, the cable
comes in the roof and is then feed to all four flats where we have a
single UHF TV socket, something like this
http://m2.sourcingmap.com/smapimg/en...ite-28245n.jpg

What I want to be able to do is use that single socket and feed 3 other
TV's in the following order (which I presume is the best way to do it) the
socket is in the living room so I will of course run cable from the socket
to the TV then I use a very cheap Argos splitter to split the signal so
one goes to the TV (well sky or free-view box not too sure which one, but
it ends up in the TV somehow).
Then from that splitter I run some cheap White plastic coated coax to my
desk which is in the kitchen (my flat is the kind where living room and
kitchen dining room are all in one, so where dining table should be is my
desk) on my desk I have one of those 10" Nikkai LCD TV's, then I wanted
the TV signal fed into my bedroom which again is done right now via cheap
white plastic coated coax, which then goes into an old labgear TV booster

http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/5...4ds1bqls4k.jpg

which then goes into free-view box then TV.
So that is how it's set up now but I'm sure something is wrong somewhere
as I retuned my 10" the other day and it only found a few channels then
when I set up Samsung in the bedroom it failed to find any HD channels
(it's a Samsung UE32ES5500), now I'm presuming that the 10" and 32" were
not able to find all channels due to poor signal, so I have come to the
decision I need to look into a better way of rewiring the flat for TV
signals.

I don't know if I should just replace the coax with some decent stuff or
look at some form of wireless distribution system, I don't have a fortune
to spend maybe £50-£100.

I have no access to the aerial itself of the distribution box the engineer
has put in I can only work on things from "within" my flat, I know 2.4Ghz
is busy to say the least I have cordless Panasonic phones x 3 plus,
cordless headphones but these are only on 860 odd Mhz and an old O2
wireless router v4.

I will post a picture of the TV antenna itself on Monday, just in case
that makes any difference, any and all advice is welcome.

TIA

Jim

Very basic cabling/distribution advice needed please
 

In article ,
David Woolley wrote:
Jim wrote:


Guess some idea of coax length would have been handy, sorry about that.
So from
UHF socket to TV is 120 inches
TV (in living room) to my desk where 10" TV is located is 260 inches.
Desk to bedroom is 440 inches.


With good quality cable (CT100) you will lose a little over half the
signal power (~4dB) in the cable.

but "signal power" isn't relevant. Its signal voltage where -6dB is a half.
440 inches is around 11m, and with CT100 losing about 15dB per 100m at CP
channels, I reckon the loss would be under 2dB.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

Very basic cabling/distribution advice needed please
 

"David Woolley" wrote in message
...
Jim wrote:


Guess some idea of coax length would have been handy, sorry about that.
So from
UHF socket to TV is 120 inches
TV (in living room) to my desk where 10" TV is located is 260 inches.
Desk to bedroom is 440 inches.


With good quality cable (CT100) you will lose a little over half the
signal power (~4dB) in the cable. Cheap, daisy chained, splitters will
reduce the signal power by a further factor of, at least, 16. The Maplin
4 way F splitter will reduce it by a factor of about 9. Mark's 3dB, for a
two way splitter, is a bit optimistic (hypothetical ideal splitter).

It was a theoretical figure - there will be insertion and coupling losses.

The real device figures quoted by Maplin are about 4dB.

Very basic cabling/distribution advice needed please
 

"David WE Roberts" wrote in message
...

"Jim" wrote in message
m...
OK I'll be upfront I know very little about this so please bear with me
as I'm well out of my comfort zone here.

I live in a small block of 4 flats and we all get our TV signal from the
same external aerial and gets it's feed from Crystal Palace, the cable
comes in the roof and is then feed to all four flats where we have a
single UHF TV socket, something like this
http://m2.sourcingmap.com/smapimg/en...ite-28245n.jpg

snip

You need to distribute from the single socket you have, amplifing there
and then running a seperate cable to each device.
[Charles has already mentioned this.]

