Slightly off topic: LCD TVs and stuck pixels
 

I keep fancying an LCD TV to go with my Freeview box. Being the proud owner
of a 20 inch iMac with a single bright-green stuck pixel (not untypical on
computer monitors), I wondered what the incidence of this is on LCD TVs. Do
TV makers maintain, like computer monitor makers, that a few stuck pixels is
just hard luck?

Androo

Androo wrote:

I keep fancying an LCD TV to go with my Freeview box. Being the proud owner
of a 20 inch iMac with a single bright-green stuck pixel (not untypical on
computer monitors), I wondered what the incidence of this is on LCD TVs. Do
TV makers maintain, like computer monitor makers, that a few stuck pixels is
just hard luck?

Androo


Yup. frankly, it's a cop-out, IMO. The manufacturing process isn't
correct Mr Customer, so we'll fob you off with a lame excuse. My new
plasma had a duff pixel and the dealer sorted it out for me. Believe, if
you think that a PC screen with a dead pixel is irritating, try it on a
42-inch plasma.

I don't care what the manufacturers say: If I buy something with a fault
like that, I'll return for a refund/replacement. If the production
process produces panels with duff pixels, fix the manufacturing process,
don't expect the customer to be happy!


Clem

Agreed, don't buy it/take it back. I've not had any on either Panny LCD TV
(yet) ...

"Clem Dye" wrote in message
...

Yup. frankly, it's a cop-out, IMO. The manufacturing process isn't
correct Mr Customer, so we'll fob you off with a lame excuse. My new
plasma had a duff pixel and the dealer sorted it out for me. Believe, if
you think that a PC screen with a dead pixel is irritating, try it on a
42-inch plasma.

I don't care what the manufacturers say: If I buy something with a fault
like that, I'll return for a refund/replacement. If the production
process produces panels with duff pixels, fix the manufacturing process,
don't expect the customer to be happy!


Clem


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Clem Dye wrote in message ...

I don't care what the manufacturers say: If I buy something with a fault
like that, I'll return for a refund/replacement. If the production
process produces panels with duff pixels, fix the manufacturing process,
don't expect the customer to be happy!


If you learn a little about the manufacturing process you will see why
this is unreasonable.

Alex

Clem Dye wrote in message ...

I don't care what the manufacturers say: If I buy something with a fault
like that, I'll return for a refund/replacement. If the production
process produces panels with duff pixels, fix the manufacturing process,
don't expect the customer to be happy!


If you learn a little about the manufacturing process you will see why
this is unreasonable.

Alex

Alex Bird wrote:
Clem Dye wrote in message
...

I don't care what the manufacturers say: If I buy something with a
fault like that, I'll return for a refund/replacement. If the
production process produces panels with duff pixels, fix the
manufacturing process, don't expect the customer to be happy!


If you learn a little about the manufacturing process you will see why
this is unreasonable.

What other electronic goods are sold with the expectation that they may well
be faulty?
Also how many shops , online or otherwise , make this policy clear before
you have already bought the goods , got them home and discovered the
problem?

--
Alex

"We are now up against live, hostile targets"

"So, if Little Red Riding Hood should show up with a bazooka and a bad
attitude, I expect you to chin the bitch! "

www.drzoidberg.co.uk
www.ebayfaq.co.uk

"Dr Zoidberg" wrote in message
...

What other electronic goods are sold with the expectation that they may
well
be faulty?
Also how many shops , online or otherwise , make this policy clear before
you have already bought the goods , got them home and discovered the
problem?

--
Alex


i totally agree, but i think that if you're spending that kind of money,
you're expected to know a decent amount about the technology.

The manufacturing process for these panels isn't perfect yet. Until it is,
the choices are to bin bad screens, making the cost of the good ones soar,
or sell the ones with the odd dead/undead pixel. For pc screens at least,
you can pay a little extra for hand-picked units with no dead pixels,
guaranteed, and a guarantee against pixels dying. I'd imagine you can do
likewise with living room sets.

In message , Dr Zoidberg
wrote

Also how many shops , online or otherwise , make this policy clear before
you have already bought the goods , got them home and discovered the
problem?


http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport...jsp?objectID=l
pv19054&locale=en_US
--
Alan

On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 22:25:24 +0100, mrlipring wrote:


"Dr Zoidberg" wrote in message
...

What other electronic goods are sold with the expectation that they may
well
be faulty?
Also how many shops , online or otherwise , make this policy clear
before you have already bought the goods , got them home and discovered
the problem?

--
Alex


i totally agree, but i think that if you're spending that kind of money,
you're expected to know a decent amount about the technology.

The manufacturing process for these panels isn't perfect yet. Until it is,
the choices are to bin bad screens, making the cost of the good ones soar,
or sell the ones with the odd dead/undead pixel. For pc screens at least,
you can pay a little extra for hand-picked units with no dead pixels,
guaranteed, and a guarantee against pixels dying. I'd imagine you can do
likewise with living room sets.

Or hand pick it yourself in the shop.

Alex Bird wrote:

Clem Dye wrote in message
...

I don't care what the manufacturers say: If I buy something with a fault
like that, I'll return for a refund/replacement. If the production
process produces panels with duff pixels, fix the manufacturing process,
don't expect the customer to be happy!


If you learn a little about the manufacturing process you will see why
this is unreasonable.

Alex

Have to disagree - if the manufacturing can't produce consistent results,
then it isnt't ready for mass-market retail.

--
+---+
| n | www.n-gate.net
+---+

In message , Angus Marshall
wrote
Alex Bird wrote:

Clem Dye wrote in message
...

