Daylight savings change in 2007
 

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

On Thu, 3 Nov 2005 20:18:46 +0000 (UTC), MegaZone wrote:

It is all artificial anyway, I'd rather seen them dump the whole thing
and just keep the clocks the same all year. The system was originally
mainly for farming and keeping daylight during the work day, which has
little bearing on the vast majority of the modern world.

News flash: farmers don't work by the clock, they work by daylight.
Whoever told you it was about farmers was wrong. The cows don't care
that the clock shifted an hour, the get milked when they need to.

Hell, the same thing with the US school year - it was designed around
the planting and harvesting seasons when the kids would be out of
school, helping out on the farm. That could use an overhaul to bring
us to the level of most of the rest of the world too.

You are aware that farms do still exist, right? I mean, you eat and
everything; where do you think the food comes from?

Political crap, all of it.

There's crap involved, that's for sure.

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

Dave Hinz shaped the electrons to say:
You are aware that farms do still exist, right? I mean, you eat and
everything; where do you think the food comes from?

So what? The rest of the world doesn't screw up the entire
educational system to handle what is a very small minority. US
students spend less time in school than most of the other western
nations, and have a much longer summer break, which impacts education.
For what? How many of those kids are off on the farms? If you run a
school where a significant number of the kids are working on farms,
then adjust your local school year for it. But the fact is the vast
majority of students have nothing at all to do with farming and it is
silly to schedule the school year around agricultural needs in the
modern age.

The reason it doesn't change is political. People are used to the
long summer breaks and balk at changing that.

-MZ
--
URL:mailto:megazoneatmegazone.org Gweep, Discordian, Author, Engineer, me.
"A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men" 508-852-2171
URL:http://www.megazone.org/ URL:http://www.eyrie-productions.com/ Eris

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

So what? The rest of the world doesn't screw up the entire
educational system to handle what is a very small minority. US
students spend less time in school than most of the other western
nations, and have a much longer summer break, which impacts education.
For what? How many of those kids are off on the farms? If you run a
school where a significant number of the kids are working on farms,
then adjust your local school year for it. But the fact is the vast
majority of students have nothing at all to do with farming and it is
silly to schedule the school year around agricultural needs in the
modern age.

The reason it doesn't change is political. People are used to the
long summer breaks and balk at changing that.

Hmm, there's much truth to that, though I don't see that it's political.
Inertia? Maybe. Though that doesn't explain changing it. The
*admitted* arguments are child safety (whether you think it actually
applies or not) and energy savings. I agree that the child safety issue
is fairly arbitrary, though I would say it would be awkward to change
the *time* of the school day during the year without changing everyone
else's schedule as well, which is basically what DST does.

There are some real energy savings though, several studies have shown
that (sorry, I don't have references, feel free to discount it). People
don't shift their sleep schedules to daylight anymore like they did
before A/C, electric lights, etc. So if we screw around with the clock
so that people use less electricity it's probably a good thing.
Anything to keep gas and heating oil prices down. I feel sorry for the
Midwesterners this winter who will find their heating bills go up 70%!
Fortunately, here in FL, my utility bills go *down* in the Winter, not up.

Randy S.

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

In article , Dave Hinz
wrote:

On Thu, 3 Nov 2005 20:18:46 +0000 (UTC), MegaZone
wrote:

It is all artificial anyway, I'd rather seen them dump the whole thing
and just keep the clocks the same all year. The system was originally
mainly for farming and keeping daylight during the work day, which has
little bearing on the vast majority of the modern world.

News flash: farmers don't work by the clock, they work by daylight.
Whoever told you it was about farmers was wrong. The cows don't care
that the clock shifted an hour, the get milked when they need to.

Hell, the same thing with the US school year - it was designed around
the planting and harvesting seasons when the kids would be out of
school, helping out on the farm. That could use an overhaul to bring
us to the level of most of the rest of the world too.

You are aware that farms do still exist, right? I mean, you eat and
everything; where do you think the food comes from?

Political crap, all of it.

There's crap involved, that's for sure.


The summer break has nothing to do with farming and the need for
workhands. If it did, the kids would be off during planting and
harvest time, and in school during the summer. Summer farm work is
routine. The reason schools were closed during the summer was because
of the heat and, in some places, a fear of hot-weather epidemics.

Farmers do work by daylight, but the truckers and market people they
deal with don't. Farmers have to adapt to their schedules, or *they*
don't eat. Also, virtually every farm family has one or more members
who have regular, non-ag jobs in addition to their farm work. Bluntly,
they need the steady income to protect themselves against the boom-bust
farm cycle. The clock change affects their schedules for the worse,
particularly in the morning.

I don't farm but my neighbor's a dairy farmer. He tries not to let DST
bother him too much.

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

On 2005-11-03, Dave Hinz wrote:
On Thu, 3 Nov 2005 20:18:46 +0000 (UTC), MegaZone wrote:

It is all artificial anyway, I'd rather seen them dump the whole thing
and just keep the clocks the same all year. The system was originally
mainly for farming and keeping daylight during the work day, which has
little bearing on the vast majority of the modern world.

News flash: farmers don't work by the clock, they work by daylight.
Whoever told you it was about farmers was wrong. The cows don't care
that the clock shifted an hour, the get milked when they need to.

That's just not accurate at all. Farmers absolutely work by the clock and
not by daylight. The cows don't care about the clocks but farmers do.
They get milked when it's time to milk (as judged by the clock) and not
"when they need to".

--
This is my .sig

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

On Thu, 3 Nov 2005 22:32:57 +0000 (UTC), MegaZone wrote:
Dave Hinz shaped the electrons to say:
You are aware that farms do still exist, right? I mean, you eat and
everything; where do you think the food comes from?

