|
|
TOT problem with Word 2007
I have two 730KB .doc files which won't let me delete or move them
because 'they are open in Word'. But I'm not running Word. Both claim to be read-only files (so can only be saved to a different file name). But in 'properties' they are not 'read-only', and making them so and then changing back doesn't help. Ideas anyone? Bill |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On Friday, December 9th, 2011 at 21:26:36h +0000, Bill Wright asked:
Ideas anyone? http://word.mvps.ORG/faqs/apperrors/lockedfiles.htm .. |
TOT problem with Word 2007
Bill Wright wrote:
I have two 730KB .doc files which won't let me delete or move them because 'they are open in Word'. But I'm not running Word. Both claim to be read-only files (so can only be saved to a different file name). But in 'properties' they are not 'read-only', and making them so and then changing back doesn't help. Ideas anyone? worth a try? http://www.emptyloop.com/unlocker/ |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On 09/12/2011 21:26, Bill Wright wrote:
I have two 730KB .doc files which won't let me delete or move them because 'they are open in Word'. But I'm not running Word. Both claim to be read-only files (so can only be saved to a different file name). But in 'properties' they are not 'read-only', and making them so and then changing back doesn't help. Ideas anyone? Bill Have you got more than one user account on the PC? it may be a permissions issue. you need to find out which user created the two word files in the first place. this is also known as the owner. log in as that particular user and then you should be able to delete them. Failing that log in as administrator and delete it. If that is still problematic, then booting from a Knoppix Live CD and some Linux commands will do it..... Stephen |
TOT problem with Word 2007
I don't think he'll need to go that far. Booting into Safe Mode and
logging on as an Administrator nearly always allows deletion of problem files. On Fri, 09 Dec 2011 21:46:03 +0000, Stephen H wrote: If that is still problematic, then booting from a Knoppix Live CD and some Linux commands will do it..... -- ================================================== ======= Please always reply to ng as the email in this post's header does not exist. Or use a contact address at: http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/JavaJive.html http://www.macfh.co.uk/Macfarlane/Macfarlane.html |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In message , Java Jive
writes On Fri, 09 Dec 2011 21:46:03 +0000, Stephen H wrote: If that is still problematic, then booting from a Knoppix Live CD and some Linux commands will do it..... I don't think he'll need to go that far. Booting into Safe Mode and logging on as an Administrator nearly always allows deletion of problem files. Or if that fails, resort to basics. Bring up a command prompt, and try deleting in DOS mode. -- Ian |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On 09/12/2011 21:26, Bill Wright wrote:
I have two 730KB .doc files which won't let me delete or move them because 'they are open in Word'. But I'm not running Word. Both claim to be read-only files (so can only be saved to a different file name). But in 'properties' they are not 'read-only', and making them so and then changing back doesn't help. Ideas anyone? Sometimes word fails to exit properly and can leave a process running even when you think it has been closed. Run task manager and look for winword.exe in the process list. Click to select it and then click the end process button if its there. Secondly, look in the folder containing the file you want to open and see if there is a word temporary file there with a similar name. If there is, then delete that. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
TOT problem with Word 2007
John Rumm wrote:
On 09/12/2011 21:26, Bill Wright wrote: I have two 730KB .doc files which won't let me delete or move them because 'they are open in Word'. But I'm not running Word. Both claim to be read-only files (so can only be saved to a different file name). But in 'properties' they are not 'read-only', and making them so and then changing back doesn't help. Ideas anyone? Sometimes word fails to exit properly and can leave a process running even when you think it has been closed. Run task manager and look for winword.exe in the process list. Click to select it and then click the end process button if its there. Pooter has been turned off several times since then, no winword.exe running. Secondly, look in the folder containing the file you want to open and see if there is a word temporary file there with a similar name. If there is, then delete that. No there ain't. As it happens IT man is coming tomorrow. I have stored everyone's ideas from this group but will ask him, just to see what happens. Then no doubt follow group's advice and do it myself. Bill |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On 11/12/2011 01:31, Bill Wright wrote:
John Rumm wrote: On 09/12/2011 21:26, Bill Wright wrote: I have two 730KB .doc files which won't let me delete or move them because 'they are open in Word'. But I'm not running Word. Both claim to be read-only files (so can only be saved to a different file name). But in 'properties' they are not 'read-only', and making them so and then changing back doesn't help. Ideas anyone? Sometimes word fails to exit properly and can leave a process running even when you think it has been closed. Run task manager and look for winword.exe in the process list. Click to select it and then click the end process button if its there. Pooter has been turned off several times since then, no winword.exe running. Secondly, look in the folder containing the file you want to open and see if there is a word temporary file there with a similar name. If there is, then delete that. No there ain't. Might be worth checking the file ownership permissions then. Open a command prompt (type CMD into the Run box if necessary), go to the directory with the file in question and type CACLS filename Compare the result to that of a file you can edit. It may be that the non editable file is not read only, but your username do not have permission to write to it. (you can add it with "CACLS filename /G Everyone:F") -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On 09/12/2011 21:26, Bill Wright wrote:
I have two 730KB .doc files which won't let me delete or move them because 'they are open in Word'. But I'm not running Word. Both claim to be read-only files (so can only be saved to a different file name). But in 'properties' they are not 'read-only', and making them so and then changing back doesn't help. Ideas anyone? Bill If all else fails, copy the files to a memory stick so you have a copy for future use. Get a linux live CD and boot into linux from the CD. Use the linux file manager to find the word files, and delete them. (NB a linux live CD can make a very useful rescue disk when you find you can't boot into Windows.) The other alternative is to take ownership of the files, as you may not have permission to delete or change them - even if you are the only user of the computer and have administrator status. You can do this from the file properties | security tab, but it's a bit of a convoluted procedure. It's much easier with a small registry hack (search for "Take ownership" with Google). But have a word with your IT man first. -- Jeff |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On 11/12/2011 05:39, John Rumm wrote:
On 11/12/2011 01:31, Bill Wright wrote: John Rumm wrote: On 09/12/2011 21:26, Bill Wright wrote: I have two 730KB .doc files which won't let me delete or move them because 'they are open in Word'. But I'm not running Word. Both claim to be read-only files (so can only be saved to a different file name). But in 'properties' they are not 'read-only', and making them so and then changing back doesn't help. Ideas anyone? Sometimes word fails to exit properly and can leave a process running even when you think it has been closed. Run task manager and look for winword.exe in the process list. Click to select it and then click the end process button if its there. Pooter has been turned off several times since then, no winword.exe running. Secondly, look in the folder containing the file you want to open and see if there is a word temporary file there with a similar name. If there is, then delete that. No there ain't. Might be worth checking the file ownership permissions then. Open a command prompt (type CMD into the Run box if necessary), go to the directory with the file in question and type CACLS filename Compare the result to that of a file you can edit. It may be that the non editable file is not read only, but your username do not have permission to write to it. (you can add it with "CACLS filename /G Everyone:F") C:\cacls NOTE: Cacls is now deprecated, please use Icacls. (Windows 7) iCacls? Are you thinking what I'm thinking? These are both new commands to me, I know a bit about tinkering with DACLs in the GUI, wouldn't that have been a more accessible place to point Bill? -- Graham. %Profound_observation% |
TOT problem with Word 2007
Graham. wrote... wouldn't that have been a more accessible place to point Bill? IMO, the best and most accessible advice so far was given by Andy. http://www.emptyloop.com/unlocker/ How often have you tried to delete or rename a file or folder and got "Cannot delete xxx: It is being used by another person or program." ? Unlocker is a tool which will help you overcoming this scandalous windows bug. Simply right click the file or folder and select Unlocker. If the file or folder is locked then a window will appear with a list of processes locking the file or folder. Select the locks and click Unlock and you are done. -- Ken O'Meara http://www.btinternet.com/~unsteadyken/ |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On 11/12/2011 11:54, UnsteadyKen wrote:
