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STB crashes
I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory.
Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? David |
STB crashes
"David Butler" wrote in message
... I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory. Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? Are they cheap tat by any chance? I've had a Nokia and Sagem boxes that never gave any trouble , and since then two Humax PVRs that probably crash once a year if that. -- Alex "I laugh in the face of danger , then I hide until it goes away" |
STB crashes
On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 13:47:57 +0100, "Dr Zoidberg"
wrote: "David Butler" wrote in message ... I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory. Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? Are they cheap tat by any chance? I've had a Nokia and Sagem boxes that never gave any trouble , and since then two Humax PVRs that probably crash once a year if that. My experience is similar (with boxes of different makes). I've noticed in the last couple of days that there could be trouble ahead with my Humax 9200T PVR. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freevie...8k_mode_switch 8k mode switch Other boxes have been obsoleted by the change to "8k mode"[31] * ... * Pace DTVA-T "Wedge Adaptor". I have some of those, but they are overdue for replacement. And some boxes fail to work in mixed 2k and 8k environments: * Sharp TU-R160H * Humax 9200T * Thomson DTi 1000 -- Peter Duncanson (in uk.tech.digital-tv) |
STB crashes
"Peter Duncanson" wrote in message
... On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 13:47:57 +0100, "Dr Zoidberg" wrote: "David Butler" wrote in message .. . I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory. Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? Are they cheap tat by any chance? I've had a Nokia and Sagem boxes that never gave any trouble , and since then two Humax PVRs that probably crash once a year if that. My experience is similar (with boxes of different makes). I've noticed in the last couple of days that there could be trouble ahead with my Humax 9200T PVR. snip It's 2011 when my region switches so I'm not too concerned by potential problems for my 9200T. I've had plenty of use from it so far and will possibly have upgraded by then. -- Alex "I laugh in the face of danger , then I hide until it goes away" |
STB crashes
"Dr Zoidberg" wrote in message ... "Peter Duncanson" wrote in message ... On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 13:47:57 +0100, "Dr Zoidberg" wrote: "David Butler" wrote in message . .. I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory. Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? Are they cheap tat by any chance? I've had a Nokia and Sagem boxes that never gave any trouble , and since then two Humax PVRs that probably crash once a year if that. My experience is similar (with boxes of different makes). I've noticed in the last couple of days that there could be trouble ahead with my Humax 9200T PVR. snip It's 2011 when my region switches so I'm not too concerned by potential problems for my 9200T. I've had plenty of use from it so far and will possibly have upgraded by then. -- Alex "I laugh in the face of danger , then I hide until it goes away" I share your concerns - If I buy a TV with an integrated digital tuner - is the tuner the weak link? Is it a replaceable £20 module -or are we looking at replacing the TV? |
STB crashes
On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 19:27:34 +0100, "John"
wrote: "Dr Zoidberg" wrote in message ... "Peter Duncanson" wrote in message ... On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 13:47:57 +0100, "Dr Zoidberg" wrote: "David Butler" wrote in message .. . I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory. Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? Are they cheap tat by any chance? I've had a Nokia and Sagem boxes that never gave any trouble , and since then two Humax PVRs that probably crash once a year if that. My experience is similar (with boxes of different makes). I've noticed in the last couple of days that there could be trouble ahead with my Humax 9200T PVR. snip It's 2011 when my region switches so I'm not too concerned by potential problems for my 9200T. I've had plenty of use from it so far and will possibly have upgraded by then. -- Alex "I laugh in the face of danger , then I hide until it goes away" I share your concerns - If I buy a TV with an integrated digital tuner - is the tuner the weak link? Is it a replaceable £20 module -or are we looking at replacing the TV? The worst you are looking at is buying a Set Top Box (an external tuner) just the same as you would buy for a TV without an integrated tuner. -- Peter Duncanson (in uk.tech.digital-tv) |
STB crashes
Peter Duncanson wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 19:27:34 +0100, "John" wrote: I share your concerns - If I buy a TV with an integrated digital tuner - is the tuner the weak link? Is it a replaceable £20 module -or are we looking at replacing the TV? The worst you are looking at is buying a Set Top Box (an external tuner) just the same as you would buy for a TV without an integrated tuner. Bearing in mind that DVB-T2 is coming shortly you are probably looking at buying yourself an STB as a late Christmas present. Andy |
STB crashes
"Peter Duncanson" wrote in message ... I've noticed in the last couple of days that there could be trouble ahead with my Humax 9200T PVR. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freevie...8k_mode_switch 8k mode switch Other boxes have been obsoleted by the change to "8k mode"[31] Now I am confused. The Wiki article speaks of the national change to 8K as having already happened in August, as it is written in the past tense. The national retune day is stated as 30 Sept, so are these separate events? Clearly i have not been paying attention. - I was under the firm impression that the 2k to 8k switch would not occur until the switchover in each area, 2012 at here. I'm sure i read that somewhere... Roger R |
STB crashes
Have you got a mains supply issue perhaps?
