stupid station logos burnin on HD broadcast?
 

The local affiliate Digital broadcasts of CBS NBC And ABC insist on putting
their transparent logo on the bottom right of the screen which NEVER goes
away.

Will this burn in on my HD TV set?

If so, could there be a "class action" lawsuit to prevent this? I mean if
this can be proven to damage your screen, would not they be liable for that
damage?

Really becoming a pet peeve of mine.

thanks

Mango


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"Mango" wrote in message
...
The local affiliate Digital broadcasts of CBS NBC And ABC insist on
putting
their transparent logo on the bottom right of the screen which NEVER goes
away.

Will this burn in on my HD TV set?

If so, could there be a "class action" lawsuit to prevent this? I mean if
this can be proven to damage your screen, would not they be liable for
that
damage?

Really becoming a pet peeve of mine.

thanks

Mango



Theoretically, YES. In actual practice, I haven't seen it. I guess it
would depend on how many channels you watch, and for how many hours per
week. I'm surprised I don't have the History channel logo burned into my
set yet. :) Interesting point. I've never thought of the logo damaging
the display equipment. But it certainly could do that, just like any other
image displayed for long periods of time. -Dave

"Dave C." wrote in message ...

"Mango" wrote in message
...
The local affiliate Digital broadcasts of CBS NBC And ABC insist on
putting
their transparent logo on the bottom right of the screen which NEVER goes
away.

Will this burn in on my HD TV set?

If so, could there be a "class action" lawsuit to prevent this? I mean if
this can be proven to damage your screen, would not they be liable for
that
damage?

Really becoming a pet peeve of mine.

thanks

Mango



Theoretically, YES. In actual practice, I haven't seen it. I guess it
would depend on how many channels you watch, and for how many hours per
week. I'm surprised I don't have the History channel logo burned into my
set yet. :) Interesting point. I've never thought of the logo damaging
the display equipment. But it certainly could do that, just like any other
image displayed for long periods of time. -Dave

Most of these logos are semi-transparent, which should
prevent any burn-in (unless by some miracle, the background
behind the logo stays black or another single color for many,
many hours at one time).

The "logos" that drive me nuts are the ones that completely
replace the lower portion of the screen (e.g. SpikeTV,
when they first came on the air).

Rick

On Sat, 15 May 2004 22:10:24 -0400, "Dave C." wrote:


"Mango" wrote in message
...
The local affiliate Digital broadcasts of CBS NBC And ABC insist on
putting
their transparent logo on the bottom right of the screen which NEVER goes
away.

Will this burn in on my HD TV set?

If so, could there be a "class action" lawsuit to prevent this? I mean if
this can be proven to damage your screen, would not they be liable for
that
damage?

Really becoming a pet peeve of mine.

thanks

Mango



Theoretically, YES. In actual practice, I haven't seen it. I guess it
would depend on how many channels you watch, and for how many hours per
week. I'm surprised I don't have the History channel logo burned into my
set yet. :) Interesting point. I've never thought of the logo damaging
the display equipment. But it certainly could do that, just like any other
image displayed for long periods of time. -Dave



It will probably have bunny ears on it when it does get burned in.
No, not rabbit ears...

Burn in? Probably if watched long enough. But that might be beyond the
life of your TV which makes it a not a problem.

As far as a class action suit, it's about as good of a case as the one where
fat people are sueing McDonalds for making them overweight. Bottom line is
that you are in control over your TV set, not the TV stations.

"Mango" wrote in message
...
The local affiliate Digital broadcasts of CBS NBC And ABC insist on
putting
their transparent logo on the bottom right of the screen which NEVER goes
away.

Will this burn in on my HD TV set?

If so, could there be a "class action" lawsuit to prevent this? I mean if
this can be proven to damage your screen, would not they be liable for
that
damage?

Really becoming a pet peeve of mine.

thanks

Mango


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Will this burn in on my HD TV set?


I'm not as worried about burn in as I am annoyed at stations like FOX
KTTV-DT here in LA where they have TWO HUGE station ID's on all the time
and they are well within the main part of the frame (not at the edge).
Absolutely ridiculous!

Rick wrote:
Most of these logos are semi-transparent, which should
prevent any burn-in (unless by some miracle, the background
behind the logo stays black or another single color for many,
many hours at one time).

