Orange wrote:
:
: As the old ITV-Digital encryption was apparently 'compromised', wouldn't
: they have to choose a completely different and much more secure system?

ITV Digital used SECA - which was totally compromised. SECA-2 is, however,
very closely related but, AFAIK, quite secure....but see below!

: "The biggest of these is the fact that, at present, only around 800,000
: Freeview viewers - who use the old ITV Digital boxes - have the necessary
: conditional access elements and card slots required to watch pay-TV."

ITV Digital were planning to move to SECA-2 before events caught up with
them ...BUT... there is curently no mechanism for updating the software in
the old STBs!! Presumably a move to SECA-2 would need such an update.

On 3 Feb 2004 08:03:40 -0800, (Steve) wrote:

... and is in talks to join the planned pay-TV service on Freeview:

http://media.guardian.co.uk/broadcas...140103,00.html


So........if they're planning on using the old 'slot' then presumably
they're going to use the same principle for encryption. I wonder what
the potential is for a repeat of the mass piracy that ITV Digital had
to cope with?

Mind you I'm not a techie; and it's a complete mystery to me why Sky
has never been cracked when at least 90% of all the other technologies
have been cracked around the globe, but I'd be very interested to
know what the possibilities are.

On a tangent, but still a little relevant, can anyone explain in
layman's speak why Sky has proved so difficult to crack?



Peter

On 3 Feb 2004 08:03:40 -0800, (Steve) wrote:

... and is in talks to join the planned pay-TV service on Freeview:

http://media.guardian.co.uk/broadcas...140103,00.html


So........if they're planning on using the old 'slot' then presumably
they're going to use the same principle for encryption. I wonder what
the potential is for a repeat of the mass piracy that ITV Digital had
to cope with?

Mind you I'm not a techie; and it's a complete mystery to me why Sky
has never been cracked when at least 90% of all the other technologies
have been cracked around the globe, but I'd be very interested to
know what the possibilities are.

On a tangent, but still a little relevant, can anyone explain in
layman's speak why Sky has proved so difficult to crack?



Peter

On 3 Feb 2004 23:32:15 GMT, Brian McIlwrath wrote:

ITV Digital were planning to move to SECA-2 before events caught up with
them ...BUT... there is curently no mechanism for updating the software in
the old STBs!! Presumably a move to SECA-2 would need such an update.


And who has the rights to the source code to upgrade these? CANAL+,
isn't it? They're hopelessly out of date as it is with the various
MHEG and other changes.

How many OnDodgytal STBs have been junked due to the inability to
decode recent MHEG and other issues? I presume quite a few.

And where the feck are they going to get the extra bandwidth from?
Do any of the transmitters have enough space for even one extra
MUX, given the various problems with overlap?

Top-Up TV should rename themselves Tits-Up TV - as that's the
direction they'll be heading in not long after they launch, if
they ever do.

On 3 Feb 2004 23:32:15 GMT, Brian McIlwrath wrote:

ITV Digital were planning to move to SECA-2 before events caught up with
them ...BUT... there is curently no mechanism for updating the software in
the old STBs!! Presumably a move to SECA-2 would need such an update.


And who has the rights to the source code to upgrade these? CANAL+,
isn't it? They're hopelessly out of date as it is with the various
MHEG and other changes.

How many OnDodgytal STBs have been junked due to the inability to
decode recent MHEG and other issues? I presume quite a few.

And where the feck are they going to get the extra bandwidth from?
Do any of the transmitters have enough space for even one extra
MUX, given the various problems with overlap?

Top-Up TV should rename themselves Tits-Up TV - as that's the
direction they'll be heading in not long after they launch, if
they ever do.

"Steve" wrote in message
m...
... and is in talks to join the planned pay-TV service on Freeview:

http://media.guardian.co.uk/broadcas...140103,00.html


--
Steve - http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/

DAB sounds worse than Freeview, digital satellite, cable, broadband
internet and FM

Suely, if they decide to go the pay-tv route, then aren't Freeview breaking
their licence as the consortium was granted a licence to the frequencies
because they were setting up a FREE service? If people are unhappy with the
prospect of pay-tv services, they should lobby the freeview consortium for
mis-selling the service

S

"Steve" wrote in message
m...
... and is in talks to join the planned pay-TV service on Freeview:

http://media.guardian.co.uk/broadcas...140103,00.html


--
Steve - http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/

DAB sounds worse than Freeview, digital satellite, cable, broadband
internet and FM

Suely, if they decide to go the pay-tv route, then aren't Freeview breaking
their licence as the consortium was granted a licence to the frequencies
because they were setting up a FREE service? If people are unhappy with the
prospect of pay-tv services, they should lobby the freeview consortium for
mis-selling the service

S

simonbray wrote:
If people are unhappy with the prospect of pay-tv services, they
should lobby the freeview consortium for mis-selling the service


Quite the reverse, in my case. I'm looking forward to the prospect of
something decent to watch for a change. I get the impression that with
Freeview I'm very much getting what I'm paying for. bid-up TV? Sky Travel?


--
Tony

simonbray wrote:
If people are unhappy with the prospect of pay-tv services, they
should lobby the freeview consortium for mis-selling the service


Quite the reverse, in my case. I'm looking forward to the prospect of
something decent to watch for a change. I get the impression that with
Freeview I'm very much getting what I'm paying for. bid-up TV? Sky Travel?


--
Tony

If people are unhappy with the prospect of pay-tv services, they
should lobby the freeview consortium for mis-selling the service

Quite the reverse, in my case. I'm looking forward to the prospect of
something decent to watch for a change. I get the impression that with
Freeview I'm very much getting what I'm paying for. bid-up TV? Sky
Travel?

Keeping in in context, Sky travel (and the two hours of Thompson on FTN) are
the only shopping services on "freeview". BBC and CC had no involvement with
SDN's decision to broadcast shopping on its empty space. Working out the
figures that's less than 1 24-hour channel broadcasting shopping compared to
all the other TV and radio stations available on Freeview.

If the manufacturers were planning to update the box software they would
need to get the rights from Canal. The other option would be the cam slot on
the fornt of digiboxes where a piece of hardware could be added to provide a
more robust encryption as found on sky.
At present, unless they were planning to take over all the shopping channel
space on SDN and Channel 4's space there is no way they could have the room
for anything else.
Personally thanks to the software design I have removed all the shopping
channels from my system and shifted them round to make it much more
sensible - e.g.:

18 The Hits
19 TMF
20 FTN
21 UK Bright Ideas

70 1Xtra
71 Radio 1
72 Radio 2
73 Radio 3
74 Radio 4
75 Radio 5
76 6Music
77 BBC7
78 Asian
79 Live Extra
80 World


If they do update the software, will they change the menu and remove the
Ondigital logo????