Graham. wrote... wouldn't that have been a more accessible place to point Bill? IMO, the best and most accessible advice so far was given by Andy. http://www.emptyloop.com/unlocker/ How often have you tried to delete or rename a file or folder and got "Cannot delete xxx: It is being used by another person or program." ? Unlocker is a tool which will help you overcoming this scandalous windows bug. Simply right click the file or folder and select Unlocker. If the file or folder is locked then a window will appear with a list of processes locking the file or folder. Select the locks and click Unlock and you are done. http://files.brothersoft.com/interne...locker.9.1.exe causes Eset to complain that it is a "variant of Win32/Toolbar.Babylon potentially unwanted application". Pete |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On Sun, 11 Dec 2011 11:54:39 -0000, UnsteadyKen
wrote: Unlocker is a tool which will help you overcoming this scandalous windows bug. In this case I think the bug is a facility. For example I use the Windows API to lock files as my multithreaded applications are processing them. If one thread is running and another wakes up there has to be some sort of access control. As well as that if a user or another application tries to delete or write to a file that is currently locked Windows will correctly complain. How would Unlocker cope with that? Steve -- Neural network software applications, help and support. Neural Network Software. www.npsl1.com EasyNN-plus. Neural Networks plus. www.easynn.com SwingNN. Forecast with Neural Networks. www.swingnn.com JustNN. Just Neural Networks. www.justnn.com |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article , Stephen
Wolstenholme wrote: On Sun, 11 Dec 2011 11:54:39 -0000, UnsteadyKen wrote: Unlocker is a tool which will help you overcoming this scandalous windows bug. In this case I think the bug is a facility. For example I use the Windows API to lock files as my multithreaded applications are processing them. I presume it is called a 'bug' when the user *hasn't* deliberately chosen to make the file 'undeletable' and finds it a PITA. Can't comment beyond that as I have no idea why Bill's files became 'undeletable' without him setting that. And I don't use Windows[1], so can't compare it with Linux, etc. Slainte, Jim [1] Have done a few times in the past for specific purposes. But generally don't bother with it. -- Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me. Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On 11/12/2011 10:42, Graham. wrote:
On 11/12/2011 05:39, John Rumm wrote: On 11/12/2011 01:31, Bill Wright wrote: John Rumm wrote: On 09/12/2011 21:26, Bill Wright wrote: I have two 730KB .doc files which won't let me delete or move them because 'they are open in Word'. But I'm not running Word. Both claim to be read-only files (so can only be saved to a different file name). But in 'properties' they are not 'read-only', and making them so and then changing back doesn't help. Ideas anyone? Sometimes word fails to exit properly and can leave a process running even when you think it has been closed. Run task manager and look for winword.exe in the process list. Click to select it and then click the end process button if its there. Pooter has been turned off several times since then, no winword.exe running. Secondly, look in the folder containing the file you want to open and see if there is a word temporary file there with a similar name. If there is, then delete that. No there ain't. Might be worth checking the file ownership permissions then. Open a command prompt (type CMD into the Run box if necessary), go to the directory with the file in question and type CACLS filename Compare the result to that of a file you can edit. It may be that the non editable file is not read only, but your username do not have permission to write to it. (you can add it with "CACLS filename /G Everyone:F") C:\cacls NOTE: Cacls is now deprecated, please use Icacls. (Windows 7) It is, although I don't know what OS Bill is running, and CALCS is still there on win7 even if it refers you to icalcs some of the time... iCacls? Are you thinking what I'm thinking? These are both new commands to me, I know a bit about tinkering with DACLs in the GUI, wouldn't that have been a more accessible place to point Bill? Sometimes "type this" is a far less verbose exercise than textually navigating someone through a GUI. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On 11/12/2011 15:16, tony sayer wrote:
Some say that Libre office is a bit better nowadays... AFAIK not much in it as yet. For the locked file - I use Sysinternals' Process Explorer (Sysinternals is now owned by MS). If that shows nothing, check permissions in the GUI before a reboot. I've never needed to go to open office or Linux for this kind of problem. From the description other-Andy's tool will be easier to use. Andy |
TOT problem with Word 2007