Brian -- Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email. graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them Email: __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________ "David Butler" wrote in message ... I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory. Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? David |
STB crashes
Roger R wrote:
Now I am confused. The Wiki article speaks of the national change to 8K as having already happened in August, as it is written in the past tense. The Wiki article says that there was a nationwide change to a split NIT in August 2008, that is correct. The national retune day is stated as 30 Sept, so are these separate events? The retune day is to start the process of clearing space on Mux B for the eventual conversion of that mux to DVB-T2 working. The same day Redruth and Huntshaw Cross transmitters complete their 3 step DSO process (most other Tx have/had a 2 step process). The two events are not directly linked. I was under the firm impression that the 2k to 8k switch would not occur until the switchover in each area, 2012 at here. I'm sure i read that somewhere... That is correct. -- Mark Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply. www.paras.org.uk |
STB crashes
David Butler wrote:
I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory. Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? Yes, it is fairly typical as there is so much tat out there. Sticking with a decent brand like Sony should reduce the chances of problems, but its not unheard of them having problems too. I would not expect problems with a new Sony, but mine has had at least 1 problem in 6mths that I had to resolve with a full reset (the AV1 logo would not go away when I was using an external source). The standards are very complex with loads of options, its impossible to test for all options. Then you have broadcasters changing what parts of the standard they are using and then you have them changing things mfrs thought where standards (Eg D-Book), and then you have them introducing new ones (EG DVB-T2) when we havn't even fully changed to the intermediate ones yet. The best thing about a high end brand is that they will support the product better and you should get any problems resolved with an OAD at some point. -- Tony |
STB crashes
"Tony" wrote in message ... David Butler wrote: I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory. Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? Yes, it is fairly typical as there is so much tat out there. Sticking with a decent brand like Sony should reduce the chances of problems, but its not unheard of them having problems too. I would not expect problems with a new Sony, but mine has had at least 1 problem in 6mths that I had to resolve with a full reset (the AV1 logo would not go away when I was using an external source). The standards are very complex with loads of options, its impossible to test for all options. Then you have broadcasters changing what parts of the standard they are using and then you have them changing things mfrs thought where standards (Eg D-Book), and then you have them introducing new ones (EG DVB-T2) when we havn't even fully changed to the intermediate ones yet. The best thing about a high end brand is that they will support the product better and you should get any problems resolved with an OAD at some point. -- Tony Yes - I presume all my set top boxes are tat but never the less you would expect them to be relatively glitch free which clearly they are not. Interestingly the only (stb) device I have that works perfectly is a very small dongle that plugs into my laptop. What's OAD? I Googled it and http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/OAD comes up with 33 examples ranging from Open Abdominal Drainage to Office for Addictive Disorders. David |
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"Mark Carver" wrote in message ... Roger R wrote: Now I am confused. The Wiki article speaks of the national change to 8K as having already happened in August, as it is written in the past tense. The Wiki article says that there was a nationwide change to a split NIT in August 2008, that is correct. The national retune day is stated as 30 Sept, so are these separate events? The retune day is to start the process of clearing space on Mux B for the eventual conversion of that mux to DVB-T2 working. The same day Redruth and Huntshaw Cross transmitters complete their 3 step DSO process (most other Tx have/had a 2 step process). The two events are not directly linked. I was under the firm impression that the 2k to 8k switch would not occur until the switchover in each area, 2012 at here. I'm sure i read that somewhere... That is correct. Thanks for your clarification. AIUI now, the change that has already happened is from 2k to a mixed 2k and 8k environment, the change to 8k mode alone happening at DSO day. (I don't understand 2k-8k but it doesn't matter here) I was confused by difference between the Wiki term 'obsoleted' and 'no longer works'. Obsoleted appears to mean something like 'still works for the present but won't after DSO'. Something like the expression 'having its card marked', though i think it a somewhat unusual use of the pp of obsolete. Anyway for info of those who read, my Pace DTR 735 still function ok this morning here in Rowridge area. Roger R |