Get a decent 4 port (or more if you expect to add more devices) powered
amplifier/splitter and site it as close to the incoming socket as
possible.

Then he won't be able to watch DVD / PVR / $ky output in other rooms!


Then run independant good quality co-ax leads to each device.

That is how a simple distribution system is set up.
Bill will probably recommend the best device for the amplifier/splitter.

Cheers

Dave R
--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

Very basic cabling/distribution advice needed please
 

On 30/12/2012 18:19, Jim wrote:
So that is how it's set up now but I'm sure something is wrong somewhere
as I retuned my 10" the other day and it only found a few channels then
when I set up Samsung in the bedroom it failed to find any HD channels
(it's a Samsung UE32ES5500), now I'm presuming that the 10" and 32" were
not able to find all channels due to poor signal, so I have come to the
decision I need to look into a better way of rewiring the flat for TV
signals.

So it worked OK until the other day, and now it doesn't, and you haven't
changed anything (yet)? Sounds to me as if the fault is outside your
flat. Ask the neighbours if their TVs are working OK.

Then follow the advice given elsewhere in this thread.

Andy.
--
p.s. It's means "It is" to anyone but a greengrocer ;)

Very basic cabling/distribution advice needed please
 

charles wrote:
In article ,
David Woolley wrote:


With good quality cable (CT100) you will lose a little over half the
signal power (~4dB) in the cable.

but "signal power" isn't relevant. Its signal voltage where -6dB is a half.
440 inches is around 11m, and with CT100 losing about 15dB per 100m at CP
channels, I reckon the loss would be under 2dB.


Signal power is proportional to the square of signal voltage, and the
reason for the 20 in the dB calculation for voltage is that dB's are
really power ratios. The 2 in the 20 represents the power of two.

As I read the wiring topology, all three cables were effectively in
series, which is how I got 4dB. 4dB, itself is plenty enough to get you
from perfect digital reception to none at all. The only uncertainty in
that relates to the shortest, 10 foot one.

Very basic cabling/distribution advice needed please
 

On 30/12/2012 19:36, Graham. wrote:

the socket is in the living room so I will of course run cable from the
socket to the TV then I use a very cheap Argos splitter to split the
signal so one goes to the TV (well sky or free-view box not too sure
which one, but it ends up in the TV somehow).

Jim, in the bit of your OP I have quoted above, you mention a Sky box.
Does this mean you have your own satellite dish? I presume this is so
because the distribution system doesn't carry satellite.

If so, then there are other suggestions we could make that don't
involve the aerial.




Sorry Graham, yes i do have a sky subscription (for my sins) but that
will going in April and i have the dish set-up with a quad LNB and twin
cable coming into living room that feeds Sky+HD box but will go into
Humax Freesat box when Sky goes and another twin feed coming into
bedroom to feed another freesat box when i get my hands on when, for
some reason the sky bod installed it in bedroom (god knows why, cough,
cough) I have no intention or desire to feed sky into bedroom, as i say
i'll be getting rid in April, Anyone want to buy a Sky HD box?

Jim

Very basic cabling/distribution advice needed please
 

On 30/12/2012 18:57, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
wrote in message
m...
OK I'll be upfront I know very little about this so please bear with me as
I'm well out of my comfort zone here.

I live in a small block of 4 flats and we all get our TV signal from the
same external aerial and gets it's feed from Crystal Palace, the cable
comes in the roof and is then feed to all four flats where we have a
single UHF TV socket, something like this
http://m2.sourcingmap.com/smapimg/en...ite-28245n.jpg