The "logos" that drive me nuts are the ones that completely
replace the lower portion of the screen (e.g. SpikeTV,
when they first came on the air).

Rick



If you can see the logos, they WILL burn in both CRT and plasma
technology. They may not do it as quickly as solid logos, but they will
eventually.
I don't understand why they don't move the damn things around instead of
leaving them in one spot.
Clay

Gary, I disagree. If Mcdonalds was putting a food addivte that would hurt
100% of the people...you bet they could be sued. If a tv station is
broadcasting a banner that can be shown to burn in 100% of the tv sets...you
dont think they are liable for damage?....I would think they would be and I
think that it could be proven, easily in a court of law.

Mango


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The "logos" that drive me nuts are the ones that completely
replace the lower portion of the screen (e.g. SpikeTV,
when they first came on the air).

Rick


What about the logos that go ANIMATED all over the frickin' screen in the
middle of the best part of your favorite shows? Yeah, like I really want to
watch my show with dancing dinosaurs IN THE FOREGROUND. -Dave

...
Burn in? Probably if watched long enough. But that might be beyond the
life of your TV which makes it a not a problem.

As far as a class action suit, it's about as good of a case as the one
where
fat people are sueing McDonalds for making them overweight. Bottom line
is
that you are in control over your TV set, not the TV stations.


Does that mean we can turn the bug off to prevent burn-in? -Dave

Most of these logos are semi-transparent, which should
prevent any burn-in (unless by some miracle, the background
behind the logo stays black or another single color for many,
many hours at one time).

It's not a miracle. It may be considered a curse by some. It's
called "letterboxing". The station "bug" is likely to show up in
a corner which is not covered by a wide-screen movie when viewed
on a 4:3 aspect ratio TV (that is, not HDTV), and therefore the
background for the "bug", or most of it, is black all the time. I
don't know whether the opposite issue also occurs: watching 4:3
programming transmitted on HDTV on a 16:9 monitor. The bug might
be inserted outside the area of the screen used by programming.

I think modern monitors are better than this, though. How many
(computer) monitors end up having the Windows toolbar burned into
them? (Screensavers may not help if you spend a lot of time in
front of the computer actually using it.)

Gordon L. Burditt

On Sun, 16 May 2004 10:02:53 -0500, "Mango"
wrote:

Gary, I disagree. If Mcdonalds was putting a food addivte that would hurt
100% of the people...you bet they could be sued. If a tv station is
broadcasting a banner that can be shown to burn in 100% of the tv sets...you
dont think they are liable for damage?....I would think they would be and I
think that it could be proven, easily in a court of law.

Mango



Of course, the fact that 100% of the TV sets aren't susceptible to
burn-in might hurt your cause...

Previously in misc.consumers, Bob Ward proclaimed
:

On Sun, 16 May 2004 10:02:53 -0500, "Mango"
wrote:

Gary, I disagree. If Mcdonalds was putting a food addivte that would hurt
100% of the people...you bet they could be sued. If a tv station is
broadcasting a banner that can be shown to burn in 100% of the tv sets...you
dont think they are liable for damage?....I would think they would be and I
think that it could be proven, easily in a court of law.

Mango



Of course, the fact that 100% of the TV sets aren't susceptible to
burn-in might hurt your cause...



....as are 100% of monitors manufactured in the last 10 years.




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Gordon Burditt wrote:
I think modern monitors are better than this, though. How many
(computer) monitors end up having the Windows toolbar burned into
them? (Screensavers may not help if you spend a lot of time in
front of the computer actually using it.)

But that toolbar is easily moved to any side of the screen...

Laurel


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On Sun, 16 May 2004 12:12:20 -0700, "SuperEeyore"
wrote:

Gordon Burditt wrote:
I think modern monitors are better than this, though. How many
(computer) monitors end up having the Windows toolbar burned into
them? (Screensavers may not help if you spend a lot of time in
front of the computer actually using it.)

But that toolbar is easily moved to any side of the screen...

Laurel

I'm going on six years with my current monitor - no signs of burn-in
yet.

But that toolbar is easily moved to any side of the screen...