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Roger R wrote:
AIUI now, the change that has already happened is from 2k to a mixed 2k and 8k environment, the change to 8k mode alone happening at DSO day. (I don't understand 2k-8k but it doesn't matter here) Yes, the 2k/8k mixed currency only occurs during the month long DSO process at each transmitter, when PSB 1 is there at 8k/64QAM but the remaining muxes are still at low power using 2k, Anyway for info of those who read, my Pace DTR 735 still function ok this morning here in Rowridge area. And will (as long as Ofcom don't attempt any more bright ideas) until March 2012, when Rowridge/Midhurst/Hannington have their DSO. |
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On Mon, 17 Aug 2009 10:34:32 +0100, "David Butler"
wrote: What's OAD? I Googled it and http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/OAD comes up with 33 examples ranging from Open Abdominal Drainage to Office for Addictive Disorders. It's the one that isn't in that list: Over the Air Download. -- Peter Duncanson (in uk.tech.digital-tv) |
STB crashes
"Dr Zoidberg" wrote in message ... "David Butler" wrote in message ... I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory. Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? Are they cheap tat by any chance? I've had a Nokia and Sagem boxes that never gave any trouble , and since then two Humax PVRs that probably crash once a year if that. You're lucky. Mine has hung 5 times since I bought it last November. Two times whilst I was away meaning that lost half my scheduled recordings (that is, I lost the ones it had yet to record) tim |
STB crashes
Peter Duncanson wrote:
(snip) My experience is similar (with boxes of different makes). I've noticed in the last couple of days that there could be trouble ahead with my Humax 9200T PVR. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freevie...8k_mode_switch 8k mode switch Other boxes have been obsoleted by the change to "8k mode"[31] * ... * Pace DTVA-T "Wedge Adaptor". I have some of those, but they are overdue for replacement. And some boxes fail to work in mixed 2k and 8k environments: * Sharp TU-R160H * Humax 9200T * Thomson DTi 1000 There was no ref for the Humax 9200T failing to work in mixed 2k and 8k. Where did this info come from? -- Jeff |
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On Mon, 17 Aug 2009 20:55:23 +0100, "Jeff Layman"
wrote: Peter Duncanson wrote: (snip) My experience is similar (with boxes of different makes). I've noticed in the last couple of days that there could be trouble ahead with my Humax 9200T PVR. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freevie...8k_mode_switch 8k mode switch Other boxes have been obsoleted by the change to "8k mode"[31] * ... * Pace DTVA-T "Wedge Adaptor". I have some of those, but they are overdue for replacement. And some boxes fail to work in mixed 2k and 8k environments: * Sharp TU-R160H * Humax 9200T * Thomson DTi 1000 There was no ref for the Humax 9200T failing to work in mixed 2k and 8k. Where did this info come from? I don't know where the Wikipedia author(s) got it from. It may have come from this discussion about problems people were seeing during the switchover on the Selkirk transmitter. http://www.ukfree.tv/txdetail.php?a=NT500294&PGSTART=0 Part of the discussion is: I have a Sony Bravia HD Ready Digital TV and Sharp Digital TV Recorder Model TU-R160HA and had a 42 element Digital aerial installed in April. Reception on all channels up until switchover was very good. After switchover the only good channels are BBC, the rest either will not tune in (ITV, CH4) and those that will tune stutter and freeze. I have retuned both TV and Recorder time after time but with the same results. I live about 1 mile from the Selkirk transmitter. It is driving me mad! Can anyone help, is there anything that I can do to get reception back to normal. Thanks Posted by Jim Hart (3 posts) on Saturday 8th of November 2008 12:24:53 PM GB ------------------------------ Jim Hart: I too have a Sharp TU-R160H receiver. However I have lost all eleven BBC programs, but I still have the rest. I used to have all 93 channels. Posted by Patrick Stevens (14 posts) on Saturday 8th of November 2008 12:43:18 PM GB ------------------------------ Jim Hart: The most obvious answer