So what? The rest of the world doesn't screw up the entire
educational system to handle what is a very small minority.

You obviously missed my point about farmers working by daylight, not by
what the clock says.

US
students spend less time in school than most of the other western
nations, and have a much longer summer break, which impacts education.
For what? How many of those kids are off on the farms? If you run a
school where a significant number of the kids are working on farms,
then adjust your local school year for it. But the fact is the vast
majority of students have nothing at all to do with farming and it is
silly to schedule the school year around agricultural needs in the
modern age.

OK, take that up with someone else. I was pointing out that the farm
argument is a bogus one, not defending it. If you read my post a bit
more carefully you would see that.

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 00:24:25 -0000, Mike Hunt wrote:
On 2005-11-03, Dave Hinz wrote:

News flash: farmers don't work by the clock, they work by daylight.
Whoever told you it was about farmers was wrong. The cows don't care
that the clock shifted an hour, the get milked when they need to.

That's just not accurate at all. Farmers absolutely work by the clock and
not by daylight. The cows don't care about the clocks but farmers do.
They get milked when it's time to milk (as judged by the clock) and not
"when they need to".

Let me rephrase. Farmers do what needs to be done when it needs to be
done, regardless of if the clock tells them it's 7:am or 8:am. Clearer
now?

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

On 2005-11-04, Dave Hinz wrote:
On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 00:24:25 -0000, Mike Hunt wrote:
On 2005-11-03, Dave Hinz wrote:

News flash: farmers don't work by the clock, they work by daylight.
Whoever told you it was about farmers was wrong. The cows don't care
that the clock shifted an hour, the get milked when they need to.

That's just not accurate at all. Farmers absolutely work by the clock and
not by daylight. The cows don't care about the clocks but farmers do.
They get milked when it's time to milk (as judged by the clock) and not
"when they need to".

Let me rephrase. Farmers do what needs to be done when it needs to be
done, regardless of if the clock tells them it's 7:am or 8:am. Clearer
now?

That's true.

However, it's common for the farmers to start milking at the same time
every day regardless of the sun, so on the days following the time shift,
the cows will get milked one hour later or earlier. It's not uncommon for
the farmer to start half an hour off the following day and get back to the
"normal" time the second day after the time shift, easing the cows through
the transition a little bit.

If it's time to cut hay or pick corn, they'll go do that no matter what
time it is, even if it's dark (farmers have caught on to the new invention
called headlights and such so daylight doesn't much matter)

I can't think of any farming activities which require daylight.

--
This is my .sig

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 01:46:36 -0000, Mike Hunt wrote:
On 2005-11-04, Dave Hinz wrote:

Let me rephrase. Farmers do what needs to be done when it needs to be
done, regardless of if the clock tells them it's 7:am or 8:am. Clearer
now?

That's true.

However, it's common for the farmers to start milking at the same time
every day regardless of the sun, so on the days following the time shift,
the cows will get milked one hour later or earlier. It's not uncommon for
the farmer to start half an hour off the following day and get back to the
"normal" time the second day after the time shift, easing the cows through
the transition a little bit.

Hm, guys I know just adjust their schedule to the cows by that hour.
But, it sounds like we're essentially in agreement that daylight savings
time and farming have little to do with each other?

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

In article [email protected], "Nog" wrote:

"GMAN" wrote in message
...
In article , "wkearney99"
wrote:
(me remembering plenty of older systems that vendors abandonded for
the last daylight savings time change 20 years ago).

Yes, me too. Congress has no idea how much they're going to **** up with
this utterly stupid idea.

If it saves just a few kids lives so that they are not walking to school
in
the freakin dark, I'm all for it. They are more important than our goddamn
electronics gear!!!!

Who cares if they walk to school in the dark. The child molesters aren't up
yet. And don't they play in the dark after school anyway? When the molesters
start coming out? Just start school an hour later if you are worried. But
who the hell needs daylight at five ****ing o'clock in the morning??? Some
states like Arizona stay on daylight savings time year round and don't play
with the clocks twice a year. Good example for us all.


They also are blessed with more sunlight due to their being farther south.

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

snp
Well, if you really want to save children's lives all you have to do is
take
them out of the real world and say.. lock them in a closet. I seriously
doubt saving kids lives has anything to do with the change. That is just
an
excuse.. use kids, old people, pets and minorities and you have a
sympathetic audience every time. After all, who doesn't want to help
these
groups of people? Need it or not!


This has nothing to do with kids' safety. The recreation industry
presuaded Congress that consumers spend more money on hotels,
vacations, amusement parks, etc., when DST is in effect. The new law
is a compromise; the industry wanted DST expanded by eight weeks, not
four.

In fact, DST should have been contracted in the fall, not expanded.
It's dark in the morning in late October. DST used to end near the
beginning of the month, which worked fine.

OK.. that answer I believe..

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

It's actually daylight saving (not savings) time, for what the proper
spelling is worth, as we all know what it means!

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

FMV wrote:

It's actually daylight saving (not savings) time, for what
the proper spelling is worth, as we all know what it means!

Yes, that's a pet peeve of mine. Another annoyance is the fact that
it really should be called "daylight-saving time" (with a hyphen), but
it isn't.

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

In article , David Levy
wrote:

FMV wrote:

It's actually daylight saving (not savings) time, for what
the proper spelling is worth, as we all know what it means!

Yes, that's a pet peeve of mine. Another annoyance is the fact that
it really should be called "daylight-saving time" (with a hyphen), but
it isn't.


As to "annoyance," I think that's the fifth or sixth time it's been
mentioned here that the proper term is "daylight saving" and not
"daylight savings." (Insert Shatneresque comment here.)

Daylight savings change in 2007
 

Uhhh....isn't the new rule just adding ~3 weeks to the time they have
to walk to school in the dark?

Mike
O-