What I want to be able to do is use that single socket and feed 3 other
TV's in the following order (which I presume is the best way to do it) the
socket is in the living room so I will of course run cable from the socket
to the TV then I use a very cheap Argos splitter to split the signal so
one goes to the TV (well sky or free-view box not too sure which one, but
it ends up in the TV somehow).
Then from that splitter I run some cheap White plastic coated coax to my
desk which is in the kitchen (my flat is the kind where living room and
kitchen dining room are all in one, so where dining table should be is my
desk) on my desk I have one of those 10" Nikkai LCD TV's, then I wanted
the TV signal fed into my bedroom which again is done right now via cheap
white plastic coated coax, which then goes into an old labgear TV booster

http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/5...4ds1bqls4k.jpg

which then goes into free-view box then TV.
So that is how it's set up now but I'm sure something is wrong somewhere
as I retuned my 10" the other day and it only found a few channels then
when I set up Samsung in the bedroom it failed to find any HD channels
(it's a Samsung UE32ES5500), now I'm presuming that the 10" and 32" were
not able to find all channels due to poor signal, so I have come to the
decision I need to look into a better way of rewiring the flat for TV
signals.

I don't know if I should just replace the coax with some decent stuff or
look at some form of wireless distribution system, I don't have a fortune
to spend maybe £50-£100.

I have no access to the aerial itself of the distribution box the engineer
has put in I can only work on things from "within" my flat, I know 2.4Ghz
is busy to say the least I have cordless Panasonic phones x 3 plus,
cordless headphones but these are only on 860 odd Mhz and an old O2
wireless router v4.

I will post a picture of the TV antenna itself on Monday, just in case
that makes any difference, any and all advice is welcome.

TIA

Jim


Well the main thing is that they should not be daisy chained.

The sequence should be: -

W aerial
|
V
wall socket
|
TV amp [optional see text]
|
toys PVR, DVD, $ky box etc.
|
4 way splitter
| | | |
TV TV TV TV

The four way splitter should be a reactive one (e.g. from Maplin£10).

If you do not want to view the output of your boxes elsewhere then put them
after the splitter and in any event use HDMI, component or SCARTs to get the
output into your main TV.

Test each TV / box individually on the incoming UHF to see they will search
correctly.

If the divided signal is insufficient so they won't work after the splitter,
buy a cheap UHF amp and insert it before any boxes.

If you are replacing cable(s) use CT100 or similar and keep the runs short
and the joins to an absolute minimum.

As it happens the arrangement in my flat is similar. We are ~30km from
Winter Hill. The feed from the aerial goes to a [landlord's] six way amp
for the 6 flats and then in my flat the arrangement is as above without the
optional amp. In the smaller block the landlord's splitter is passive.
Works fine.


If you are not using the analogue signal in you main TV, then you can use
two two way splitters. One signal (-3dB) from the first can go to your
weakest device (probably the Freeview HD TV) and the other to the splitter
for the other two (-6dB) and no aerial goes into the main TV.


How far are you from Crystal Palace?



Well as the crow flies I'm 5.435 miles or 8.338 km away from the palace
however my signal is being blocked to "some" degree by other flats, I'm
2nd floor and aerial is on a T&K bracket with about a 20 foot pole.

Very basic cabling/distribution advice needed please
 

On 30/12/2012 19:02, David WE Roberts wrote:

You need to distribute from the single socket you have, amplifing there
and then running a seperate cable to each device.
[Charles has already mentioned this.]
Told you i was dumb with this stuff all these years i had it set up
wrong, Doh!


Get a decent 4 port (or more if you expect to add more devices) powered
amplifier/splitter and site it as close to the incoming socket as possible.

Then run independant good quality co-ax leads to each device.

That is how a simple distribution system is set up.
Bill will probably recommend the best device for the amplifier/splitter.

Cheers

Dave R

OK thanks Dave I'll wait for Bill to have his say and take it from there

Very basic cabling/distribution advice needed please
 

On 30/12/2012 20:55, R. Mark Clayton wrote:
Then he won't be able to watch DVD / PVR / $ky output in other room

That's not a major problem to be honest, Bedroom has it's own DVD &
freeview PVR and when the freesat PVR goes in the living room I'll be
using a firmware hack that will allow me to broadcast wireless from that
Freesat PVR to the bedroom as i have the dongle coming any day.

Jim