Home cinema - small speaker HC recommendations

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- - small speaker HC recommendations (http://www.homecinemabanter.com/showthread.php?t=17923)

In on 21/03/2004 14:27
Nath stared into the abyss, and the abyss said:

If the subwoofer was set to 120hz- would be locizable.

Tool - do you think someone with a $100,000 system that designs amps and
subs for a living is going to set his sub at 120hz? what kind of a
****wit are you? do you even read what 's posted?

None of those settings make a blind bit of difference - I'm sure my
friend (who designs pre/pros and subwoofers for a company not
disimilar to SVS in the US) had them set up correctly. I didn't like
the sound of the SVS - doesn't mean they are crap but proves the
point that it's all subjective.

I note you never once asked about listening material or listening
experience because you're an idiot who knows **** all.

P.

If the subwoofer is setup incorrectly, then it'll sound crap
regardless of material (CD's, DVD's etc). You could deliberately fook
up your system settings and make it sound terrible (ie subwoofer +30dB
hot, etc) does that mean your equipment is rubbish? No.. but it means
any auditioning of the equipment will pretty much result in a
dissatisfied demo.

what part of "I'm sure my friend (who designs pre/pros and subwoofers
for a company not disimilar to SVS in the US) had them set up
correctly"

is beyond your comprehension? the guy is a professional audio enginer
with over 30 years experience. He started mixing soundtracks in the 60's
and 70's and then moved into audio design. He knows a damn sight more
than you'll ever know yet never mentions figures or frequency responses
or any of that cack when *listening* - he understands the customer's
requirements and he knows how to set up AV in his sleep.

Try reading the posts before giving your stock answers you cretin.

--
Patrick

Your friendly neighbourhood Trendy Uncle

what part of "I'm sure my friend (who designs pre/pros and subwoofers
for a company not disimilar to SVS in the US) had them set up
correctly"

Are you sure? Why not ask him- and copy his reply here... if he's configured
it properly it would resolve the questions I've asked.

So let me get this straight. When my friends listen (one very experienced in
audio gear) to my audio system it means jack ****. But when it comes to you-
your friends means anything? (to me)

I guess you must walk around thinking you're superior to everyone else.
About right coming from a policeman & ex-service people really. All *******.

is beyond your comprehension? the guy is a professional audio enginer
with over 30 years experience. He started mixing soundtracks in the 60's
and 70's and then moved into audio design. He knows a damn sight more
than you'll ever know yet never mentions figures or frequency responses
or any of that cack when *listening* - he understands the customer's
requirements and he knows how to set up AV in his sleep.

Patick Navin - "No relevance. I don't know him, so means diddly squat" - or
thereabouts, something you're said in the past (if I can find the thread)

In on 21/03/2004 14:56
Nath stared into the abyss, and the abyss said:
what part of "I'm sure my friend (who designs pre/pros and subwoofers
for a company not disimilar to SVS in the US) had them set up
correctly"

Are you sure? Why not ask him- and copy his reply here... if he's
configured it properly it would resolve the questions I've asked.

It's not relevant. He likes the sound of it - i didn't (for music at
least). Who's to say your idea of how to set it up is any more right
than his? Different room sizes, differnt accompanying equipment - oh
yeah and he hasn't got his bed or his teddy bear in the way.

So let me get this straight. When my friends listen (one very
experienced in audio gear) to my audio system it means jack ****. But
when it comes to you- your friends means anything? (to me)

Fool we're talking about the setup not the listening experience. I'm
sure your system sounds great, but you continually make out as if yours
is the only system thatever does. If your friends think your system
sounds great then they are right - it sounds great *to them*. I et they
don't constantly harp on about frequency extension figures though.

I guess you must walk around thinking you're superior to everyone else.
About right coming from a policeman & ex-service people really. All
*******.

So cynical and so young. So you know loads of policeman and ex-
servicemen do you? whathave you ever done for your country or society
you leech?

is beyond your comprehension? the guy is a professional audio enginer
with over 30 years experience. He started mixing soundtracks in the
60's and 70's and then moved into audio design. He knows a damn sight
more than you'll ever know yet never mentions figures or frequency
responses or any of that cack when *listening* - he understands the
customer's requirements and he knows how to set up AV in his sleep.

