Circumventing Patientline
 

In article , Norman Wells
wrote:
Jim Lesurf wrote:
In article , Norman Wells
wrote:

The alternative is for the NHS to become a car park company
establishing and running free or subsidised car parks all over the
place not only for the patients but their sisters and their cousins
and their aunts as well. If there are limited funds available to the
NHS, as there always are, isn't it better that those funds should be
spent on medical facilities rather than running car parks?

Its a nice rhetorical question, based on a presumed dichotomy. But the
reality is that such 'non medical' things may well have an impact on
the medical side, and the outcome, and how soon people can get back to
being involved in society. Life isn't always as simple as the
rhetorical questions politicians like to 'ask'.

I don't think car parking charges have any bearing whatsoever on medical
outcomes.

It was clear that you "think" that. But people "think" all kinds of things
that simply aren't true. So that tells us nothing beyond what you choose to
believe.

If you want to try and stand up your personal beliefs as being 'fact' then
produce the results of the studies that show that the way people are
treated (in the general sense, and wrt this specific issue) has no impact
on medical outcomes. Give the references and let people decide on the
facts. Not on being expected to accept what you "think", or by dismissing
the possibility.

Slainte,

Jim

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Circumventing Patientline
 

In article , Bill Wright
wrote:
tim.... wrote:
"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
tim.... wrote:

not when you've got to get there at 7am as a "day in-patient", there
isn't
Most places you can use the patient transport service.

Only if you know about it.

You really do have to be prepared to help yourself in these matters.

But again, if you are seriously unwell and frightened or worried, or have
mental illness problems, that is easier said than done. The basic
difficulty with a lot of the beliefs thrown around as if 'facts' in this
thread is that they simply don't take into account the compexity of the
cases. People may be in too much pain, or too much of a rush, etc, to
pause and carefully research if the WRVS can help them with a 'car'
or visit the CAB for info, or whatever.

Slainte,

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
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Circumventing Patientline
 

In article , Norman Wells wrote:
There are many cases where hospitals have moved from (expensive),
easy to get to, town centre locations to cheaper out of the way edge
of town locations which are only accessible by car.

I doubt if any hospital is really accessible only by car. In my
experience, there are _always_ bus routes serving them.

There are, but you have to find out where and when they run, and unless
you're very lucky the journey you actually need to make will take at
least three times as long as the same journey by car.

Rod.
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Circumventing Patientline
 

Roderick Stewart wrote:
In article , Norman Wells wrote:
There are many cases where hospitals have moved from (expensive),
easy to get to, town centre locations to cheaper out of the way edge
of town locations which are only accessible by car.

I doubt if any hospital is really accessible only by car. In my
experience, there are _always_ bus routes serving them.

There are, but you have to find out where and when they run,

How dreadful!

and
unless you're very lucky the journey you actually need to make will
take at least three times as long as the same journey by car.

Why should the taxpayer pay for your convenience?

Circumventing Patientline
 

tim.... wrote:
"Norman Wells" wrote in message
...

Getting a bill that's the same order of magnitude as buying a new TV
for a 2 week stay just shows that the costs of provision are
over-inflated.

Not if you deduct board and lodging costs. Even if you pay for an
unnecessary TV in hospital, you'll still be well in pocket over
staying at home providing your own heating, lighting, food and drink.

No I won't. I still have to pay my rent when I'm in hospital and if
I go in a rush won't have had time to turn off the heating (and if
it's really cold outside wouldn't be able to). This idea that people
"save" on their home bills when in hospital is nonsense!

So too it seems is the idea of anyone being other than hopeless in
managing their own affairs.

And the cost of food for a few days is trivial (it only costs so much
in accounting terms because someone else is preparing it in someone
else's kitchen).

The true comparison would be with a restaurant or meals on wheels. It's
a good question why you should be entitled to any free food or drink in
hospital when you'd be paying for it at home. However, since you are,
you make a significant saving, and that means you've got enough to pay
for a TV while in hospital if that's what you want. Why should I, as a
taxpayer, be paying for your TV?

Circumventing Patientline
 

tim.... wrote:
"Norman Wells" wrote in message
...

not when you've got to get there at 7am as a "day in-patient", there
isn't

Then pay to park there for goodness sake, or get a friend or
neighbour to take you in if you're that mean.

Honestly, some people are just hopeless. #

we are discussing the principle, not whether I can afford it

and IMHO the principle is WRONG, for the reasons that I have stated,
which I will repeat:.

it is wrong for the health authority to move to an out of the way
location to save money and then REFUSE to use some of that savings in
providing free parking.