That's pretty advanced for the majority of computer users grin
--
Don in Upstate NY

Rick wrote:
The "logos" that drive me nuts are the ones that completely
replace the lower portion of the screen (e.g. SpikeTV,
when they first came on the air).

I absolutely HATE IT when the logos cover up something in the program
I'm watching, such as the name of a person being interviewed, the name
of the book they're talking about, a phone number or web address, etc.
Can't the stations/networks at least remove their stupid logos long
enough to let us see stuff like that?!

--

Political, pro-choice, gay-friendly,
vegetarian, ballet/dance, humorous,
patriotic, and other items:
www.SmartAssProducts.com

Bob Ward wrote in message . ..


Of course, the fact that 100% of the TV sets aren't susceptible to
burn-in might hurt your cause...

Also, if burn-in does turn out to be a problem you would have more
luck suing the manufacturer of the TV set than you would suing the
broadcasters :-)

In any case, the engineers who developed the current generation of TV
sets were aware that burn-in would be a bad thing, and they have taken
steps to prevent it. Hopefully these are successful steps. (And
there are relatively simple ways to test the success, e.g., by leaving
the same image on a prototype set on 24/7 for months at a time to see
if burn-in is happening.)

In most cases, as others have pointed out, the bugs are usually
semi-transparent. Not only that, not every station's bug is in the
same place (indeed some stations don't even put them in the lower
right hand corner) and bugs go away when a commercial is on (and also
if you are playing a DVD or watching an on-demand movie...)

On Sun, 16 May 2004 12:12:20 -0700, "SuperEeyore"


Gordon Burditt wrote:
I think modern monitors are better than this, though. How many
(computer) monitors end up having the Windows toolbar burned into
them? (Screensavers may not help if you spend a lot of time in
front of the computer actually using it.)

But that toolbar is easily moved to any side of the screen...

Or you can auto-hide it.

On Sun, 16 May 2004 12:15:13 -0400, "Dave C."

The "logos" that drive me nuts are the ones that completely
replace the lower portion of the screen (e.g. SpikeTV,
when they first came on the air).

Rick


What about the logos that go ANIMATED all over the frickin' screen in the
middle of the best part of your favorite shows? Yeah, like I really want to
watch my show with dancing dinosaurs IN THE FOREGROUND. -Dave


Yes, and apparently visual distraction isn't enough for these folks -
some networks have added sound to make sure you don't miss their
animations.

No...but you can set your brightness and contrast to the proper levels to
assure you no burn in.
I promise you that, in any "class action suit" the stations will be able to
prove that sets properly set up will not show burn in.


"Dave C." wrote in message
...
...
Burn in? Probably if watched long enough. But that might be beyond the
life of your TV which makes it a not a problem.

As far as a class action suit, it's about as good of a case as the one
where
fat people are sueing McDonalds for making them overweight. Bottom line
is
that you are in control over your TV set, not the TV stations.


Does that mean we can turn the bug off to prevent burn-in? -Dave

What about the logos that go ANIMATED all over the frickin' screen in the
middle of the best part of your favorite shows? Yeah, like I really want
to
watch my show with dancing dinosaurs IN THE FOREGROUND. -Dave


Yes, and apparently visual distraction isn't enough for these folks -
some networks have added sound to make sure you don't miss their
animations.

Next step . . . do away with programming completely and run ADS for
programming 24 hours a day, interspersed with commercials of course.
:) -Dave

"Curmudgeon" wrote in message
. ..
No...but you can set your brightness and contrast to the proper levels to
assure you no burn in.
I promise you that, in any "class action suit" the stations will be able
to
prove that sets properly set up will not show burn in.


Ummmm . . . thinking of a gentle way to say this, but you don't know what
you are talking about, then. Most people don't know how to adjust
brightness and contrast correctly. I do, as I am PAID to know (among other
things) how to properly adjust brightness and contrast. BUT, you can set
brightness and contrast correctly OR NOT. Won't matter. Any image that is
visible on a TV can be burned into that TV, if that image is displayed long
enough. -Dave

I'm watching it now and they do in fact change the location and even the
size of the logo.
It it not visible in commercials. Wonder why?


Because it's OK to **** off billions of TV viewers, but NOT OK to **** of
their few advertisers. -Dave

...as are 100% of monitors manufactured in the last 10 years.