Patick Navin - "No relevance. I don't know him, so means diddly squat" -
or thereabouts, something you're said in the past (if I can find the
thread)

i haven't asked you to take his subjective opinion of sound quality into
account - i've simply pointed out that his experience suggests he can at
least set the stuff up properly. If you fail to even comprehend that
they you really are the stupidst person alive. Just like you can't tell
the difference between reference figures and the listening experience
you can't tell the difference between telling whether someone can
technically achieve a given outcome and their own undestanding and
appreciation of the subjective matter.
Idiot.

--
Patrick

Your friendly neighbourhood Trendy Uncle

It's not relevant. He likes the sound of it - i didn't (for music at
least). Who's to say your idea of how to set it up is any more right
than his? Different room sizes, differnt accompanying equipment

I can understand why you might not like the SVS for music- you have a
"musical" opinion- I'm not disagreeing with you on that- as we all have
difference preference for music.. not only hardware but also musical tastes
and speaker reproduction (I am however disagreeing with you regarding the
Rel Storm is superior than the PC Plus for home theatre) the Rel doesn't
have high enough output/clean output/LF handling to do the job within "safe
limits" in some modern action films. The only way I could use the Rel safely
for these films was to enable & setup the MC-1's subwoofer peak limiter
feature.

If you set the SVS subwoofer incorrectly it is not performing as it should
be.. for example would you send full-range audio directly to a Bose
Jewel/Cube sat? No. Email Tom from SVS and ask about setting the SS filter
to 12hz in a 25hz PC Plus model, with three ports open, near reference in a
large room. He'll give you a detailed explanation of why this isn't
recommended, and what (exactly) happens when this is done.
And if your mate knows about stuff- then should know the same.
Not that your mate has it setup incorrectly, but some people do. BTW I have
my 20 PC Plus in stock tune (no ports blocked), xover disabled, SS set to
20hz, sending it LFE via RCA. If I block one port (as done in the past) I
had the SS set to 16hz, and re-calibrated as the subwoofer's output is
reduced by a few dB.

I do not know the exact technical reasons of SVS (SS/port tune) incorrect
setup (know a little bit), but I know it shouldn't be done. A bit like
setting contrast in a CRT/Plasma to 100%. Someone might think it's "right"
but PQ will suffer, and damage to the guns or Plasma will occur. Doesn't
matter if it's in different room sizes, different accompanying equipment-
you'll still ruin the set..

Fool we're talking about the setup not the listening experience.

You can come back with his setup method..if he's set it up right then (and
heard it) then you've valid points of any listening experience AFTER the
system is setup right.

I'm
sure your system sounds great, but you continually make out as if yours
is the only system thatever does.

Nope. My system is not the best, nor does it sound the best (far from ideal
room) Although probably mine would sound better than a better system if
you've fooked the settings up deliberately to make it sound bad (ie any crap
echoey DSP mode etc). And vice versa.

If your friends think your system
sounds great then they are right - it sounds great *to them*. I et they
don't constantly harp on about frequency extension figures though.

Not constantly ;-) but they know what is good (ie for a subwoofer) and what
isn't.

So cynical and so young. So you know loads of policeman and ex-
servicemen do you? whathave you ever done for your country or society
you leech?

I have opened eyes. People who have been in the service are totally
different types of people than those in civilian life. It appears that the
training you take effects you (not just shut it off when you leave the base
etc)

I have paid import tax, VAT on every item I've bought, and N.I ...like 99%
of the population. This isn't good enough for you? What a surprise.

I don't classify invading another country, stealing their treasures and
reserves, killing civilians and imprison innocent's and then breaking the
geneva convention as the right thing to do. I guess the servicemen should be
proud of they follow orders from a aggressive western society.

i haven't asked you to take his subjective opinion of sound quality into
account - i've simply pointed out that his experience suggests he can at
least set the stuff up properly.

Perhaps. Perhaps not. I think I'm pretty experienced in audio gear.. I've
just recently found out that most newer DVD's have Cinema Re-Equaliazation
already done at mixing. The default setting for Logic 7 Film is with Re-Eq
on. So I switched it off. Slightly more detail in the treble (not harsh
though) A simple mistake on my part for leaving it as the default setting
for a while... could be done by anyone.

Learning new stuff all the time. Does your friend know everything? How can
you be so sure?

If you fail to even comprehend that
they you really are the stupidst person alive. Just like you can't tell
the difference between reference figures and the listening experience
you can't tell the difference between telling whether someone can
technically achieve a given outcome and their own undestanding and
appreciation of the subjective matter.
Idiot.