Pete Shew wrote... http://files.brothersoft.com/interne...locker.9.1.exe causes Eset to complain that it is a "variant of Win32/Toolbar.Babylon potentially unwanted application". Yes, just checked with http://www.virustotal.com/ and they say the same. It would appear that the installer/wrapper (added by brothersoft) gives the option to install the Bing Bar http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bing_Bar Just checked and the bing bar is not installed if option is unchecked on installation. I use the portable version which I got from the authors site a couple of years ago, so didn't see this and hadn't realised that he was using brothersoft to host his files. Still worth a try though. -- Ken O'Meara http://www.btinternet.com/~unsteadyken/ |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article , UnsteadyKen
writes Pete Shew wrote... http://files.brothersoft.com/interne...locker.9.1.exe causes Eset to complain that it is a "variant of Win32/Toolbar.Babylon potentially unwanted application". Yes, just checked with http://www.virustotal.com/ and they say the same. It would appear that the installer/wrapper (added by brothersoft) gives the option to install the Bing Bar http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bing_Bar Just checked and the bing bar is not installed if option is unchecked on installation. I use the portable version which I got from the authors site a couple of years ago, so didn't see this and hadn't realised that he was using brothersoft to host his files. Still worth a try though. The program's reputation suffered badly a while back when the author added some revenue generating toolbar/helper installs to the package that were meant to be optional but were badly integrated and ended up installing w/o permission. The author didn't handle the resulting flack well or fix the problem promptly so negative publicity resulted. From memory that was around version 1.8.7, now at 1.9.something I think and problems are fixed. I still have the pre toolbar 1.8.5 and wouldn't be without it, currently using the installer version for the integrated right click functionality. Should fix the o/p's prob in seconds. -- fred it's a ba-na-na . . . . |
TOT problem with Word 2007
As I sat here this morning waiting for the IT man to come to deal with
Hil's PC (hardware issue) I remembered that the files I had on my office PC that were refusing to disappear had been edited a few weeks ago on my laptop, via the wifi (but had been edited many times since on the office PC). So just out of curiosity I used the laptop to find them on the drive of the office PC and pressed delete, and it worked! So presumably the laptop had marked the files as 'open' and only it could remove that marking. Or is this too simplistic? The reason I wanted to delete them was that all the text had been copied to other files, so they were now redundant. Thanks to everyone for your suggestions. Bill |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article , Bill Wright
wrote: As I sat here this morning waiting for the IT man to come to deal with Hil's PC (hardware issue) I remembered that the files I had on my office PC that were refusing to disappear had been edited a few weeks ago on my laptop, via the wifi (but had been edited many times since on the office PC). So just out of curiosity I used the laptop to find them on the drive of the office PC and pressed delete, and it worked! So presumably the laptop had marked the files as 'open' and only it could remove that marking. Or is this too simplistic? I don't know how 'doze handles file permissions. But an alternative is that the laptop account 'took ownership' for some reason. Slainte, Jim -- Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me. Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On Sunday, December 11th, 2011, at 16:03:35h +0000, Jim Lesurf wrote:
Can't comment beyond that as I have no idea why Bill's files became 'undeletable' without him setting that. Because they are Word documents and MS Word creates lock files on documents. So as indicated in another post, the user who was in the process of editing the file had the user on the laptop identity, the user on the desktop identity could not modify the file. My original post on the matter provided a link to explain all this but I guess it was either not received or nobody could be bothered to visit the page and read the details. http://word.mvps.ORG/faqs/apperrors/lockedfiles.htm This is a problem which in the past has caused quite a lot of consternation for users whose files which are stored on a central server. If the network went down temporarily, and the lock file indicating that an edit was still in progress remains and the user become unable to do anything further with the file. |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article , J G Miller