is probably to wait until the 20th, when all the services will be in the new configuration. However, I suppose that the good news is that the BBC channels in 64QAM with 8k carriers IS working for you. I presume that your aerial outside and you are not using a booster. Posted by Briantist (13,286 posts) on Saturday 8th of November 2008 12:58:32 PM GB ------------------------------ Patrick Stevens: I suppose that the good news for you is that the Sharp TU-R160H will work in the new mode. I wonder if it just a problem with mixed 2k and 8k? Posted by Briantist (13,286 posts) on Saturday 8th of November 2008 12:59:37 PM GB A bit technical for me what is meant by "mixed 2K and 8K"? My aerial is outside and I have no signal booster. Posted by Jim Hart (3 posts) on Saturday 8th of November 2008 1:47:36 PM GB ------------------------------ Briantist, I have a Humax 9200T with latest firmware and a Thomson DTi 1000 both with the same problem, no BBC channels, very weak signals. I also live near Kelso and have the same problems as Patrick Stevens. I think they should stop and rethink the changeover if this is the result of the very first one! Posted by JustinG (3 posts) on Saturday 8th of November 2008 5:54:25 PM GB ------------------------------ Briantist: Like Jim Hart, I think I will wait now untill the 20th and see if everything comes back. My two bedroom set-top boxes get all the channels, I am beginning to suspect my lounge unit can do either 2k or 8k, but not both, in one search. Pat Stevens Posted by Patrick Stevens (14 posts) on Sunday 9th of November 2008 11:54:29 AM GB ------------------------------ David D: You may have to wait until the 20th for everything to return to normal. Posted by Briantist (13,286 posts) on Monday 10th of November 2008 8:56:02 AM GB ------------------------------ Jim Hart: The "2k" and "8k" modes are part of the options that can be used for the COFDM transmissions that digital TV uses. It refers to the "number of carriers". Basically, "8k" mode is more resilient to interference than the "2k" mode, but does not effect anything else. Sadly, some very old boxes do not support the "8k" mode... Posted by Briantist (13,286 posts) on Monday 10th of November 2008 8:58:28 AM GB ------------------------------ JustinG: It is looking like the Humax 9200T does not like the mixture of 2k and 8k modes from the transmitter at the moment. Try doing a manual tune on C62 to get the BBC channels for the next few weeks, and everything should be OK after that. This is the first time an existing Freeview transmitter has been switched over, so there are bound to be a few problems! Posted by Briantist (13,286 posts) on Monday 10th of November 2008 9:08:55 AM GB -- Peter Duncanson (in uk.tech.digital-tv) |
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On Mon, 17 Aug 2009 22:18:03 +0100, Peter Duncanson
wrote: I wonder if it just a problem with mixed 2k and 8k? Posted by Briantist (13,286 posts) on Saturday 8th of November 2008 12:59:37 PM GB Insert: ------------------------------ A bit technical for me what is meant by "mixed 2K and 8K"? My aerial is outside and I have no signal booster. Posted by Jim Hart (3 posts) on Saturday 8th of November 2008 1:47:36 PM GB ------------------------------ -- Peter Duncanson (in uk.tech.digital-tv) |
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Peter Duncanson wrote:
On Mon, 17 Aug 2009 22:18:03 +0100, Peter Duncanson wrote: I wonder if it just a problem with mixed 2k and 8k? Posted by Briantist (13,286 posts) on Saturday 8th of November 2008 12:59:37 PM GB Insert: ------------------------------ A bit technical for me what is meant by "mixed 2K and 8K"? My aerial is outside and I have no signal booster. Posted by Jim Hart (3 posts) on Saturday 8th of November 2008 1:47:36 PM GB ------------------------------ Thanks for the info. -- Jeff |
STB crashes
"Mike Henry" wrote in message ... I think Sony is a particularly bad example to use. They have left a trail of destruction and failure to release updates: 19 2k-only IDTVs, a 2k-only STB, and 21 split-NIT-failing IDTVs. Sony have been extremely arrogant with their attitude and not fixing the problems, pretending that the spec changed when it did NOT (in the case of the Split NIT). They release upgrades for 1-2 years max, then they drop support for your model like a stone and hide behind pathetic excuses. What you describe is less than consumers would expect of Sony's reputation. They can only get away with such indifference for only so long before their brand becomes badly damaged. Sony now offers a 3 yr guarantee (only) on its Bravia model television sets. Sony's 1 yr standard guarantee compared to Lidl's 3 yrs on comparable products speaks volumes about the confidence Sony has in its products. But then Sony has to use its resources to prop up its independent dealer network at the expense of providing a decent support service for those who buy elsewhere. Roger R |