I don't care what the manufacturers say: If I buy something with a fault
like that, I'll return for a refund/replacement. If the production
process produces panels with duff pixels, fix the manufacturing process,
don't expect the customer to be happy!


If you learn a little about the manufacturing process you will see why
this is unreasonable.

Alex

Have to disagree - if the manufacturing can't produce consistent results,
then it isnt't ready for mass-market retail.


It does produce _consistent_ results. The number of defects is
statistically constant and is small with respect to the number of
pixels. The average person is probably not willing to pay the price for
the zero defect product especially as they will not even notice 99.9999%
of these defects.

Consider a couple of other products that are not ready for the mass
market...

How many Freeview boxes have required an upgrade?

How many defect fixes do Microsoft produce every month?


--
Alan

On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 01:55:53 +0100, Alan
wrote:

It does produce _consistent_ results. The number of defects is
statistically constant and is small with respect to the number of
pixels. The average person is probably not willing to pay the price for
the zero defect product especially as they will not even notice 99.9999%
of these defects.

In the case of stuck pixels, surely they *would* notice 100% of the
defects, they tend to stand out like sore thumbs.
--
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Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim messages to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking a question.

Alan wrote:
In message , Angus Marshall
wrote
Alex Bird wrote:

Clem Dye wrote in message
...

I don't care what the manufacturers say: If I buy something with a
fault like that, I'll return for a refund/replacement. If the
production process produces panels with duff pixels, fix the
manufacturing process, don't expect the customer to be happy!


If you learn a little about the manufacturing process you will see
why this is unreasonable.

Alex

Have to disagree - if the manufacturing can't produce consistent
results, then it isnt't ready for mass-market retail.


It does produce _consistent_ results. The number of defects is
statistically constant and is small with respect to the number of
pixels. The average person is probably not willing to pay the price
for the zero defect product especially as they will not even notice
99.9999% of these defects.

Consider a couple of other products that are not ready for the mass
market...

How many Freeview boxes have required an upgrade?

How many defect fixes do Microsoft produce every month?

How many defective TFTs/Plasmas can be upgraded to fix dead/stuck pixels?



--
Alex

"We are now up against live, hostile targets"

"So, if Little Red Riding Hood should show up with a bazooka and a bad
attitude, I expect you to chin the bitch! "

www.drzoidberg.co.uk
www.ebayfaq.co.uk

In message , Dr Zoidberg
wrote


Consider a couple of other products that are not ready for the mass
market...

How many Freeview boxes have required an upgrade?

How many defect fixes do Microsoft produce every month?

How many defective TFTs/Plasmas can be upgraded to fix dead/stuck pixels?


About the same number as operating systems that Microsoft seem to fix
with a bug fix :).

For the list of around 200 programs that broke when the latest M$ bug
fix came out see

http://support.microsoft.com/default...uct=windowsxps
p2

I wonder how many readers of this newsgroup are using the software at
the end of the list?

--
Alan

"Alan" wrote in message
...
In message , Dr Zoidberg
wrote



About the same number as operating systems that Microsoft seem to fix
with a bug fix :).

For the list of around 200 programs that broke when the latest M$ bug
fix came out see

http://support.microsoft.com/default...uct=windowsxps
p2

I wonder how many readers of this newsgroup are using the software at
the end of the list?

--
Alan


are these problems with windows, or badly written progs in the first place
though?

In article ,
Andrew [email protected] wrote:

In the case of stuck pixels, surely they *would* notice 100% of the
defects, they tend to stand out like sore thumbs.

That depends on the nature of the stuckness. An always-off red pixel
would probably be much less noticable than an always-on green pixel.

-- Richard

In message , mrlipring
wrote


are these problems with windows, or badly written progs in the first place
though?


You could be correct, a bug fix to a M$ operating system also breaks
badly written M$ programs including the latest versions of M$ Excel, M$
Word, M$ Powerpoint, M$ Access and M$ Office .

--
Alan

Steve wrote:
i totally agree, but i think that if you're spending that kind of money,
you're expected to know a decent amount about the technology.

Er, don't think so. Many folk spending big mony for home plasmas have
not the slightest desire or interest in the technology, they just want
the result.

The manufacturing process for these panels isn't perfect yet. Until it is,
the choices are to bin bad screens, making the cost of the good ones soar,
or sell the ones with the odd dead/undead pixel. For pc screens at least,
you can pay a little extra for hand-picked units with no dead pixels,
guaranteed, and a guarantee against pixels dying. I'd imagine you can do
likewise with living room sets.

Or hand pick it yourself in the shop.

Absolutely - ir reject it if you buy on-line. I quite take the point
about manufacturing yields, but that shouldn't be my problem as a
punter. Let the business display market take the B-stock where it's
never going to be noticed (I'm assuming this is what happens anyway).

In article , Alan
wrote:
In message , Angus Marshall
wrote

Have to disagree - if the manufacturing can't produce consistent
results, then it isnt't ready for mass-market retail.


It does produce _consistent_ results. The number of defects is
statistically constant and is small with respect to the number of
pixels. The average person is probably not willing to pay the price for
the zero defect product especially as they will not even notice 99.9999%
of these defects.

I have not purchased an LCD. But if I did, I would only buy one where all
the pixels functioned correctly. If the maker cannot sell me what I want, I
do not buy.

Consider a couple of other products that are not ready for the mass
market...

How many Freeview boxes have required an upgrade?

How do you 'upgrade' a failed pixel in an LCD screen? :-)

How many defect fixes do Microsoft produce every month?

How likely is it that I would choose to use any Microsoft products given
what I wrote above? :-)

Slainte,

Jim

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