wrote: On Sunday, December 11th, 2011, at 16:03:35h +0000, Jim Lesurf wrote: Can't comment beyond that as I have no idea why Bill's files became 'undeletable' without him setting that. Because they are Word documents and MS Word creates lock files on documents. You'll have to explain that in terms a non-doze-user can follow. :-) Is the phrase "creates lock files" a slip of the english, or does windows (or Word) save a 'lock file' that controls access to another file? So as indicated in another post, the user who was in the process of editing the file had the user on the laptop identity, the user on the desktop identity could not modify the file. In Linux-like terms, does that mean the file had its owner (and group) ID set to those for the laptop user, not the main machine user (and group)? My original post on the matter provided a link to explain all this but I guess it was either not received or nobody could be bothered to visit the page and read the details. http://word.mvps.ORG/faqs/apperrors/lockedfiles.htm That looks more to me like a temporary file created by the 'Word' process using the 'Word' (or root like?) ID. Is that the case? I'm asking what may seem odd questions because I don't know that much about the filing system Windows uses. I just access it from Linux or RO so can please myself about any file permissions, etc. Slainte, Jim -- Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me. Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html |
TOT problem with Word 2007
Op maandag, 12 december, 2011, om 17:52:54u +0100,
schreef Martin van Nederlands: http://word.mvps.ORG/faqs/apperrors/lockedfiles.htm Nah! Somebody here advised us not to open URLs. The advice was not to click *directly* on the link but to copy and paste the link to the address bar of the browser. |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On Monday, December 12th, 2011, at 16:28:47h +0000, Jim Lesurf asked:
That looks more to me like a temporary file created by the 'Word' process using the 'Word' (or root like?) ID. Is that the case? As far as I am aware -- yes -- the temporary file is the "lock file". I'm asking what may seem odd questions because I don't know that much about the filing system Windows uses. I just access it from Linux or RO so can please myself about any file permissions, etc. Because Linux or RO applications do not check for the presence of such a "lock file" for Word documents. GNU/Linux software does use similar sort of lock files on occasion, eg Debian apt-get and dpkg, because after all, you do not want more than one invoked process to be trying to change the installed software "database" at a time. The most popular lock file on GNU/Linux systems is of course /tmp/.X0-lock luser Xorg Fatal server error: Server is already active for display 0 If this server is no longer running, remove /tmp/.X0-lock and start again. Please consult the The X.Org Foundation support at http://wiki.x.org for help. |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In message , J G Miller
writes Op maandag, 12 december, 2011, om 17:52:54u +0100, schreef Martin van Nederlands: http://word.mvps.ORG/faqs/apperrors/lockedfiles.htm Nah! Somebody here advised us not to open URLs. The advice was not to click *directly* on the link but to copy and paste the link to the address bar of the browser. If you hover your mouse cursor over a link, you will see what it really is, revealed on status bar at the bottom of the screen. If it seems to have no relationship with what it purports to be, treat with great caution. I'm using Demon's Turnpike mail/news client, and if I right-click on a link, a dialogue box opens, and I can select 'Extract URL'. This reveals all the links in the e-mail/posting. -- Ian |
TOT problem with Word 2007
Jim Lesurf wrote:
You'll have to explain that in terms a non-doze-user can follow. It's a hell of a problem for you Jim, not using Windows like everybody else. Must drive you mad. Don't they have it in Scotland? Bill |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In message , Bill Wright
writes Jim Lesurf wrote: You'll have to explain that in terms a non-doze-user can follow. It's a hell of a problem for you Jim, not using Windows like everybody else. Must drive you mad. Don't they have it in Scotland? In the 1700s, didn't they introduce a Window Tax in Scotland, and, as a result, many Scottish stately homes and castles have bricked-up (stoned-up?) windows? Maybe it still exists, and so penny-pinching computer users mistakenly think that they can save a few bawbees by using alternative operating systems? -- Ian |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article , Tony sayer wrote:
Which strikes me as a very common problem now people either can't or won't be bothered to learn anything about the S/W package they are using they expect it to just work and read their minds re what they want it to do!.... Ordinary mortals relate to *all* technology in this way. They just take it for granted until it goes wrong or fails to do what they want, and then they assume that it's somebody else's fault, and that they should be entitled to "compensation" or somebody to fix it for nothing. Rod. -- Virtual Access V6.3 free usenet/email software from http://sourceforge.net/projects/virtual-access/ |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article , Bill Wright