Please discuss (with me) the point that I have made and not an
entirely different one that you have made up!

You tell me why I, as a taxpayer, should be expected to stump up for
your car parking anywhere. Tell me too why I should be expected to
stump up for your niece's car parking when she comes to visit. Isn't
the idea of a health service to provide medical care? Isn't that where
the money should be spent?

Circumventing Patientline
 

Jim Lesurf wrote:
In article , Norman Wells
wrote:
tim.... wrote:
"Norman Wells" wrote in message
...

There are many cases where hospitals have moved from (expensive),
easy to get to, town centre locations to cheaper out of the way
edge of town locations which are only accessible by car.

I doubt if any hospital is really accessible only by car. In my
experience, there are _always_ bus routes serving them.

Again, this depends on your definition of "really accessible".

You're taking that phrase out of context as if it means something
special. It doesn't. All it means in context is that I doubt if any
hospital is 'truly' accessible only by car.

The main hospital we have to use is in Dundee (Tayside), well away
from the center of the town. We are in Fife. The hospital was
previously near the center of Dundee.

We are fortunate in having a frequent bus service to Dundee - but not
to the hospital itself. For us that adds a walk to get from one stop
to another. OK for us.

But others who live in villages around Fife may have no bus service
at all, or just one or two busses a day. And may have to change more
than once. I'm not sure how many ill/worried people would call that
"really accessible" TBH.

Anyway, town centre locations are not necessarily easy to get to for
everyone, nor are they likely to have sufficient room for the car
parking they really need.

Erm, I thought the idea of saying they were "really accessible" by bus
would be that you'd have little need for car parking. :-)

Speaking simply from the local experience, getting to the hospital
that was in Dundee {DRI} was far easier than having to take another
bus up to Ninewells.

ISTM most unreasonable for somebody (anybody), offering a monopoly
service, to move to an out of the way location for *their*
convenience and then charge the people that they have forced an
inconvenient journey upon to get to them, to pay to park as a
revenue stream.

A small charge payable to the hospital that is expensively treating
you or a person you think enough of to be visiting. It's not too
much to ask surely?

Will you convince him by calling him Shirley?... :-) ...or was your
'question' really just telling you view? And what if it is a *large*
'charge'? Are you the sole judge of what others may find "small"?

I don't care how big or small they find it, just as I don't care what
price an iPhone is. If you want it, you pay for it. If you won't or
can't, you go without. Car parking at a hospital is rarely essential.
It can be nearly always be avoided even if at the cost of a little
inconvenience. Why should I, as a taxpayer, be expected to subsidise
car parking for either patients or their visitors?

Circumventing Patientline
 

Bill Wright wrote:
Norman Wells wrote:

As regard the provision of TVs, I think the bearing on medical
outcomes is too tenuous to merit serious consideration for free
provision. What is it with mean and miserable patients who resent
paying just the price of a pint or two for TV when they're receiving
all their other facilities, including food, drink and endless pretty
nurses, entirely free of charge?

The problem with Patientline (et al) is that the charges are too high
and the tellys are crap.

Even more reason then why the taxpayer shouldn't pay for them.

Circumventing Patientline
 

Bill Wright wrote:
A
What
is it with mean and miserable patients who resent paying just the
price of a pint or two for TV when they're receiving all their other
facilities, including food, drink and endless pretty nurses,
entirely free of charge?

The fact is that having a telly to watch is a big help for a lot of
people in hospital, but the cost of Patientline for long stay patients
is more than some people can afford.

I can't help contrasting the charges with the 50p a week prisoners pay
for TV.

Yes, but it's all artifical in prison. A weeks work only brings in
about £8-10, out of which prisoners have to buy all their necessities,
and any luxuries that are available, at proper retail prices.

Circumventing Patientline
 

Jim Lesurf wrote:
In article , Bill Wright
wrote:
tim.... wrote:
"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
tim.... wrote:

not when you've got to get there at 7am as a "day in-patient",
there isn't
Most places you can use the patient transport service.

Only if you know about it.

You really do have to be prepared to help yourself in these matters.

But again, if you are seriously unwell and frightened or worried, or
have mental illness problems, that is easier said than done. The basic
difficulty with a lot of the beliefs thrown around as if 'facts' in
this thread is that they simply don't take into account the compexity
of the cases. People may be in too much pain, or too much of a rush,
etc, to pause and carefully research if the WRVS can help them with a
'car'
or visit the CAB for info, or whatever.

With such conditions, they shouldn't be driving themselves either. So,
the question of their paying over the odds for parking, which is what
this discussion is about, doesn't arise.