Wrong, I've seen a few lcd's with window's login burned in. and a 42"
plazma with a "network monitoring" layout nicely burnt in as well. The
latest crt's are safer but lcd and plazma start all over again with the burn
in problems of the past.

"jb" wrote in message
.. .


...as are 100% of monitors manufactured in the last 10 years.

Wrong, I've seen a few lcd's with window's login burned in. and a 42"
plazma with a "network monitoring" layout nicely burnt in as well. The
latest crt's are safer but lcd and plazma start all over again with the
burn
in problems of the past.

How difficult would it be for someone to build a device that filters these
logos out?

How difficult would it be for someone to build a device that filters these
logos out?



Not difficult at all. But warding off the resulting lawsuits would be a
real bitch. :) -Dave

Gary, I disagree. If Mcdonalds was putting a food addivte that would hurt
100% of the people...you bet they could be sued. If a tv station is
broadcasting a banner that can be shown to burn in 100% of the tv sets...you
dont think they are liable for damage?....I would think they would be and I
think that it could be proven, easily in a court of law.

No, of course they're not liable. They are within the specs of the
ATSC or NTSC broadcasting specs. If you're too stupid to change the
channel, turn the brightness down, or turn the TV off, that's your
problem. For all we know, you have your PVR on pause with the
brightness and contrasts cranked up for 24 hours a day.

The thought process by people like you in this country is incredible.
You're TOLD (most likely in your TV manual) by the manufacturer of the
TV and by people on this newsgroup that a problem might exist, and the
FIRST thing you think of it blaming it on someone else.

"Dave C." wrote in message ...
...
Burn in? Probably if watched long enough. But that might be beyond the
life of your TV which makes it a not a problem.

As far as a class action suit, it's about as good of a case as the one
where
fat people are sueing McDonalds for making them overweight. Bottom line
is
that you are in control over your TV set, not the TV stations.


Does that mean we can turn the bug off to prevent burn-in? -Dave

Yes, see that "Channel" and "OFF" button on your remote?

Does that mean we can turn the bug off to prevent burn-in? -Dave

Yes, see that "Channel" and "OFF" button on your remote?

Of course!!! Turn it off and leave it off! No burn-in problem. What a
BRILLIANT idea!!! I wonder why I didn't think of it? -Dave (come to think
of it, I'll never drive the car again . . . that way, nobody will rear-end
me ever again. Safety first!)

In article , "Dave C."
wrote:

Next step . . . do away with programming completely and run ADS for
programming 24 hours a day, interspersed with commercials of course.

You forgot the most profitable step: charge more for receiving it.

wrote in message
...
In article , "Dave C."
wrote:

Next step . . . do away with programming completely and run ADS for
programming 24 hours a day, interspersed with commercials of course.

You forgot the most profitable step: charge more for receiving it.

I didn't forget it, it's already been done, multiple times. I was just
suggesting a new way for the networks to make money, something they haven't
tried YET. :) -Dave

Oh, well, you know what I think your "thought process" is incredible. Its
ok for a station to continually post a logo on my TV set which can cause
burn in. OH, and yes I have adjusted the controls, but who in gave them the
right to do that? and why don't they do in their other channels?....Maybe
you shouldn't just follow the corporate world in lock step and maybe you
should challenge them a bit just because they exert their might to cram
something down our throats because they have the power.

Enjoy your logos and all the other stuff the clutters up the HD screen.
After all one only buys the HD screen to enjoy the picture, which, by the
way, the broadcasters are all more than too happy to screw it. But don't
question it...cus...well....that's the corp. way...and they know best...yeah
right!....

Mango


"Larry Bud" wrote in message
om...
Gary, I disagree. If Mcdonalds was putting a food addivte that would
hurt
100% of the people...you bet they could be sued. If a tv station is
broadcasting a banner that can be shown to burn in 100% of the tv
sets...you
dont think they are liable for damage?....I would think they would be
and I
think that it could be proven, easily in a court of law.

No, of course they're not liable. They are within the specs of the
ATSC or NTSC broadcasting specs. If you're too stupid to change the
channel, turn the brightness down, or turn the TV off, that's your
problem. For all we know, you have your PVR on pause with the
brightness and contrasts cranked up for 24 hours a day.

