TiVo announces new pricing plans
 

I might be giving TiVo too much credit but reading the press release I
got the impression that the commitment and higher fee was effectively a
way of buying the TiVo on an installment plan. Hopefully once the
commitment is up the service fee will drop back to the normal $13.

I would like to believe that too, but I doubt that is the case. I get
the impression that they want to go to a service only model, where there
is never any hardware cost.

The reason I think this may be the case is because in the press
release they seem to be making a point of listing the new prices as
being for a bundle of the TiVo box and service while making separate
reference for to new prepayment options for boxes bought through
retail channels. If this was a new uniform pricing policy it would
have made sense to include it in the same press release. The mention
of retail sales also suggests that this may not be a universal change
in fees. How many people would go choose to pay retail, submit a
rebate, and still pay the high fee instead of just requesting a TiVo
shipped directly to them with no rebate hoops to jump through?

I totally agree with this observation, I'm not sure how Tivo plans to
continue to sell through the retail channel. Will you just pick up the
box for free and prepay for a 1, 2, or 3 year term of service? That
would seem odd to me.

Finally, if the higher price does continue after your commitment is up
then I suspect many people will simply ask TiVo for a brand new,
probably higher capacity, DVR and then use MRV to transfer everything
over before canceling service on the old unit. That way you would
at least have a new Tivo.

Yes, it would seem that the new service-only model would require Tivo to
upgrade boxes as requested after anyone's term of service is up. This
particular press release seemed to be only referring to 80 hr S2's
directly, so maybe other models would have higher monthly (or annual) fees.

Also, won't this change in direct sales policy require TiVo to extend
their warranty on the longer commitments? If you have a three year
service commitment and your box breaks after the first year I think
most people would be highly annoyed to be told that they either had to
pay the repair cost their self or keep paying the service fee for two
more years on a door stop.

I would think that you are correct here. I think Tivo will have to
basically replace any hardware for free as long as the subscriber has an
active subscription. This raises some issues for those of us who like
to hack our boxes as well.

You make some good points, this change impacts a lot of facets of TiVo's
business model. One thing I think I can predict is that the value of
lifetime subbed boxes is about to go way up.

Randy S.

TiVo announces new pricing plans
 

Jeff Rife wrote:
Mike Hunt ) wrote in alt.video.ptv.tivo:

So they've quietly just put the screws to ALL S2 owners that don't have
a lifetime sub.

The new fee structure only impacts new boxes. All current S2 owners won't
see an increase in their bill. So, it's not quite as bad as you make it
sound.


Except that somebody that bought an S2 two months ago and is month-to-
month to see if its worth it will have to make a decision *right now* if
it is good enough to be worth paying for lifetime. Before this
announcement, they could basically dither about it forever.


I just converted my in-laws box to lifetime *today* due to this
announcement. They've only had it 3 months, but it would be crazy not
to convert it, not only for the long term savings, but also because the
value of lifetime subbed boxes is probably going to skyrocket.

I wasn't going to lifetime sub mine because I figured I was going to
replace it with an S3 when they came out (so I wouldn't have reached the
break-even point), but now it doesn't make sense not to, since I'll
probably want to resell it, and a non-lifetime subbed S2 will be
basically worthless.

Randy S.

TiVo announces new pricing plans
 

I just checked on tivocommunity and some of the TiVo reps offered
some clarifications. These mainly come from this thread:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...d.php?t=290514

"Randy S." writes:

I might be giving TiVo too much credit but reading the press release I
got the impression that the commitment and higher fee was effectively a
way of buying the TiVo on an installment plan. Hopefully once the
commitment is up the service fee will drop back to the normal $13.

I would like to believe that too, but I doubt that is the case. I get
the impression that they want to go to a service only model, where
there is never any hardware cost.

According to TiVoOpsMgr after your initial commitment is up you will
be able to call and convert to the then current service only pricing,
evidently with a new one year commitment on that service. If you do
not call you will continue to be billed at the higher rate. While in
your initial commitment from a bundled TiVo the unit will not qualify
for the multi subscription discount but the discount will be available
once the initial commitment is up. Evidently it will qualify any other
non bundled units you might own for the discount though.He has not
mentioned any increase in the current $12.95 monthly rate at this time
for the normal service without a TiVo included. They will be
announcing new discounted longer term prepay plans for service only
soon.

The reason I think this may be the case is because in the press
release they seem to be making a point of listing the new prices as
being for a bundle of the TiVo box and service while making separate
reference for to new prepayment options for boxes bought through
retail channels. If this was a new uniform pricing policy it would
have made sense to include it in the same press release. The mention
of retail sales also suggests that this may not be a universal change
in fees. How many people would go choose to pay retail, submit a
rebate, and still pay the high fee instead of just requesting a TiVo
shipped directly to them with no rebate hoops to jump through?

I totally agree with this observation, I'm not sure how Tivo plans to
continue to sell through the retail channel. Will you just pick up
the box for free and prepay for a 1, 2, or 3 year term of service?
That would seem odd to me.

