ITV, Channel 4, and five, digital recording
 

I am intrigued about the legalities of this...

It has been accepted for some time that recordings of TV programs for
personal use are legal..In fact a large business of VCR and PVR manufacture
has developed on the back of this.

Is there anything which changes this in the new digital age? Or are all you
Pace Twin / Tivo / ???? users actually breaking the law?


I live in an area where Freeview reception is not reliable, so the advice
from Tessa Jowell down is - use SKY.


I do not want to use VHS as my recording mechanism ... as this represents a
backward step, and I do not want to be forced into a silly priced contract
for SKY plus.

So I seem to be forced into a situation of building some form of home-brew
solution.

I can see how this could be done - quite cheaply and efficiently for the BBC
channels - using a simple PC, equipped with a Satellite card.

Does anyone produce a Satellite PC card to allow the decoding of ITV,
Channel 4 and five?

If not, how difficult would it be to save the incoming raw data stream to
disc and decode it later... as I am not too bothered about watching the
stream in real-time.


Please note, I am not interested in decoding anything apart from ITV,
Channel 4, and five.

Would such a solution, if it is possible, be legal?


Or is there a FREESAT (not freeview) solution which incorporates a digital
recorder (at a reasonable price)?


John

In article ,
John Beeston wrote:
I am intrigued about the legalities of this...

It has been accepted for some time that recordings of TV programs for
personal use are legal..In fact a large business of VCR and PVR manufacture
has developed on the back of this.

AIUI it was not lawful until the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988
made it lawful to record (make a copy of) a broadcast for the purposes
of time shifting.

See http://www.hmso.gov.uk/acts/acts1988...80048_en_1.htm.
See in particular Section 70.

Is there anything which changes this in the new digital age? Or are all you
Pace Twin / Tivo / ???? users actually breaking the law?

Nothing new is needed for digital (probably). Copying is (usually)
copying regardless of the medium, even though copying techniques may
change and make copying things easier (or, even, more difficult).
Interpretation of what is a copy may need updating in the light of
the web, for example, but the courts update interpretations anyway as
society changes.

However, if it's a copy of a broadcast for the purpose of time shifting
(however you do it) that's OK according to my (non-legal) interpretation.

--
John Phillips (IANAL)

"John Phillips" wrote in message
...

AIUI it was not lawful until the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988
made it lawful to record (make a copy of) a broadcast for the purposes
of time shifting.

See http://www.hmso.gov.uk/acts/acts1988...80048_en_1.htm.
See in particular Section 70.


That seems pretty plain ... the recording of ITV, Channel 4 and five for
time shifting purposes is legal.

Given that the BskyB broadcast is the only one I can receive reliably in
digital form ... and that that is the Government approved route for such a
broadcast

How then to record such a program in it's digital form ... ?

John Beeston wrote:


Does anyone produce a Satellite PC card to allow the decoding of ITV,
Channel 4 and five?

No. They use Sky's 'closed' encryption system VideoGuard, only a Sky
Digibox with a valid viewing card can decode them.

Does anyone produce a Satellite PC card to allow the decoding of ITV,
Channel 4 and five?

No, but sick around. ITV are in talks with the BBC in setting up
FreeSat (not the Sky version) which would make ITV available, and
presumably C4 & C5 will follow.

S.

In article , Stuart
writes
Does anyone produce a Satellite PC card to allow the decoding of ITV,
Channel 4 and five?

No, but sick around. ITV are in talks with the BBC in setting up
FreeSat (not the Sky version) which would make ITV available, and
presumably C4 & C5 will follow.

S.

Yes about time that you could receive the nation channels by a standard
digital box. All in all using national sat for distribution might be a
cheaper way then all of the relays that will have to be modified to DTV
etc.

Apart from this perhaps if the BBC had their own sat they might TX the
radio at bitrates more suitable for the 21 st century;)

One can only hope.....
--
Tony Sayer

Stuart wrote:
: No, but sick around. ITV are in talks with the BBC in setting up
: FreeSat (not the Sky version) which would make ITV available, and
: presumably C4 & C5 will follow.

Not quite in accord with previous postings!

ITV seem to be making a purely commercial decision about encryption WITHOUT
any bias for or against Freesat - it WILL cost them, more for programme rights.
C4 and C5 have ~5 year contracts in place with Sky.

"Stuart" wrote in message
...
Does anyone produce a Satellite PC card to allow the decoding of ITV,
Channel 4 and five?

No, but sick around. ITV are in talks with the BBC in setting up FreeSat (not
the Sky version) which would make ITV available, and presumably C4 & C5 will
follow.

C4 signed a new five year deal last summer, so you may have to wait some time.


Az.

Brian McIlwrath wrote:
Stuart wrote:
: No, but sick around. ITV are in talks with the BBC in setting up
: FreeSat (not the Sky version) which would make ITV available, and
: presumably C4 & C5 will follow.

Not quite in accord with previous postings!

ITV seem to be making a purely commercial decision about encryption WITHOUT
any bias for or against Freesat - it WILL cost them, more for programme rights.
C4 and C5 have ~5 year contracts in place with Sky.

There's another factor, also mentioned in this group previously.

If ITV did go FTA, there would be no guarantee (for their advertisers)
that the correct region was being viewed in the correct area. On a non
Sky receiver it would be up to the user to set whatever version of ITV-1
they wished on a preset. Also a Sky box without a viewing card would
have to default to a single region on Ch 103 (in much the same way BBC 1
London does to Ch 101)

This would be a big issue, not only for ITV, but also Channel 4 (their
D-Sat broadcasts are split into six different regions). I suspect Five
are also keen to have regionally targeted ads on D-Sat one day.

It matters less for the BBC, as regionalisation is purely for the
benefit of the viewer, and any region is available to all via the Sky EPG.

"Nigel M" wrote in message
...
In uk.tech.digital-tv, John Phillips wrote:

AIUI it was not lawful until the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988
made it lawful to record (make a copy of) a broadcast for the purposes
of time shifting.

Which of course means that it is not legal to keep them once watched.


How exactly does that work then?

One records a program as all members of the household wish to watch... Can
this then be legally stored until all interested parties have applied their
own time-shift?

Who has the responsibility to keep the records as to who has watched it
when?

What happens if some members of the family see it more than once ?

And how can anyone check?

Methinks this may be a tad silly.


John