The thought process by people like you in this country is incredible.
You're TOLD (most likely in your TV manual) by the manufacturer of the
TV and by people on this newsgroup that a problem might exist, and the
FIRST thing you think of it blaming it on someone else.


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In article , "Dave C."
wrote:

wrote in message
...
In article , "Dave C."
wrote:

Next step . . . do away with programming completely and run ADS for
programming 24 hours a day, interspersed with commercials of course.

You forgot the most profitable step: charge more for receiving it.

I didn't forget it, it's already been done, multiple times. I was just
suggesting a new way for the networks to make money, something they haven't
tried YET. :) -Dave



Actually, they have--they're called home shopping networks. Pure profit,
virtually no production costs.

Actually, they have--they're called home shopping networks. Pure profit,
virtually no production costs.

Oh Yeah! Forgot about that. So that's the shape of things to come, eh?
Pretty soon all we're going to have for programming is hundreds of 24/7
shopping channels, selling televisions so you can watch shopping channels.
:) -Dave

"Dave C." wrote:

What about the logos that go ANIMATED all over the frickin' screen in the
middle of the best part of your favorite shows? Yeah, like I really want
to
watch my show with dancing dinosaurs IN THE FOREGROUND. -Dave


Yes, and apparently visual distraction isn't enough for these folks -
some networks have added sound to make sure you don't miss their
animations.

Next step . . . do away with programming completely and run ADS for
programming 24 hours a day, interspersed with commercials of course.
:)

I take it you haven't seen the TV Guide Channel.
;-)



joemooreaterolsdotcom

Mango wrote:

The local affiliate Digital broadcasts of CBS NBC And ABC insist on putting
their transparent logo on the bottom right of the screen which NEVER goes
away.

Will this burn in on my HD TV set?

Very old and some new plasma displays have burn-in. Most
new sets, even HD sets, do not.

On Mon, 17 May 2004 04:12:08 -0400, "Dave C." wrote:


"Curmudgeon" wrote in message
...
No...but you can set your brightness and contrast to the proper levels to
assure you no burn in.
I promise you that, in any "class action suit" the stations will be able
to
prove that sets properly set up will not show burn in.


Ummmm . . . thinking of a gentle way to say this, but you don't know what
you are talking about, then. Most people don't know how to adjust
brightness and contrast correctly. I do, as I am PAID to know (among other
things) how to properly adjust brightness and contrast. BUT, you can set
brightness and contrast correctly OR NOT. Won't matter. Any image that is
visible on a TV can be burned into that TV, if that image is displayed long
enough. -Dave


For some values of "TV", sure - but certainly not ALL.

Does that mean we can turn the bug off to prevent burn-in? -Dave

Yes, see that "Channel" and "OFF" button on your remote?

Of course!!! Turn it off and leave it off! No burn-in problem. What a
BRILLIANT idea!!! I wonder why I didn't think of it? -Dave (come to think
of it, I'll never drive the car again . . . that way, nobody will rear-end
me ever again. Safety first!)

Ridiculous analogy. A more astute one would be "Even though I know
it's dangerous to drive without wearing my seatbelt, I'll continue to
not wear one, and when I get injured, I'll blame the car company and
start a class action lawsuit".

I posted this once before in relation to a similar thread, but it seems
appropriate to post again here...

My stepfather has a 5 year-old Pioneer Elite 510, a fairly expensive
set, which he has also had professionally calibrated. I went over to
his house about 6 months ago and pulled off the glare screen to clean it
for him. After putting it back on, we all saw something in the lower
1/4 of the screen that I at first thought was some kind of smudge or
dirt I missed. After taking the glare screen off again to clean it, it
became evident that it was burn-in on the screen itself, bad enough to
be evident when the set is completely off. Once we new that and looked
close enough, it was fairly easy to see that it was the local news
station's "banner" that is often across the bottom of the screen,
containing their logo, name, and occasional headlines or weather info.

Now, this is a fairly expensive set, and as it has been calibrated, and
I've seen the picture myself, I'm 100% confident that the contrast or
black level settings are not overly high. And certainly my stepfather
doesn't watch this one news station 24 hours a day. Yet, this "banner"
is now permanently etched into his screen.

So anyone thinking that it's not possible, or even probable, for station
logos to cause screen burn-in are kidding themselves.