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Mike Henry wrote:
In , "Roger R" wrote: "Mike Henry" wrote in message ... I think Sony is a particularly bad example to use. They have left a trail of destruction and failure to release updates: 19 2k-only IDTVs, a 2k-only STB, and 21 split-NIT-failing IDTVs. Sony have been extremely arrogant with their attitude and not fixing the problems, pretending that the spec changed when it did NOT (in the case of the Split NIT). They release upgrades for 1-2 years max, then they drop support for your model like a stone and hide behind pathetic excuses. What you describe is less than consumers would expect of Sony's reputation. They can only get away with such indifference for only so long before their brand becomes badly damaged. Their brand is toast in this household, doubly so after their behaviour in the period following the "root kit" scandal. I have three Sony CRT sets, their replacements will definately not be Sony. -- ^..^ This is Kitty. Copy and paste Kitty into your signature to help her wipe out Bunny's world domination. |
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In message , Adrian
wrote I have three Sony CRT sets, their replacements will definately not be Sony. I'm not impressed by the two Sony products that I own. These days I'm sure they are trading on their trade name only without having the quality products to back it up. The name seems to be tied into premium prices - although the Blu-ray player that I purchased was very heavily discounted. -- Alan news2009 {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk |
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Chris Hogg wrote:
I too am a little confused. I have a Humax 9200T, but it seems to be working OK, despite our having gone through DSO this summer. But we receive from a local booster transmitter (Praa Sands in west Cornwall, a satellite to Redruth) which didn't transmit any digital signals before DSO, either 2k or 8k. Can I assume that it's now transmitting only 8k and that the mixed 2k/8k environment problem is actually a non-problem as far as I'm concerned, or is there potential 8k trouble in the offing (eg at the end of September or when DVB-T2 comes along)? You're OK, because Praa Sands is (and will only be) transmitting three PSB muxes, all of which are at 8k. However there's still a third stage of DSO to happen at Redruth, where currently the three PSB muxes are at 8k, but the three COMs are still running at low power and 2k. It's not until Sept 30th when Redruth goes 8k on all six muxes. Don't forget though that in the South West PSB 3 converts to DVB-T2 early next year, for the launch of HD services, and *all* existing receivers will lose the ability to receive the mux. -- Mark Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply. www.paras.org.uk |
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Mark Carver wrote:
Don't forget though that in the South West PSB 3 converts to DVB-T2 early next year, for the launch of HD services, and *all* existing receivers will lose the ability to receive the mux. I thought it was PSB2 that was going to carry DVB-T2, I must have got it wrong. -- ^..^ This is Kitty. Copy and paste Kitty into your signature to help her wipe out Bunny's world domination. |
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Adrian wrote:
Mark Carver wrote: Don't forget though that in the South West PSB 3 converts to DVB-T2 early next year, for the launch of HD services, and *all* existing receivers will lose the ability to receive the mux. I thought it was PSB2 that was going to carry DVB-T2, I must have got it wrong. Well, I've always gone by:- PSB 1 being the post DSO version of Mux 1 (BBC 1/2/3 News 24) PSB 2 being the post DSO version of Mux 2 (ITV/C4 etc) PSB 3 being the post DSO version of Mux B (BBC 4, Parly, BBCi etc) But perhaps 2 and 3 are the other way round ? Anyway for the avoidance of doubt, it's the post DSO version of Mux B that is converting to T2. |
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On Fri, 21 Aug 2009 15:44:20 +0100, Mark Carver
wrote: PSB 1 being the post DSO version of Mux 1 (BBC 1/2/3 News 24) PSB 2 being the post DSO version of Mux 2 (ITV/C4 etc) PSB 3 being the post DSO version of Mux B (BBC 4, Parly, BBCi etc) I agree ... Pre DSO: Mux1 Mux 2 Mux A Mux B Mux C Mux D Post DSO: PSB1 PSB2 COMA PSB3 COMB COMC Or: BBC A D3&4 SDN BBC B Arq A Arq B But perhaps 2 and 3 are the other way round ? I don't think so. ====================================== Please always reply to news group as the email address in this post's header does not exist. Alternatively, use one of the contact addresses at: http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/JavaJive.html http://www.macfh.co.uk/Macfarlane/Macfarlane.html |