Evidently the retail boxes will be sold in the same fashion as they
are now with only a 1 year minimum service commitment at the regular
service only rate. I would guess that this bundle offering does mark
the end or at least reduction in the large rebates.


Also, won't this change in direct sales policy require TiVo to extend
their warranty on the longer commitments? If you have a three year
service commitment and your box breaks after the first year I think
most people would be highly annoyed to be told that they either had to
pay the repair cost their self or keep paying the service fee for two
more years on a door stop.

I would think that you are correct here. I think Tivo will have to
basically replace any hardware for free as long as the subscriber has
an active subscription. This raises some issues for those of us who
like to hack our boxes as well.

In this thread:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb....php?p=3842747
TiVoOpsMgr indicates that the warranty terms are unchanged but:

"If your DVR malfunctions during your service commitment, we will be
offering DVR warranty replacement for a reasonable fee even if it is
out of warranty."

He evidently can't give any further details until it is officially announced.

TiVo announces new pricing plans
 

According to TiVoOpsMgr after your initial commitment is up you will
be able to call and convert to the then current service only pricing,
evidently with a new one year commitment on that service. If you do
not call you will continue to be billed at the higher rate. While in
your initial commitment from a bundled TiVo the unit will not qualify
for the multi subscription discount but the discount will be available
once the initial commitment is up. Evidently it will qualify any other
non bundled units you might own for the discount though.He has not
mentioned any increase in the current $12.95 monthly rate at this time
for the normal service without a TiVo included. They will be
announcing new discounted longer term prepay plans for service only
soon.

Ok, that seems more reasonable, it sounds like they are amortizing the
hardware cost over the first 1, 2, or 3 years.


Evidently the retail boxes will be sold in the same fashion as they
are now with only a 1 year minimum service commitment at the regular
service only rate. I would guess that this bundle offering does mark
the end or at least reduction in the large rebates.

Ok, so then the 12.99 rate *is* still available through retail channels,
the only *real* changes are the additional pricing options and the end
of lifetime subs.

In this thread:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb....php?p=3842747
TiVoOpsMgr indicates that the warranty terms are unchanged but:

"If your DVR malfunctions during your service commitment, we will be
offering DVR warranty replacement for a reasonable fee even if it is
out of warranty."

He evidently can't give any further details until it is officially announced.

Hmm, I sense trouble here. If someone's Tivo malfunctions in the second
year of a 2 or 3 year commitment *and* a person is faced with a choice
of *paying* to fix it or paying for a sub on a broken device, I'd
imagine they will be upset, regardless of how "reasonable" the fee is.

This whole plan just sounds too complex to me. Sub rates varying all
over the map, commitments of 1 - 3 years, units under committed plans
but not covered under warranty? I think they're running a very real
risk of confusing the crap out of people. The reality is that people
faced with lots of choices tend to make none. Simple is best, I
would've thought Tivo of all companies would know better. I could
understand if they went to a sub only model (no hardware costs), though
I might not have liked it, but this mix and match model is just too much.

Maybe it'll be more straightforward when it gets officially announced,
but I'm glad I've got lifetime subs on mine already.

Randy S.

TiVo announces new pricing plans
 

On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 18:14:07 +0000, Seth wrote:

"Wes Newell" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 12:58:24 +0000, Seth wrote:

"Wes Newell" wrote in message
Not likely. And if
the sub price is going to be the same, I'll garauntee there will be an
up
front cost for the hardware. I left that at $500, for a total of $969
for
3 years of service. And I bet that's lower than it will actually be. The
cost to make the S3 is going to be a lot more than the S2. It wouldn't
suprise me to see an $800 or more sticker price plus the sub fee. Yeah,
Tivo loves you.:-)

See, this is pretty positive proof that you will try your best to spin
thins
to suit your argument.

What this is, is positive proof that I'm not blinded by Tivo faith and
bias like you are. While other people in the group have estimated base
prices of $1K you have said nothing. And I leave it at $500 and you call
me a spin doctor. It's MY best guess. Actually I think it's going to lot
higher but I kept it low just so people like you wouldn't bitch. I can
that was a waste of time and effort now. you can't seriously believe
yourself I hope. No one else does.

No, it's proof poitive that you're pulling number out of your ass. You are
documenting the un-documentable.

You want me to lower it. Where are YOU pulling the numbers from? Your
boyfriends ass?

Either make changes that match the press release, or
do nothing as the press release doesn't say anything specifically
about the HD unit. To make up your own numbers is dishonest and
ridiculous.

You're an idiot if you think this. It's clearly stated as a guess.
People here keep bitching and I'll raise it to what I really think
it'll be. $995 base plus sub. Don't like it tough.

And here we go with the name calling. I have yet to call you names, yet
you need to do that as if it was same way to prove a point.

I call them like I see them. Don't like that either, tough.

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TiVo announces new pricing plans
 

On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 18:12:47 +0000, Bob wrote:


"Dr. Personality" wrote in message
...
In article , Bob
wrote:

Regardless, if you've paid for the equipment, $20 a month is a bit
steep.


Be careful there Doc, don't question, criticize or express an opinion here
that the Tivo Nazis don't like.

They'll get you if you don't watch out. They work in tandem.