All the knowledge and intelligence in the world does not mean you have
common sense. I have seen that first hand from a friend that is very
intelligent & knowledgeable (degree in astrophysics, quantum mechanics
etc).. come to something blindingly obvious and they won't see it... until I
mention it and they go "oh yeah why didn't I think/see of that?"

Oh if you think I carry on about THD, freq. response etc.. have a look here
;-)

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htfo...hreadid=190281

If you notice he's got a SVS 1x driver sub, the SVS 2x driver sub, and a
HSU. I might love HT but wouldn't consider going to all the trouble.

I've bought three subwoofers so far... Rel Storm... crappy Yamaha (now
sold)... and a SVS.. hardly extreme.

Nath wrote:
Oh if you think I carry on about THD, freq. response etc.. have a
look here ;-)

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htfo...hreadid=190281

Just the fact that you bother to rad forums like that proves you are as anal
as the guy you're quoting (i've not clicked the link - one **** going on
about THD and graphs is bad enough)

If you notice he's got a SVS 1x driver sub, the SVS 2x driver sub,
and a HSU. I might love HT but wouldn't consider going to all the
trouble.

I've bought three subwoofers so far... Rel Storm... crappy Yamaha (now
sold)... and a SVS.. hardly extreme.

No-one's said that owning 3 subs is extreme - hell Tony W has owned 'em
all. The difference with you Nath is that you seem to need to constantly
bang on about numbers, about your SVS and about AV in general in a fashion
that both makes you look like a total tool and which holds no interest for
people who know how to use AV kit.

I've said it to you before - listen to the music and stop listening to the
kit - that way you wont find the need to constantly justify your purchases
and make yourself look a prick on usenet day in day out.

P.

The Storm can't handle what I listen to on these DVD's (and not that loud)
it can't handle slightly-louder-than normal level.. this is way below
reference.

please define reference? One would expect an average listening volume of
between 70 and 80dbA at listening position, I know my system will manage
that nicely. My preferred way (if not the book way) to initially set up a
system is for the test-tone at 70dbA from the fronts, rears (monopole) to
give 67-68dbA at same listening position, centre to give 70dbA, sub brought
up until it sounds right. You cannot set a true sub (0.1 only) with a meter.
Also I have noticed that a lot of programme material varies as to the
content of the .1 channel - and settings therefore often need tweaking...

Mine's never blown up. And I reckon I've probably set up bigger systems than
you (but I could be wrong) for listening by more people than you. And if you
can't hear when your sub's about to blow you must be deaf from listening too
loud.

Nath wrote:
None of us are banned form AVForums because
we're too immature to accpt alternative points of view exist and
that a difference of opinion can often just be left at that.

Do you actually know the thread that I was banned for?

Wasn't it everyone you took part in.

--
ThePunisher

"Tim S Kemp" wrote in message
...

The Storm can't handle what I listen to on these DVD's (and not that
loud)
it can't handle slightly-louder-than normal level.. this is way below
reference.

please define reference?

According to Dolby- set 75dB to all (or if using Avia-85db), and in use set
master to 00dB. That is reference. Maximum SPL output is 115dB peaks to 5.0
speakers, 125dB to subwoofer peaks (if all speakers are set to small 80hz).
115dB peaks to subwoofer if others are set to Large. Which is way too
loud..much louder than my normal listening volume (listen to -30 to -20
below reference)... hardly any subs can handle that - cleanly.(or even 10-20
dB lower than that)

And if you
can't hear when your sub's about to blow you must be deaf from listening
too
loud.

I can, that's why I had to use the subwoofer peak limiter on the MC-1 with
the Rel (still way under reference) If I didn't notice it (before I got the
MC-1) I would have knackered the sub, but I didn't ;-)

SVS handles the same SPL + more, so disabling Sub peak is safe.

You cannot set a true sub (0.1 only) with a meter.
Also I have noticed that a lot of programme material varies as to the
content of the .1 channel - and settings therefore often need tweaking...

I believe the RS meter is off by 3dB.. so if 75dB to all, 72dB to subwoofer.
Or for you- try 67dB to subwoofer. Yeah noticed some are "hot" -bloody
annoying- I don't want to increase/decrease subwoofer per film! :-X Perhaps
Titan AE & Toy Story are a few dB hot- but why should I have to decrease by
3 or 6dB for them two films? Why not just buy a subwoofer that can handle
the extra bass? ;-)