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Mike Henry wrote:
In , Tony wrote: Yes, it is fairly typical as there is so much tat out there. Sticking with a decent brand like Sony should reduce the chances of problems, but its not unheard of them having problems too. I would not expect problems with a new Sony, but mine has had at least 1 problem in 6mths that I had to resolve with a full reset (the AV1 logo would not go away when I was using an external source). The standards are very complex with loads of options, its impossible to test for all options. Nevertheless, there's no excuses for not *implementing* whole chunks of a published standard just because the *current broadcasts* aren't using it. None whatsoever. Testing is a different matter. It is an excuse and a well used one. Yes one software company I know used a 'current transmission' methodology for implementation in the past, but pretty much everyone is limited to current transmission test methodology, in order to confirm their interpretation of the standards. I agree its bad either way but the problem is the over complex standards, not the (decent) companies implementing it. Then you have broadcasters changing what parts of the standard they are using and then you have them changing things mfrs thought where standards (Eg D-Book), and then you have them introducing new ones (EG DVB-T2) when we havn't even fully changed to the intermediate ones yet. The best thing about a high end brand is that they will support the product better and you should get any problems resolved with an OAD at some point. I think Sony is a particularly bad example to use. They have left a trail of destruction and failure to release updates: 19 2k-only IDTVs, a 2k-only STB, and 21 split-NIT-failing IDTVs. Sony have been extremely arrogant with their attitude and not fixing the problems, pretending that the spec changed when it did NOT (in the case of the Split NIT). They release upgrades for 1-2 years max, then they drop support for your model like a stone and hide behind pathetic excuses. Meanwhile as Mark Carver wrote yesterday - "it's worth noting that the 1998 designed On Digital boxes are split NIT compliant, so there's no excuse for anyone else's not to be." I was surprised to see alot of Sony's in the DSO non-compliance list, but there are plenty of Panys too, really its just a list of honest manufacturers! Do you see any Nikai or Digihome in there? They must be fantastic. I had a CRT before and swear by it on picture quality, particularly RGB. The split NIT thing did put the cat amoungst the pigeons, and yes legally the mfrs are responsible, however I still 100% blame the broadcasters for the standard complexity, also the body (can't remember who) that decided to change to split NITs and knowingly kill loads of receivers. And there is no need for split NITs they are mostly meaningless, noone is using all this extra information, and they keep changing the format of it every few years, if they did us it the boxes would stop working!!! Its a complete joke. -- Tony |
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Chris Hogg wrote:
OK, thanks. So it's yet another re-tune next year then! Get used to them, like correspondence from the Inland Revenue, they look like becoming a part of life. -- Mark Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply. www.paras.org.uk |
STB crashes
On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 20:02:12 +0100, Peter Duncanson
wrote: On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 19:27:34 +0100, "John" wrote: "Dr Zoidberg" wrote in message ... "Peter Duncanson" wrote in message ... On Sun, 16 Aug 2009 13:47:57 +0100, "Dr Zoidberg" wrote: "David Butler" wrote in message . .. I have a number of set top boxes - none of them entirely satisfactory. Two often crash when changing channels, another has lip synch issues after being on for a few minutes and another has a mind of its own - deciding to completely trip out to standby whenever it feels like it. My question is this. Do integrated digital TV's have similar issues or is it just (older) set top boxes? Are they cheap tat by any chance? I've had a Nokia and Sagem boxes that never gave any trouble , and since then two Humax PVRs that probably crash once a year if that. My experience is similar (with boxes of different makes). I've noticed in the last couple of days that there could be trouble ahead with my Humax 9200T PVR. snip It's 2011 when my region switches so I'm not too concerned by potential problems for my 9200T. I've had plenty of use from it so far and will possibly have upgraded by then. -- Alex "I laugh in the face of danger , then I hide until it goes away" I share your concerns - If I buy a TV with an integrated digital tuner - is the tuner the weak link? Is it a replaceable £20 module -or are we looking at replacing the TV? The worst you are looking at is buying a Set Top Box (an external tuner) just the same as you would buy for a TV without an integrated tuner. Not necessarily. I had a Philips IDTV crash completely and often when watching analogue TV. I assume it was due to poor freeview signal but I can't be sure. -- (\__/) M. (='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and (")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking most articles posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by everyone you will need use a different method of posting. [Reply-to address valid until it is spammed.] |