wrote: Jim Lesurf wrote: You'll have to explain that in terms a non-doze-user can follow. It's a hell of a problem for you Jim, not using Windows like everybody else. Actually, what I do notice is how much Windows users complain about how it and its apps treats them. Must drive you mad. Ah! *That* must be the reason. 8-] Don't they have it in Scotland? FWIW I've used doze on various occasions in the past. But only when there was a specific reason, or no freedom of choice. Afraid I find it a PITA for most purposes. So my my generally not using it is based on experience. I lost count of how many different OS's I've used over the years. To my taste, doze was the worst. It suits me that others use it, though. As a result I have often been in the situation where I could get computer based work done quicker and faster than 'competitors' who used Windows. So I've never wanted to 'evangelise' *too* much about RO or Linux. Never disturb your opponent when he is making a mistake. :-) Nor expect to change their religion. ;- If people prefer doze having genuinely tried alternatives, then that is fine with me. Good luck to them. Not my job to argue. My only cavil tends to be when they chose by default or were given no alternative by imposition, on in ignorance of alternatives. But again, generally not my concern. Except when I think public money is being wasted. Overall, though, an OS/computer/app is just a tool. You choose the one that suits you for how you want to do each task. A hammer is not a screwdriver, even though you can insert screws with a hammer. So in my case that means using two different totally different types of OS/computer each day for different tasks which each suits best from my POV. Slainte, Jim -- Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me. Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article , Ian Jackson
wrote: In message , Bill Wright writes Jim Lesurf wrote: You'll have to explain that in terms a non-doze-user can follow. It's a hell of a problem for you Jim, not using Windows like everybody else. Must drive you mad. Don't they have it in Scotland? In the 1700s, didn't they introduce a Window Tax in Scotland, and, as a result, many Scottish stately homes and castles have bricked-up (stoned-up?) windows? Maybe it still exists, and so penny-pinching computer users mistakenly think that they can save a few bawbees by using alternative operating systems? Well it is possible in principle to save money by not buying Windows and using Linux instead. Alas, the cartel of most hardware makers and Microsoft tend to make it hard to *not* pay for Windows simply to get the hardware. Slainte, Jim -- Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me. Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article , Martin
wrote: On Tue, 13 Dec 2011 06:00:49 -0000, Roderick Stewart wrote: In article , Tony sayer wrote: Which strikes me as a very common problem now people either can't or won't be bothered to learn anything about the S/W package they are using they expect it to just work and read their minds re what they want it to do!.... Ordinary mortals relate to *all* technology in this way. They just take it for granted until it goes wrong or fails to do what they want, and then they assume that it's somebody else's fault, and that they should be entitled to "compensation" or somebody to fix it for nothing. You don't have to be able to fly and maintain a jumbo jet to be a passenger in one. Indeed. And if someone else lends me their phone to make one call I may not care what model they use if it works for the call. But I might want to know more when considering buying a phone. Plus knowing how a phone works might help me avoid being caught out by it not working in some situations. Your comment does show that there are situations where many of us have to rely on others. But that isn't necessarily the same as choosing to be no more than a 'passenger' who remains wilfully ignorant about *every* choice they make. Particularly if that lazy ignorance exposes us to exploitation or manipulation for the profit of others. So there are times when it may make more sense to understand more about the magic boxes those nice engineers provide. But I guess I should declare an interest. My career has generally been based on 'exploiting' the ignorance of others. If they weren't, I wouldn't have been employed to teach/explain/design/find out for them. :-) Slainte, Jim -- Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me. Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article , Martin wrote:
In article , Tony sayer wrote: Which strikes me as a very common problem now people either can't or won't be bothered to learn anything about the S/W package they are using they expect it to just work and read their minds re what they want it to do!.... Ordinary mortals relate to *all* technology in this way. They just take it for granted until it goes wrong or fails to do what they want, and then they assume that it's somebody else's fault, and that they should be entitled to "compensation" or somebody to fix it for nothing. You don't have to be able to fly and maintain a jumbo jet to be a passenger in one. True, but then you probably don't have your own jumbo jet and consequently won't have the opportunity to do anything about its maintenance other than to pay someone else to do it. On the other hand, plenty of people do have their own cars, their own internet-connected computers, their own central heating systems, their own washing machines and so on. It's very much in their own financial interests to know how to use and look after these things properly so they don't go wrong so often, and at least a few basic things that can be done about it when they do. Rod. -- Virtual Access V6.3 free usenet/email software from http://sourceforge.net/projects/virtual-access/ |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article ,
Bill Wright wrote: Jim Lesurf wrote: You'll have to explain that in terms a non-doze-user can follow. It's a hell of a problem for you Jim, not using Windows like everybody else. Must drive you mad. Don't they have it in Scotland? But then it's not Jim asking how to use a prog he's bought... -- *He who laughs last, thinks slowest. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article ,
Ian Jackson wrote: In message , Bill Wright writes Jim Lesurf wrote: You'll have to explain that in terms a non-doze-user can follow. It's a hell of a problem for you Jim, not using Windows like everybody else. Must drive you mad. Don't they have it in Scotland? In the 1700s, didn't they introduce a Window Tax in Scotland, and, as a result, many Scottish stately homes and castles have bricked-up (stoned-up?) windows? Maybe it still exists, and so penny-pinching computer users mistakenly think that they can save a few bawbees by using alternative operating systems? Just in Scotland? Never seen bricked up windows elsewhere? Ever wonder about the origins of the phrase 'daylight robbery'? Here's some details:- http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/d...20robbery.html -- *Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it* Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article ,
Martin wrote: Ordinary mortals relate to *all* technology in this way. They just take it for granted until it goes wrong or fails to do what they want, and then they assume that it's somebody else's fault, and that they should be entitled to "compensation" or somebody to fix it for nothing. You don't have to be able to fly and maintain a jumbo jet to be a passenger in one. So you don't need to know what the 'controls' do in Word to be able to use it? *Reading* a Word document would be more akin to being a passenger on a flight. -- *Lottery: A tax on people who are bad at math. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article ,
Martin wrote: There are people who are far too busy with other things, who don't have time to wonder how computer things work. That's why they pay others to do the worrying for them. Although if they *did* understand how computer things worked, they might have less worry and more time for other things. :-) Without them there would be mass unemployment in the IT industry. Yes. I've long tended to regard Microsoft products as an odd form of 'job creation scheme' for the IT biz. Alas, in reality what it probably does is suck available time and money away from where it might be better used. Slainte, Jim -- Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me. Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html |
TOT problem with Word 2007
In article , Dave Plowman (News)
wrote: In article , Martin wrote: Ordinary mortals relate to *all* technology in this way. They just take it for granted until it goes wrong or fails to do what they want, and then they assume that it's somebody else's fault, and that they should be entitled to "compensation" or somebody to fix it for nothing. You don't have to be able to fly and maintain a jumbo jet to be a passenger in one. So you don't need to know what the 'controls' do in Word to be able to use it? Given some of the printed 'reports' I've been given over the years by students, etc, I fear many would assume so. But then I lost count of how many hadn't even any awareness of page numbers or paragraph breaks, etc! Slainte, Jim -- Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me. Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html |
TOT problem with Word 2007
On Wednesday, December 14th, 2011, at 10:33:55h +0000, Jim Lesurf observed:
in reality what it probably does is suck available time and money away from where it might be better used. A lot of capitalism is like that. Advertising and marketing is one aspect eg Unilever spends far more on that than research. And have you heard of the patents "troll" industry? http://www.npr.ORG/blogs/money/2011/07/26/138576167/when-patents-attack |
| All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:13 PM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HomeCinemaBanter.com