Actually there's more than 2 of them. But you hit the nail on the head.
And they're pretty good at twisting facts too.

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TiVo announces new pricing plans
 

On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 18:24:53 +0000, Mike Hunt wrote:

On 2006-03-09, Bob wrote:

"Dr. Personality" wrote in message
...
In article , Bob
wrote:

Regardless, if you've paid for the equipment, $20 a month is a bit
steep.


Be careful there Doc, don't question, criticize or express an opinion here
that the Tivo Nazis don't like.

I think most here will agree that $20/month is a bit steep. I liked the
idea of giving one month free to hook people, but they still won't want to
get a box that costs $20/month. Of course, the $20 is the worst case with
the best being $13/month.

No, the best is $16.95 per month. you can't get $13 per month. It's $469
prepaid for 3 years. By the time you compute the interest lost over that 3
year period, it's more than $13 per month.

People are currently paying $13/month plus
money down for the box so obviously people will pay $13/month with no
money down.

No money down? What do call the $469 you have to pay up front?:-)
And That's only for 3 years. You got lifetime before for a total of $368.
Yep. Hell of a deal.:-)
I know you guys are good with th BS, but i don't think there's a way in
hell, you'll fool people with this.:-)

The question becomes, how much over $13/month will people
pay instead of paying money down for the box. TiVo has a number of
price points between $13 and $20 - we'll see how it goes. I was always
a fan of the lifetime so I'm bummed that's going away but I do think few
got the lifetime and TiVo doesn't like it as much since on paper, it
doesn't look like guaranteed money like the subscription fees do.

How would you know what Tivo likes? About all I know that they like is
getting into their customers wallets.:-)

They'll get you if you don't watch out. They work in tandem.

Contrary to this belief, there isn't a conspiracy here.

Right, and no Tivo employee has ever lied to the group either.:-)

--
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TiVo announces new pricing plans
 

Chris Adams wrote:

I have 4 TVs at home, 3 bought in the last 5 years, and none of them get
any program data. My father has a TV that does, and the data is mostly
garbage (incorrect information is common and a number of channels with
no data).

I'll second that. Before I got my HR10-250, I was using a Samsung SIR-T151
ATSC tuner to feed my widescreen TV. It had a Guide feature, but 9 times
out of 10 it had no data. (San Francisco Bay Area). Typical data did show
up was just "Movie"; no name of movie, no list of stars, no synopsis.

-Joe

TiVo announces new pricing plans
 

On 2006-03-10, Wes Newell wrote:

*sigh*

On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 18:24:53 +0000, Mike Hunt wrote:

I think most here will agree that $20/month is a bit steep. I liked the
idea of giving one month free to hook people, but they still won't want to
get a box that costs $20/month. Of course, the $20 is the worst case with
the best being $13/month.

No, the best is $16.95 per month. you can't get $13 per month. It's $469
prepaid for 3 years. By the time you compute the interest lost over that 3
year period, it's more than $13 per month.

Whatever Wes. This doesn't even deserve a response it's so ridiculous.

People are currently paying $13/month plus
money down for the box so obviously people will pay $13/month with no
money down.

No money down? What do call the $469 you have to pay up front?:-)

Huh? Oh, you thought that OR was an AND. Let me help you with this Wes -
the new scheme has people paying $x a month XOR $y prepaid - not $x AND
$y. So, if you decide to pay $16.95 a month, there is NO money down.

And That's only for 3 years. You got lifetime before for a total of $368.

I agree - lifetime is the way to go. If anyone has an SA without a
lifetime, you best go buy one ASAP.

I know you guys are good with th BS, but i don't think there's a way in
hell, you'll fool people with this.:-)

I don't think anyone here is selling it as a good thing for users, but
naturally you were confused by it. We don't plan to fool people, just
help fools who get confused.

The question becomes, how much over $13/month will people
pay instead of paying money down for the box. TiVo has a number of
price points between $13 and $20 - we'll see how it goes. I was always
a fan of the lifetime so I'm bummed that's going away but I do think few
got the lifetime and TiVo doesn't like it as much since on paper, it
doesn't look like guaranteed money like the subscription fees do.

How would you know what Tivo likes?

I guess I was making the assumption that the TiVo corporation makes their
own decisions and there isn't some shadow group controlling them. I
figure they would do things they like and not do things they don't like.
If they liked lifetime subs, they would keep them around instead of giving
them the axe.

About all I know that they like is getting into their customers
wallets.:-)

Well, they are a business out to make money. Do you want them to give
everything away?

Contrary to this belief, there isn't a conspiracy here.

Right, and no Tivo employee has ever lied to the group either.:-)

Give it a rest Wes.

--
This is my .sig

TiVo announces new pricing plans
 

On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 19:12:05 +0000, Bob wrote:


You just don't get it.

Now don't you start on me.

I wasn't. BTW, by now you should know the $20 a month fee is is an
optional way of purchasing a new unit. The stndard monthly fee of $12.95 a
month hasn't changed. If you buy the unit outright, you get service for
$12.95 per month. But the Lifetime sub is dead in about a week.

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