STB crashes
On 21 Aug., 19:00, Tony wrote:
The standards are very complex with loads of options, its impossible to test for all options. Nevertheless, there's no excuses for not *implementing* whole chunks of a published standard just because the *current broadcasts* aren't using it. None whatsoever. Testing is a different matter. It is an excuse and a well used one. Yes one software company I know used a 'current transmission' methodology for implementation in the past, but pretty much everyone is limited to current transmission test methodology, in order to confirm their interpretation of the standards. I agree its bad either way but the problem is the over complex standards, not the (decent) companies implementing it. No it is not - The current standard is complex but not very complex. The NIT problem is the result of not answering a simple question any programmer should ask every time he/she uses a table: "What will i do when my table is full ?" And the answer is well described in the standards. This is nothing but bad coding standards and lack of normal quality control. You may even say - It doesn't matter if it works but it MUST follow the standards. (it will also work then) Then you have broadcasters changing what parts of the standard they are using and then you have them changing things mfrs thought where standards (Eg D-Book) Bull. The original standard had both the 8k mode and the NIT table extension included and NOT under the word 'optional'. Ofcom* had even written early on and informed industry that they wanted to change away from the 2k mode. new ones (EG DVB-T2) when we havn't even fully changed to the intermediate ones yet. You cannot avoid change - it is a result of living in the modern world - but by accepting it, you may be able to mitigate its less pleasant sides. The split NIT thing did put the cat amongst the pigeons, and yes legally the mfrs are responsible, however I still 100% blame the broadcasters for the standard complexity, also the body (can't remember who) that decided to change to split NITs and knowingly kill loads of receivers. The NIT was broken as more channels and transmitters were added to the network - needing more space in the NIT/SI tables. They (DMOL I think) had to do something. It may be that they could have postponed it for some weeks or months, but surely not forever. Lars :) |
STB crashes
Mike Henry wrote:
In , "Roger R" wrote: What you describe is less than consumers would expect of Sony's reputation. They can only get away with such indifference for only so long before their brand becomes badly damaged. Their brand is toast in this household, doubly so after their behaviour in the period following the "root kit" scandal. Well, yesterday my 22 month old Sony Bravia LCD suddenly lost one horizontal row of pixels, so now about an inch down from the top of the screen is a nice black line. The only advantage is that it 'crosses out' the DOGs ! Permission to say 'cock' ? -- Mark Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply. www.paras.org.uk |
STB crashes
Mark Carver wrote:
Mike Henry wrote: In , "Roger R" wrote: What you describe is less than consumers would expect of Sony's reputation. They can only get away with such indifference for only so long before their brand becomes badly damaged. Their brand is toast in this household, doubly so after their behaviour in the period following the "root kit" scandal. Well, yesterday my 22 month old Sony Bravia LCD suddenly lost one horizontal row of pixels, so now about an inch down from the top of the screen is a nice black line. The only advantage is that it 'crosses out' the DOGs ! Permission to say 'cock' ? So complain to the retailer, if they refuse to do anything go to Trading Standards. A fault appearing in just 22 months is totally unacceptable. -- ^..^ This is Kitty. Copy and paste Kitty into your signature to help her wipe out Bunny's world domination. |
STB crashes
Adrian wrote:
So complain to the retailer, if they refuse to do anything go to Trading Standards. A fault appearing in just 22 months is totally unacceptable. I didn't purchase it from a retailer, but all I can say is I'm actively pursuing the matter via internal e-mails ;-) |
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